69 Camaro, Motor Mount/ LS1

[bigtyme1]

What's the proper Combo, I have a S&P plates, factory motor mounts and frame mouts. The problem is the motor mount to the frame mount. I have a 1/2 gap where the mounts bolts through. Should I use washers to take up the slack or do I need different motor mounts? Also the headers are tight, about 1/8" from the power steering box.

[rich-allen]

I bought the ATS mounts. Don't have them installed yet but I hear they allow everything to bolt upo perfect.

I catch a post now and then where people has problems with the S&P mounts. Sorry, I'm not sure what the issues are.

The ATS mounts are quality.

Rich

[rich-allen]

I wouldn't use washers to take up the difference. I would call S&P or Tyler.
I think your power steering box is going to get way too hot with the header that close. I could be wrong..... I do see cars that people actually dent the header pipe to clear the PS unit.

Tyler can tell you exactly what you need

[bigtyme1]

Thanks Allen, the problem is not with the S&P mount, Its with the motor mount it self. for some reason it's 1/2 wider then the frame mount. I think there wad a differance in 69/68. I'm checking with a few guys that have done this mod. one seams to think I have 68 mounts but the 69 would take the motor higher and posibly hit the fire wall. Here is some better pictures

[rich-allen]

I wish my car was in the garage so I could measure mine.


Rich

[rich-allen]

The ATS website says:


ATS tackled this obstacle by machining a set of aluminum engine adapters to locate the older style three-bolt engine mounts, to the modern four-bolt engine block. By flipping the engine mounts upside down, the LSX sits lower in the chassis, and as far back against the firewall as possible to promote good weight distribution and improve center of gravity.

[Datsbad]

there are different frame mounts for sure.
Some are taller and skinner and some are lower and wider.

If the motor moves up it will give you more header clearance.

What headers do you have? Look to be stainless? If they are stainless works I had this problem on Fuel. Had to dent the header to clear the box for more room so the box doesnt get as hot.
You cant leave it like that , the PS fluid will be hot!
What size header tubes are they ?

The S&P mounts are great , no problem with them.

[bigtyme1]

we noticed something else today, the motor is sitting off angle. the front of the motor needs to move to the right side a little. The frame mounts I have are tall and skinny. I'm going to try the lower and wider ones. Should I be using big block mounts?

[youthpastor]

maybe I am over-thinking this-but

1) clearance the header for steering box

2) Small block mounts are right- everything is right, I would try a different 3 bolt mount- they are all the same, but manufactures are different, mine are cheapo ones and they fit great on the stands

3) is there any way to (run 'em home with an impact) I would only do this if there was 1/4 clearance- 1/2 is too excessive

hopes this helps

all your application stuff is right- i would just try a different 3 bolt mounts

DO NOT go with BBlk stands, just cause you other issues- Chris:thumbsup:

[bigtyme1]

Jason, Do you remember what combination you used on Fuel? I was looking at the pictures today.

[Vegas69]

There were three widths of mounts in 1968/1969 along with three different heights. Measure your engine mounts and see which engine stand is the proper width and height. This helped me tremendously when I had to change mounts. http://pozziracing.com/camaro_engine.htm I needed all the tunnel clearance, air cleaner, etc I could get with my 1/2 height body bushings. The 302/350 mounts are the shortest. 307 mounts are about 3/8 of an inch taller which would give you more header clearance. The big block mounts are in between and not your best bet. Whatever you do make sure you buy the right stands to match the engine mounts. You need to measure the motor mount length and the frame stand lenght to come up with the total number.

[bigtyme1]

Funny, I read that same article this afternoon. I bought this car from Carlisle PA, and I know it was thrown togethor for a quick sale. What I have discovered today is I have a set of missed match frame mounts. one is ( Right2 1/4 to the center of the hole and the other is ( Left)1 7/8.

[trapin]

bigtyme,

Either you have the wrong motor mounts or the wrong frame mounts. I have the small block (327) mounts on my frame and with the S&P conversion plates and stock motor mounts they fit a lot more snug than that. I would cross reference those parts again to make absolutely sure you have what you think you have. Unless all this is different for the '69, which I don't see why it would be.

As for your header problem, what brand headers are those and what part number? You have to get the specific headers from Stainless Works to clear the stock steering box with the S&P plates.

The part number is..."CALS1SB" for the regular finish and "CALS1SBP" for the hand polished. These are specifically designed to work around the stock steering box USING the S&P plates. Some pics for reference. Header #1 looks like it's close to the power steering box but it's really not. It's just the angle that the picture was taken. There is actually 1/4" of clearance. God speed my friend.

http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/Infamoustoo/2008074.jpg

http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee70/Infamoustoo/2008077.jpg

[bigtyme1]

Thanks Tony, that helps alot. I think the problem is I have 350 frame mounts that are two different sizes. I'm going to get the 327 mounts tomorrow.

[Rybar]

What headers are you running?

[bigtyme1]

SW headers for standard subframe and gm steering box. I know the SW headers fit good with the correct mounts there just hard to find.

[David Pozzi]

CarlC did a mockup using 67/8 motor mounts, ATS brackets and I'm not sure which frame brackets. Check with him on that as he got it worked out. I don't know if your brackets are the same as the ATS though.
David

[Rybar]

I am running the S&P plates, Energy Poly mounts without the pre-load plates and SW LT's (The older stock steering design which look like yours) The newer design is like Tony's posted above. CarlC also has the newer style.

I was pretty close like yours, I ended up changing those bolts on the steering box to button head stainless and also filed down the box cover to gain clearance on the header tube.

Here's an older pic BEFORE I did those mods:

http://s34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/Rybar/ETP%20head%20swap/?action=view&current=CopyofPicture031.jpg

[bigtyme1]

I picked up 1/4" today buy switcing mounting plates and engine mounts. Look a lot better and the motor also has a good angle to it. Funny thing is I must have called 3 different so called Camaro part companys and every one keeps saying there all the same. Trust me there not. I used 69 302/350 plates and engine mounts.there still about 1/8" shorter on the drivers side. took the motor lower on the passenger side and futher away from the drivers side. Worked out perfect. Special thanks to Pozzi and his write up. What's the big deal if I shim the engine plate 1/8" to get a little extra space?

[bigtyme1]

[QUOTE=trapin;163922]bigtyme,

Either you have the wrong motor mounts or the wrong frame mounts. I have the small block (327) mounts on my frame and with the S&P conversion plates and stock motor mounts they fit a lot more snug than that. I would cross reference those parts again to make absolutely sure you have what you think you have. Unless all this is different for the '69, which I don't see why it would be.

As for your header problem, what brand headers are those and what part number? You have to get the specific headers from Stainless Works to clear the stock steering box with the S&P plates.

The part number is..."CALS1SB" for the regular finish and "CALS1SBP" for the hand polished. These are specifically designed to work around the stock steering box USING the S&P plates. Some pics for reference. Header #1 looks like it's close to the power steering box but it's really not. It's just the angle that the picture was taken. There is actually 1/4" of clearance. God speed my friend.

Tony, Its getting better. what kind of header gaskets did you use?

[Vegas69]

302/350 mounts are the worst if you are trying to gain clearance. They put the engine the lowest in the chassis. 307/327 mounts will gain you 3/8 up clearance. Moroso makes motor mount shims...not sure if they will work on a ls.http://moroso.com/catalog/categorydisplay.asp?catcode=28100

[Rybar]

Tony, Its getting better. what kind of header gaskets did you use?

Use the stock GM gaskets. :yes:

Nice job gaining the clearance. :thumbsup:

[bigtyme1]

302/350 mounts are the worst if you are trying to gain clearance. They put the engine the lowest in the chassis. 307/327 mounts will gain you 3/8 up clearance. Moroso makes motor mount shims...not sure if they will work on a ls.http://moroso.com/catalog/categorydisplay.asp?catcode=28100

I Used the same mounts you did but I think the difference is you did not use a stock steering box. The 307 mounts are higher on the passenger side but they tilt the motor over to much to the driver side. Buy using the 302 mounts I was able to get the motor level again and picked up the clearence I needed. I also used the 302 engine mounts which are much thicker buy about 1/2 inch. next time I will use these.http://www.brphotrods.com/NEW First gen LS1 kit.html
It was just to late and running low on the budget.

[Vegas69]

I guess I didn't notice it moved anywhere but down when I swapped mine out. Not having the steering box in the way sure makes life easier. The are definitely thicker and more suited for our applications:thumbsup:

[Moose]

next time I will use these.http://www.brphotrods.com/NEW First gen LS1 kit.html
It was just to late and running low on the budget.

so you think this is the kit to go with? I havent bought anything yet..

[bigtyme1]

so you think this is the kit to go with? I havent bought anything yet..

call them and get the measurements, but I think they are going to be much easier to work with.

[WILWAXU]

so you think this is the kit to go with? I havent bought anything yet..Mike, the BRP setup would work. It places the motor more forward and higher in the chassis than most the other more conventional setups you see here.

[bigtyme1]

If I did it all over again I would go with BRP.

[Moose]

The only thing about the brp is the height.. I'm running a victor jr fule injected intake, so I'm a little concerned with hood clearance.. Should be ok but not sure yet.

I also already have t56 crossmember from ATS for the 6 speed in the car.. I'll call brp and talke to them

[WILWAXU]

The only thing about the brp is the height.. I'm running a victor jr fule injected intake, so I'm a little concerned with hood clearance.. Should be ok but not sure yet.

I also already have t56 crossmember from ATS for the 6 speed in the car.. I'll call brp and talke to themI had the same concerns. I plan to go with a blower in the future. So I ordered Autocraft pan/mounts and ATS trans mount.

[Moose]

I had the same concerns. I plan to go with a blower in the future. So I ordered Autocraft pan/mounts and ATS trans mount.


I just have the stock pan at this point.. Havent ordered the pan yet.. Basically its the motor that came out of the firebird, but has a bigger cam and better valve job.. Still gtp heads though.:thumbsup:

where did you get the pan from?

[WILWAXU]

I just have the stock pan at this point.. Havent ordered the pan yet.. Basically its the motor that came out of the firebird, but has a bigger cam and better valve job.. Still gtp heads though.:thumbsup:

where did you get the pan from?http://www.autokraft.org/products/:thumbsup:

[awr68]

Mark, glad its all working now!! I bet you learned way more about GM motor mounts than you had wanted to though! Keep up the pace, you're doing great!! :thumbsup: