I agree with you Blake! Doesn't make any difference... lucky vs smart or both or none.... as long as it's going UP!

:cheers: :woot: for you!

I am working on being smarter..:lateral:

Luck ?? Oh my... I have plenty of that..:thumbsup:

Right place, at the right time..Not all by my doing, but I will take it...:rofl: :woot:

I bought at the right time in life...Again some by sheer Luck.

Looking back after reading this thread, i could have done even better...

Most of it was by not being too greedy, by getting in when everyone else would not, and by just being in the game. And not on the sidelines..

Sure the easy money was made from late 2008 to 2010. But even in 2011, with volatility at it's peak, money was made, and dividends were earned, so better to be in, than to be on the sidelines.

And the over spending ??? Well not being one of them, I got the deals of a Lifetime on Property after 2009...While the overspending of fake equity crushed them.

you would think that over spenders would learn ? remember , I have the family members with zero retirement money, going over and over to Europe, and foreclosed and bankrupt, by overspending..

I tried to help for a while...What a waste of time and money that was..

Solar --- What you've done is both smart and lucky.... you have to be smart enough to make some luck!

Anyone that is buying properties NOW -- they're lucky that someone else took a big hit on it -- and you're SMART buying at these depressed prices! That building I just bought (I'm the bank only) for my brother in law -- cost $600K to build -- He bought for $335K -- how can that not be good for him long term??He's lucky I can bankroll it for him (6% interest), but HE is smart making the move.

The oldest saying in the Universe (thanks AL!) is BUY LOW, SELL HIGH.... it aint' rocket science!! :lol:

When we look at those long term charts of good stocks.... IF -- IF -- they continue on the historic path -- they SHOULD BE higher over time... as should real estate. My bet is - if you wait to see when they're going higher - you're already late. Sometimes it's just hard to take the plunge when things don't look so hot. The folks that do - they're the lucky ones! Or are they just being smart enough to create their own luck?

Well I always say that Luck is the meeting of preparation and opportunity.

I had been preparing and all the numbers were wrong.. The house i ending up buying was sold for 660K in 2006...I ended up getting it for 267K..in late 2008. it is holding at about 330K, which should be the bottom for several years..But it is home, and i don't plan it in the retirement mix until very late in the game...had i bought six months sooner, I would be down 100K.. i was lucky, because we both know you can't time the bottom...being close enough would have been ok, but i hit it just right..





You are right , partially by creating my own luck, and partially by being at that moment in history, 2008..




your thread has made me look back and forward.. None of my investments have done bad, I just know i would have done even better, had I followed my gut even more..
my money management skills got me to where I am.. Being a somewhat novice investor, I could have even done better, but that is part of the learning...

Oh , and you can call me Mike...I was a Solar guy until 2009..When I changed my life after the crash.. I invested my way to wealth. took a big risk in 2008/2009..

And thanks for the words of encouragement..I have been studying investing, money management, the housing bubble before it happened,ect.., for a while now...Late starter but quick learner.

This studying has by far been the best thing in my life.. The rewards are life changing for me, and my family..

so thanks for the thumbs up, and all your advise and opinions...

I recently read a good book "The Weathy Barber Returns" it was written by a Canadian Eh. it is an easy read (thats how i read the whole thing lol) and ALOT of practical advise in it ,20 bucks well spent.
his big deal is "PAY YOURSELF FIRST" not the easiest concept to wrap your head arround when the bills are piling up but it makes sence for sure.
I am a guilty of not putting enough away, but have made some realestate investments that will pay off soon and that then will open the door to catch up, Oh and there is this little thing I call SpeedTech.......:willy: lol that seems to be at the top of the list.
I suggest everyone run out and buy the book. then let the wife read it, then your best friend, oh and make sure you rent it to them... lol

I'll check in to that Blake, Might have to look at some of those Canadian companies to

Buy a Speed Tech Track Time Package and I bet he throws in a book for ya eh? :yes:

One of my best friends lives up the street -- he and his wife have probably never grossed $125K per year -- and they both work full time.... He's 66 now... and here's the deal - HE PAID HIMSELF FIRST since he was about 20. His house is paid for - it's a nice small house, neat as a pin - perfect for 2 of them (no kids)... he has a brand new diesel F-250 (with roll up windows and cloth seats and zero chrome) and an Airstream -- paid for cash - he has a brand new car - paid cash.... He is without a doubt the most FRUGAL guy I know and I give him SERIOUS crap about that... I buy Snap-On he buys tools from the $1 bin.... I help him with his investments - and I'll tell you this guy qualifies for the book "The millionaire next door". And I'm so proud of him - because he's done all of this because he pays himself first.

When I met him 20+ years ago -- we were on a dock at the Grand Banks Rendezvous.... Yep -- he had a super nice little 32' GB (neat as a pin)... and no payments.

I still remember the day I popped his bubble -- his little 32' GB was super stingy on the fuel - according to him - at a burn rate of 3.5 gallons an hour - he made 7 knots.... my bigger 47' GB with TWIN turbo Cummins burned 11 GPH...and made 14 knots.... and he says to me -- after a trip from Seattle to Friday Harbor. "Man that big pig of yours cost you a fortune to run up here..." ME, being the figurer --- did some quicky math -- and said -- Dickie, You burned 30 gallons running up here.... I burned 55..... but I've been here since NOON! :woot:

Love the stories... I get a little something out of each one...

I tell my Wife to watch and see long term how we will be doing....In 5 years....in 10 years...

My Father that passed, cut my Teeth on 42' Farallon Eagle Trawlers, and 34' CHB Trawlers.. Not the Grand Banks of Yachts, but still we were living....

The problem was, way beyond our means. I was 16 and did not know anything, even about Cars and Girls. Nothing...

And apparently, he did not either.. No investments, and we lived it up..

So in approx. 10 years, my father went from Well Off to broke... If that is not a painful memory that i will carry to my grave, i don't know what is...

He was a doctor, so he went back to work teaching at 70 to 85...

That is why money management is so important...as well as investing..

My wife and I will use our life experiences and wealth to build more wealth, while enjoy life as we go, debt free except the 4.5% small fixed mortgage..

I learned how not to do it, and i am learning how to do it really well.. The Journey and the Goals achieved, and the rewards, keep me motivated and pumped up..:lateral: :cheers: :woot:

And that offer will stand for ANYONE on the fine board!!! from this day forward.
details available by calling 1-888-467-1625
Please have your visa card ready.
:thumbsup:

My cash back program is better with Discover. I wish I could pay my mortgage with it.

My Roth hit my trading account today.

Seeded it with:

Coke, AT&T, P & G, Exxon, and Walmart


I really like the " pay yourself " concept, I will be using this the next time I'm beating the war drums on money management.

I hate that little man on Wall St!

I mentioned that I sold half my Goldman Sachs --- since it was way down -- and I had to counter some gain from the Apple sale at the end of the year... And today it jumps $6

Okay - so the lesson here is -- SCALING IN == SCALING OUT.... I only sold HALF of the position and still hold 1000 shares... so I get HALF the gain at least.
Had I sold it all at the lower $ I would just be "out". Remember -- this little SOB is watching you! And the minute you're OUT - he takes it UP. Hate that little guy!:rofl:

If you scale into a position - sometimes it raises your cost basis... IF the stock is rising over time. But ---- isn't that what you wanted when you bought it in the first place? So if you buy 50 shares at $50 and buy another 50 @ $52 does it really affect your basis that much to care? No --- you really want it to go to $60 so you still have a nice gain. Don't be a hog.... :unibrow:

Here's another PET PEEVE with Wall Street..... A major rating firm (Goldman) CUTS it's rating on a stock while RAISING the price it expects the stock to trade to.... the REASON for the "ratings cut".... IT HAS GONE UP 36% in ONE YEAR. DOH! Really -- so the stock has gone up 36% and they expect it to go higher!

OMG -- no wonder people go crazy listening to these idiots!

Here's the cut and paste:


Cigarette maker Philip Morris International Inc. (PM) on Tuesday caught a big downgrade from analysts at Goldman Sachs.

The firm said it cut its rating on PM from “Buy” to “Neutral” with an $80 price target, suggesting a 3.5% upside to the stock’s Friday closing price of $77.32.

Goldman defended the move by noting the company lacks any form of near-term catalysts.

Philip Morris International shares, which have gained more than 36% in the past year, fell 38 cents, or -0.5%, in premarket trading Tuesday.

Greg- I've got my eyes out for that dude, and I totally agree with scaling in and scaling out (unless one of the fundamental reason you bought a stock changes, ie- you bought a stock for the dividend and the company suspends the dividend and issues a poor outlook, etc). To follow up on my earlier post of scaling down my position in FOLD and increasing CVX... My fundamental reason for purchasing FOLD hasn't changed, which is why I held half my position, I just wanted a little less volatility in my portfolio. FOLD is up nearly 120% since I made that move! :willy: Good news, I kept half, bad news I sold half. Let me know if you find the little man from Wall Street!

Had you not done ANYTHING -- FOLD would have stayed flat. So thank yourself for being a market maker! :rofl: :rofl: :woot:

I've warned of this phenomena on several occasions. I don't know why it happens - but it does. I have a rope with a noose ready when I find the little
basterd.

Rules of the road -- the one you sell - goes up - the one you buy - goes down. It's a total ying and yang thing. :lol:

I wish I understood more...I am going to try and learn about it more this year, and start investing.

In the mean time, I am just going to start sending you checks Greg, and you can invest for me.

Great subject!!

Mike == Buy low - sell high.... :rofl:


Just kidding of course.... this isn't TRADING 101 -- it's INVESTING 102!


Just give the checks to Laura.... she'll find a lot of investing to be done at the mall! :woot:

I have decided to take an investing class at school. It won't hurt to broaden my horizons while gaining some insight into this game. This thread is a great source of information. I really want to step it up a little.

BTW, I'm also looking for that little Wall Street Leprechaun. As soon as I sell the stock it goes up after being stagnant for the better part of my ownership in it. You let me know when you find him Greg, I'd also like to stick my foot up his ass.

Just don't let them make it complicated - because it's NOT!

Maybe you should teach the class! You know everything there is to know!

Names you know and understand - Good stuff - good chart (long term i.e. 5 years or better) - rising dividend payer - earnings growth... CLASS DISMISSED!

Give that man 5 stars and some gold bars!!

:rofl: :woot:

Catching up on a little reading and I thought I'd share this article in the December 12th issue of Fortune magazine.
http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2011/...cks-investing/

Good article.... and is what I've been pounding here... remembering that this is Investing 102 -- not anything more or less.... because we can veer off and get into all kinds of investing/investments/hedge strategies etc. But that was not the OP question or direction...

I did go back and check out United Technologies (UTX) since it was mentioned here - and had been asked about in this thread.

I'm still not a "fan" for the reasons stated earlier.... which is -- in my portfolio --- the growth (18% over 5 years) doesn't overcome the relatively low 2.48% dividend. When I have a lower dividend - it's okay - if it's offset by better than average growth. In this case I don't think 18% over 5 years is worth the 2.48% cash flow. I think there are better opportunities out there when you do the comps.... Coke (KO) comes to mind -- with it's "low" dividend % of 2.79% but even this steady eddy has a 5 year growth DOUBLE that of UTX....

So remember... do your homework... no guessing. These comparisons are easy and just take a few minutes. And I'm using this as an EXAMPLE only of the way I personally think and do my investing. If there are OTHER REASONS someone wants to own UTX over COKE - I'm totally good with that -- that's their choice... and their reasoning. Just make sure if you're investigating companies to invest in - that you've done your own work and UNDERSTAND your choices. That's the key takeaway.

I compared UTX against a boring holding I have in the portfolio - Johnson and Johnson (JNJ) and the growth rate is "horrid" on JNJ -- it's actually DOWN 4% over 5 years.... and I mention this to make a point out of the above statement... I own this because of the stability it gives my account - and more importantly - my head. If you look at the long term chart - it (JNJ) don't go down much either. So for me - that's every bit as important. And here's why - to me - maybe we're in a funky market for 4 years or so and I'm down 35% overall -- and along comes a "deal" I want to do... I look around for available funds - and everything I own is down 35%... do I want to sell low? No! Am I getting good dividends off most of these "losers" -- YES! So here sits JNJ -- not much of a dividend - and it's only down 15%... guess where the cash is going to come from? I can sell JNJ - not be down "much" and won't loose much income either.... so it's what I call "parking" money... and everyone needs to have some money "parked".

So just for fun -- do a "visual" on my theory of "parking money".... remembering that all of us have different goals and different "means" etc... and trust me - I'm the first one that understands that.

Go to Google Finance -- pull up a 10 year chart of JNJ -- then in the COMPARE box at the top of the chart -- compare UTX - KO - GE

For years I used General Electric (GE) to "park" money. But as you'll see - if you didn't change that when Jack Welch retired (the GREATEST CEO) then that strategy bit you...

But what I want you to see is how "narrow" that line is of JNJ near the "ZERO" mark - so it isn't growing (above the line) but it doesn't go far below it either...and for that segment of "money" that has importance to me.

It's about BALANCE.... I want to balance the risk stocks with steady stocks -- Knowing that I might give up being the biggest winner in a competition had I put everything in the big risk/reward bracket.... but I'm not going to be the biggest loser in a down market either... and I might be able to take advantage of the big losers when they're giving away their apartment complex or building or hot rod etc. :unibrow: :D

How about over a 10 year period which was what I was looking at. UTX up 143%, KO up 49%, JNJ up 12%.

That brings up a question. Depending on the time period you look at, one stock may look better over 5 years, but another may look better over 10 years. How do you decide what time period to use?

Great question --- and I look at BOTH for my decision making...

And you're right on - because the more you try to compare - one stock vs the other... it begins to look more like a horse race.... ya know -- the announcer shouting out "blackie jack is ahead by a nose - now comes lucky lady... and making a charge from the back is two socks..."

IMPOSSIBLE.... :lol:

This is where a small amount of brain power needs to be exercised and you just have to gather all the info - look at the time frames - and then fit them to your portfolio. I don't like to use 3 year -- because of the great "recession" killed EVERYONE... so the five year gives me the stocks ability to REBOUND... and then you go out 10 year for "track record" -- I want to see that they were climbing prior to the big dipper! The ability to rebound is it's "resilience" and I like a stock like that. It means that it was a classic case of "toss the baby out with the bath water" rather than poor management or poor product line etc.

Thank you for all of the great information Greg. I took your advice and then applied it. I invested some money about three weeks ago and now it is up 4% overall and they have not paid me dividends yet, can't wait for that.

Good to hear!!!

I love a dividend check (actually just a deposit into your brokerage account) it's like getting FREE money.... :yes:

Online Brokerage Firms
 

Again what a great thread! Thanks to the OP and Mr. Greg Weld!!!

Regarding online discount brokerage firms, what are everyone's favorites?

I know Greg and a lot of you use Schwab. I would like to, but it appears you need to do 35 trades per year to be an "active" trader and thus have access to all the nice features of their site. How about the standard platform (not an active trader) how does it look? While 35 trades doesn't seem like many, if we are just diversifying into say 5-10 stocks and holding them for a long term investment (at least a year and a day for tax purposes) will I every get to 35 trades just doing some initial investing? The minimum funds are not a problem. How about using a MAC instead of PC---any issues?

Scottrade looks great and gets great reviews, but they do not offer a DRIP program (dividend reinvestment program). I would probably use them if they offered this since they have offices very close to me, no unreasonable fees for the first time traders, etc.---But no automatic reinvestment of dividends....

E-Trade also looks good, but some of the reviews state a lot of hidden fees for inactivity, etc. Plus their trades are a bit higher in price.

How about the others-TD, Tradeking, OptionHouse, Fidelity, etc? They mostly all have low fees, good platforms, etc. but no local office to speak of.

Also, how about funding the account. Any experience with good/bad of each regarding transfers, wires, etc.?

Opinions, experience? I gotta get this going and my money working for me soon!

Thanks for all the great advice on this topic!

My IRA retirement accounts are with Fidelity and they have been very easy to use. I also have a Schwab brokerage/investment checking account that I use for investing outside of retirement purposes. Both have been great to use, very easy and I haven't noticed any unusual/hidden fees. I've visited the Fidelity branch one time and felt they were useless once I left. I do everything online so the lack of an actual branch located to you shouldn't be an issue. If there is something I need I just call.

Nobody can really answer all this for you -- you need to make a list of questions you want to have answers to - and discuss them with EACH BROKERAGE. Or visit their websites and see if you can easily find the answers your looking for.

Each brokerage has plusses and minuses.... and only you will be able to decide what fits for you.

I don't pay any fees at any brokerage... :unibrow: Not even for wire transfers etc....

Let me correct - so there is no misunderstanding --- that I pay TRADING FEES -- i.e., the $8.95 per trade -- but when I say "no fees" -- I mean I pay nothing other than the per trade fees all brokerages charge.

Greg,
Gotcha. I previously made the list of questions you mention for that reason also.

The websites do answer much of these questions although it's always helpful to hear from first hand accounts. The good, the bad and the ugly.

I don't think i'll have the fees waived the same as you LOL! (at least not yet...positive thinking-big gains:) )

Thanks

And I hope you get there next week!!!


Really though -- none of us is probably going to have much experience with so many different brokerages -- there's just too many of them. I use Schwab for some stuff -- Fidelity for other stuff - Wells Fargo for IRA -- McAdams Wright Ragen for bonds -- etc... Some brokerages can handle certain things for you - others can't... (such as a branch of Wells Fargo that handles some "private paper" investments for me)....

What's probably going to be a "consideration" for many is What's the minimum size of account - the activity fees - Who has an easy to use Web presence... etc. It's all so subjective.

I'm not a "trader" so the brokerages that offer all manor of trading software etc - just doesn't tickle my fancy - so those "features" aren't important to me - but they may be to someone else....

My personal perspective would be quite different than most -- I get my ass kissed at all of them -- and get what I want/need with a simple phone call or email... and that's why I've always just said "any of the discount brokerages"... then ya gotta just find one that fits.

FEES are deductible by the way.... the fees should be included in your COST BASIS...


Another "by the way" -- I make ALL the brokerages send me PAPER statements.... I never want to be in a position of not having another form of "proof" 5 years from now - about some trade or cost or sale price etc.... this laptop will be long gone most likely -- and if I need to look something up from the IRS -- I want to have it at my fingertips...

This week is a good "insight" into what we might be heading for.... good bad or indifferent... with these titans reporting Monday and Tuesday.

I don't buy or sell on this kind of "info".... but EARNINGS is what the stock market is all about --- and it's not so much about what they earned as it is about WHAT THEY SAY ABOUT GOING FORWARD. That is the take away you need to pay attention to. What does business look like NEXT Quarter and for the year.


Monday will start one of the two most hectic weeks of the earnings season. Marquee names due to report earnings on Monday include Texas Instruments Inc and Halliburton Co, followed by Apple Inc, DuPont, Johnson & Johnson, McDonald's Corp, Verizon Communications, and Yahoo! Inc — all on Tuesday.
BoeinG, ConocoPhillips and United Technologies are set to release results on Wednesday. Thursday's earnings line-up includes 3M Co, AT&T Inc, Starbucks and Time Warner Cable Inc. On Friday, earnings are expected from Chevron Corp, Honeywell International and Procter & Gamble Co.

Out of curiosity, would it be wise to buy into a stock thats reporting earnings on tuesday on monday or has the train already left the station.

That's a GAMBLING question... how much do you know about the company -- are you willing to BET that the earnings report is going to be good?? Because if it isn't - you might get your butt crushed.

Anyone that bough GOOGLE before earnings -- just took a $50+ haircut...

So what you really need to ask yourself is ------ If the earnings are good -- and their forward comments are good -- am I INVESTING -- or am I trying to get the first .50 by gambling on an unknown?

Sometimes I'll buy AFTER earnings a day or two when I see which way the wind is blowing... 'cause I'm in it more for a couple years than just today. :cheers: :woot:

Good question by the way!

Well, Halliburton has been hiring like crazy and I stay busy as crap most of the time, so we better report good earnings or else I'm going to want to know whose been spending all the money I bring in from the jobs I do, lol.

Earnings are announced every quarter, right? Are the earnings announced this week of greater significance than those announced throughout the rest of the year?

And the earnings that are announced this week set the tone for the dividends that are paid at the end of this quarter?

Earnings are every quarter -- but not all companies run on a calendar year... so really - there's an earnings report just about every day from "somebody"...

What earnings do is give you a peek into how things are going - in the company - and in the SECTOR as well.... You might own FORD stock - and pay attention to GM earnings... because they may say things that are indicative of how things are going overall for sales etc...

This is a broad based generalization of course - but if several big companies come out and report good sales and profits and have good things to say about going forward - then this can lift the market overall... and of course the reverse can happen.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Dividends are set per quarter... and are indicative of how the company is doing. Doing really well and feel good about the future of their earnings they may choose to increase the dividend. That is a really good indicator because they are saying that their income is growing enough to support that payout.

COMPANIES are loathe to reduce the dividend....because it says "we're not doing so hot"...

It's really not much different than a persons personal situation.... nobody wants to be in a Ferrari and then have to trade down to a Yugo... and the reverse is true as well -- IF a person feels good about their future earnings - they're likely to buy a better car (pay a higher dividend).

Keep up the good work! Halliburton reported good numbers and I was looking for a quote from you in there somewhere...