That's an important observation Dale - no matter how well you think you've prepared your car, stuff can go wrong, and immediate notification of something bad can save both expensive parts and your own ass. Very smart to have put that in, and a good lesson for me and, I suspect, a lot of the rest of us.

Well......it's been over an hour and a half. http://d26ya5yqg8yyvs.cloudfront.net/DirtDOG.gif

Sieg, I know where this is going...

:action-smiley-027:


When the oil pan was removed to check the rod bearings and main bearings... we found a surprise. The parts shown in the picture were laying in the bottom of the oil pan!

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps78ddc52d.jpg



Here is a picture showing where the parts came from. From the research I have done... this is the new design timing chain "tensioner" that is used on the LS3 engines.

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psfdf66874.jpg


You can see where the plastic cracked and the part failed.

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps03651cee.jpg


This is a picture of an older design timing chain "damper" that was used on the LS2 engines.

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psd4fd9f0a.jpg


Since the LS3 "tensioner" failed I did some internet research and apparently I am not alone in having a failure with the new LS3 "tensioner". I discussed this problem with the engine builder and he said most of the LS builds he has done used the LS2 style "damper". My engine was one of the first to use the new LS3 design "tensioner".

We have come to the conclusion that since my engine has a larger cam than a stock engine this may have contributed to the failure. With the larger lift cam this may have caused excessive stress on the tensioner.

A.C. installed the LS2 damper rather than the LS3 tensioner for the rebuild. He also installed a new timing chain. No telling how long the engine had run with no tensioner.

From what I have found out... The LS2 damper is the way to go if you run a larger cam and higher RPM. The LS2 damper a very simple design with no moving parts.

I don't want to cause a panic that all engines with LS3 "tensioners" will fail... I just wanted to share what happened to me. I'm glad that my timing chain did not break. I feel very fortunate that I pulled the engine and discovered this problem early on. The good news is that the LS2 damper bolted right in using the same hole pattern as the LS3 tensioner.

SO really -- you were lucky TWICE --- the low oil light -- and that item caused you to find the tensioner issue.

You must be living really right!

Welcome to racin' huh!?!?!

My last "expense" was all due to a stinky little valve tip part...

Lol... yes I was very lucky, It could have been much worse! Now I don't feel so bad about all the work pulling the engine.

Agreed... chalk it up as "racing". When you start running the track days and pushing the car hard, you find weaknesses very quickly.

Hey Scott... I am a design engineer at Columbia Machine in Vancouver. If your out that way stop by and I'll show you some "inventor" designed machinery. Previously I used Pro Engineer software, now I prefer "inventor".

:thumbsup:

Hi Dale, I'm glad that there's no major damage to the engine. Makes me think twice about going to track days. I only have a stock 5.3 in my 67 right now. Oh well, it's just money right?

I missed the scenery of the NW, but not the rain. We had a "cold front" here in Houston over the weekend. The high temps dipped to the low 70s.

Scott, I remembered seeing your car on the lift at Steve's back around 2010. We also use Autodesk extensively at my work as well (3D at the last employer).

Winter upgrades and safety stuff
 

The car is back up on the jack stands…. propane heater fired up… and I’m ready to work on the winter upgrades!

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps5de3a48e.jpg

I have been reading a lot of posts on here recently about safety for pro-touring cars, and the new street car events coming up in 2014 (USCA & ASCS). I have been contemplating what direction to go with my car in terms of “safety features”. Both USCA & ASCS are currently working to define the classes, and rules for their street car events. After reading lots of posts about this I have made a decision of how to set up my car.

My car will be purpose built “pro-touring style”, to allow me to drive comfortably on the street (around town, or on long trips)... and to drive on road courses at HPDE events in my area (PIR, The Ridge Motorsports Park, and ORP). I want to drive on the street, and hang out with my friends at the track. I have the most fun with my car when I’m on the track. It’s fun to go fast on a closed course and see what the car will do (legally) in a safe environment. The direction I'm going is to build a multi-purpose car and make it as safe as possible for both types of driving.

Currently my car has upgraded brakes; chassis mods; solid body bushings; sub-frame connectors; driveline loop; fabricated tubular a-arms; front and rear sway bars; modified suspension; 4 point roll bar; Sparco seats with side bolsters; 5 point seat belts; and on board fire extinguisher.


Here is my plan for this winters upgrades:

Personal safety equipment to purchase:
Driver suit.
Gloves.
Shoes.
Helmet set up with Hans, or similar type device.

Upgrades to chassis/brakes:
New front spindles with higher strength, and higher load rated bearings.
Install ducting to help cool front brakes.
Add removable door bar tubes that attach to the 4-point roll bar.

Upgrades to engine and trans:
Modify front drive to prevent the serpentine belt from rolling off the pulleys and taking out the dry sump pump belt (this happened last summer!).
Replace timing gears and chain to new Cloyes LS Z-Racing set up.
Replace GM ZR1 LS9 hydraulic throw-out bearing with Katech HD Tilton unit.

Also… I will inspect critical parts, and check bolt tightness on a regular basis… and limit my top speed to 135 mph (in my car that’s 6,700 RPM in 4th gear). I have noticed when I get over 135 MPH the aerodynamics become an issue. Up to 135 MPH the car is stable, and rock solid... so 135 mph will be my own personal speed limit (plenty fast to have fun!). At some point I could do aero upgrades... but not now.



On to the winter upgrades.
Right before the SEMA show this year... I went for a drive and my throw-out bearing started making a loud squealing sound when I pushed the clutch in. Yesterday I pulled the trans to check it out.

This is what I found :hairpullout:
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps84ec4425.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psd0687da0.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps10584688.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psb5128de5.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps4a9e5a8e.jpg


I was pretty disappointed to see the $300 ZR1 OEM throw-out bearing fail after only one season of use! I called Jason at Katech and he said they never used to have a problem with these bearings… but recently have seen several fail. He said something changed with the OEM supplier and he suspects the grease melts out, overheats the bearing, and melts the plastic slider (I would be curious if Carl C. or others, have input on the bearing failure). My bearing fell apart when I pulled it out (balls fell out on the ground)… the slider was melted… and the bearing appeared to be very dry (no grease). Jason said he has seen this scenario before with guys that track their cars.


The fix

Since I bought my ZR1 twin disc clutch kit from Katech (2 years ago)... they have come up with a heavy duty hydraulic throw-out bearing setup that fits the T56 transmission. The new HD set up is recommended for guys tracking their cars. This bearing has no spring, and only contacts the clutch forks when the clutch is pushed in. The slider is aluminum instead of plastic... and the bearing is a heavy duty sealed bearing.


Pics of the new throw-out bearing set up

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps530add00.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps16c018f7.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps930819ba.jpg


New bearing height is the same as the OEM unit

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps0ef67536.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps791ae9a4.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psfd76c854.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps2d93b390.jpg


I didn't think I would be pulling the trans again so soon. Driving on the track is hard on things. I'll just keep working towards making the car as bulletproof as possible.

Thanks to Ron S. and the other guys on here for all the great discussion on safety!

:cheers:

Awesome decision on the safety upgrades! Your thoughts in your last post relating to what you enjoy doing with your car is almost spot on as myself! Good looking car!

I'm thinking of doing the Heidts front and rear full kits on mine before even doing an LS swap. Can't decide though since the suspension is already started with other arms and upgraded parts!

Heck of a build, stay warm in that garage!

Good stuff and good thoughts Dale!



#1 --- I have a couple fire suits -- Go with a lightweight version (summer driving) if you are only going to get one. My heavier duty (more fireproof) version is just a sweat box in the summer.


#2 --- I like your top speed limiting thoughts. It's good that you've felt that and know to pay attention to it. A car can get real ugly once that air gets up the car.


I think the rear end gears in the Mustang are my limiter... and as you rightly pointed out - these speeds are plenty.


I'm running a Tilton in the Mustang -- it took them three times to get it right so it doesn't squeal like a pig...

Dale, just a heads up, we've had some problems with the bearing in that Cloyes timing set failing. The bearing is not a good match with the oem thrust plate, the hole in the thrust plate needs to be chamfered to clear the lip/ridge on the bearing, we don't use the bearing anymore, we custom machine a bronze bushing for each engine so we can get the chain tension we want.

Thanks for the compliments! I was struggling to figure out what to do... but feel good about the choices now. I think your making the right decision to do the chassis upgrades before adding more power...good luck with your build.

:cheers:

Thanks Greg... I just now noticed you changed the location in your sig to "Sun Valley", should be some awesome skiing about now. Sounds like a great place to be for Christmas :thumbsup:

Appreciate the advice on the fire suits... right now I don't have a clue. Do you have the two piece, or one piece driver suit? After doing some online shopping I'm thinking one piece... Nomex material... either one layer or two. Not sure which brand yet.

:thankyou:


Hey Tim...thanks for the heads up. I will pass this info along to my engine builder... I think he just purchased a couple of the sets of the Z racing stuff.

Both my driving suits are the one piece "jump suit style". At track days you tend to be in them all day long -- I have one that is thicker and heavier material (more fire retardant) than the other - but I can't go look since they're hanging in the trailer.


Yeah -- here (Sun Valley) for the winter.... and maybe spring and summer -- they should break ground on the house about the time ski season ends. I've got 5 days in already and it's not even Xmas yet! I pretty much ski every other day - but never on weekends... and the "tourists" will descend like locusts this week - so will skip this period between Xmas and New Years.

Thanks for the info Greg.





Wanted to share this here. I got my Christmas wish today.... my son made it safely back to the states on Sunday from his second deployment to Afghanistan! He won't be home for Christmas...but I will see him soon.

I am a happy Dad right now :thumbsup:

God bless our troops still there and I pray for their safety.

My son is the one on the right with sun glasses
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps3b348e14.jpg

Back to base on Sunday after several days of travel
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps3188c990.jpg

:flag2:

Congrats Dale, great Christmas gift as the most important things in life are our families. Have a Merry Christmas.

Thanks Lenie... Merry Christmas to you and you family!

That's the best gift of all! God bless the troops.

Awesome Dale (regarding your son coming home!) and also awesome on the Camaro plans. I like your well thought out plan. Everyone has their own goals and agenda and you have thought hard on yours and are putting a plan together to execute. :thumbsup:

First, I would suggest going somewhere you can try them on. Not all brands fit the same apples to apples regarding sizes (like the helmets too). I first bought a "budget" suit (Sparco Jade) for about $300 (sight unseen) and it was HEAVY. I thought I was hot standing in my house with it on - I was imagining near death at Thunderhill or somewhere in the summer. So I sold it and went to the shop up at Sonoma (Infineon) and tried on several when they were having a big end of year sale. Spent quite a bit more money but got a good 3 piece (the Jade was a thick 3 piece) with MORE protection (better rating) and it felt 1/3 the size and thickness. Night and day difference. Depends on your budget of course, but as many have said, safety items are probably not the best things to skimp on.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents.

I second what Greg says about the light weight suits. I have 2 also, my 'not so light' one is crazy because it's heavier and has no vents so even in 30deg days I stay warm, but I'm also soaking wet because it doesn't breath.

Go light weight but I'd also suggest 2 layers. A lot of people I know go with 2 layers AND still do the underwear layer of fireproof. Can't be to safe right? I'd rather have a light weight 2 piece suit and underwear and spend more money than get burnt. Just my .02$

Glad to hear it Dale! Merry Christmas buddy :thumbsup:

Dale,

Wow, that is great news on your son!

It's a blessing to see a picture of him too. :thumbsup:

Regarding the driver and car safety/performance/reliability upgrades, good stuff obviously and your taking the time to lay it all out in detail is appreciated.

We'll said Lenny and Dale I'm very happy you got the best Xmas gift of all :thumbsup:

Thanks guys… I really appreciate your thoughts and comments. I look forward to some quality father son time very soon :thumbsup:

Enjoy the holidays and time spent with your families...

Thanks... appreciate the great info.


Dave, Thanks for the compliments on the build plan. All the discussion about safety here recently caught my attention, and I think it's a good thing.

Also... thanks for the insight on purchasing a driving suit... very helpful :thumbsup:

That's great regarding your son coming home. Please extend my thanks for his service.

Can't wait to see the upgrades you're planning for the car.

Tu

Dale

Great news on your christmas present. The apples usually don't fall far from the tree so I'm sure your son is a fine young man.:thumbsup:

:cheers:

:popcorn2: I likey

Whats the word Dale. Real interested in that spindle and steering arm set up. :hello:

It’s has been a while since I’ve posted in this thread. I took the car apart this past winter for some upgrades and still do not have it back together (getting close though).

My goal was to upgrade the 45 year old GM front spindles to some stronger spindles with higher load rated bearings.

I ended up buying a complete package from Ron Sutton Race Technology. Ron designed new custom front spindles, and a brake package to work with my stock front sub-frame and Global West Tubular A-arms. The geometry of the spindle is optimized to improve handling over the stock spindles, and the steering arms are adjustable so I can fine tune the steering ratio (quicker for autocross... slower for road course). The new brake package will increase my total braking torque from 2352 to 3404 (major improvement... can't wait to try them out!).

Some of these pictures are posted in the chassis and suspension section under "front suspension & steering geometry" but I wanted to update this thread to.

Here is some pictures of the new parts:

Spec 37 rotor with custom billet hub.
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps9f71adc3.jpg


http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psb513e6ee.jpg


Wilwood large 6 piston calipers
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps01040a76.jpg


http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psfaa12b9c.jpg


Howe upper & lower ball joints. Low friction coating... bigger diameter. Stock upper ball joint shown on lower left.
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psf90cadcb.jpg


Billet aluminum steering arm
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps0e9a2cd0.jpg


The steering arm has an insert that you can swap out to change the location of the tie rod mount. This allows fine tuning of the steering ratio. This pic shows the caliper mounted to the spindle.

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psd388da74.jpg


Custom optimized spindles
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps953e6153.jpg


http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...ps506532be.jpg


Large diameter spindle
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psa8a96246.jpg


Massive Timken tapered cylindrical roller bearing
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psaa062f5d.jpg

http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psac87eab7.jpg



Now I have all the parts in my possession... I'm back from vacation and I’m working to get the car back together.

Upper ball joint mounted
http://i1048.photobucket.com/albums/...psce8d4f72.jpg

I plan to install the rest of the parts this week. I'll post pics as I go, and provide more info on the adjustable length steering arms.
Look forward to trying out the new parts very soon. Kudos to Ron!

looking good. thats some serious shheet right there. I think Gaetano's dreams were just shattered. LOL

Was wondering when you were going to turn up. That's some stout hardware. Looking forward to seeing it come together. :thumbsup:

Negative Ghost Rider. Pretty sure we'll be headed the same direction. :thumbsup:

Coleman makes a nice piece.

Lookn great Dale!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Yep...to 'Sutton's Secret Sauce Cafe & Warehouse'




:D

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Looking forward to hear how the new parts work out.

Tu

So wait..... All this time has past.. and the total update was that you've installed the upper ball joint??? LOL


Okay.


Dale.... have you stroked out on us? Are you feeling alright? Fever? Pulse?



:warning: :lol:

He nailed the rear shocks for me with His "Secret Sauce". I was driving on the street after geting it all put together and some guy at a stop light was begging me to roast the tires. Amazing how the car felt at launch and throughout the burn out with the new shocks comaored to the QA-1's. :thumbsup: