AWESOME!!!

Fantastic total return! That's how it's done right there buddy!

I will give Anita major grief for being such a slacker manager!

Great Job... I hired some more Killer employees the other day..Added to some i already had. They are hard workers.

You have done well..:cheers:

Oh, and do you work for speed tech ?

No -- he's the lazy ass owner.... EH!

:D

LMAO i am getting all my EMPLOYEES to do the heavy lifting

The owner ... Well I don't want to highjack the thread , by my investments paid for speed tech coil overs and other goodies.. the car has never handled so good.:woot: .Really Nice, but I digress...:willy: Sorry...

I did do some housecleaning, and adding... I think 2012 will be a great year for some..:cheers:

My twist on this - Comfortably funding our car habits is somewhat the common objective and goal of the thread.

That said, Greg's advice hasn't exactly helped Blake and SpeedTech since I've had this little Devil on my shoulder for a year or so that kept urging me to buy their Track Time package........but now a good portion of that play money is positioned to return a current average of 5.13% in annual dividends. :unibrow:

No worries Blake it will come your way, you've earned my business when the time is right. Until then I'll do my best to promote SpeedTech in my little backwoods network. :thumbsup:

Without a doubt this is the best thread I've ever participated in. :bow: :lateral:

But ===== maybe you'll have so many capital gains that when you do buy - you'll get his new floater rear end set up in addition to the Track Time package -- so then he'll be as happy as a little Canuck could be!!:cheers: :woot:

I feel you, and I had to shut the little guy up on my shoulder..

Sure that 30K I just spent on a Sunday toy could be making me more money, but I have to enjoy some while I can.

First off, I have medical issues, so dying with a large Portfolio is going to suck, but I will never spend myself into the poor house, so money will be left after I am gone, and two, I have projected my Portfolio out to 85, and I am 52 now, so the spending is all good, and disposable money.

But I do feel you...Money sitting in the garage is not working..

But since I can get at least 30K for my car, and more, I did not lose money..:cheers:

Just ran a conservative scenario in the Schwab's retirement planner without my wifes current income or retirement, factoring retirement age of 65, life expectancy of 80..........it's projecting a surplus of $439,000. Didn't factor inexpected emergencies, though there's other assets and revenue that aren't factored. I'll definitely sleep a little better tonight. ;) :woot:

Greg, what's your take on the Facebook IPO? I don't want to get off topic but is that something a newbie should consider buying given the recent expectations of the company? Would parking say $2000 in Facebook be a good idea. I know you've explained that good growth and a decent dividend are key but how should we approach IPO as investors?

I guess what I'm wondering is if IPOs are an investment we should consider or are they a lot of hype. Would waiting for the dust to settle be a wiser decision?

Congrats.:woot: Knowing the numbers is so important..

Yes, I never run my Wife's income or Social Security in my projections. Just me..

Also I never include my Home Equity. I do count it in my NET worth, but not for future living expenses..

That way I am excluding approx 300K of non liquid assets from my projection.
So we have that money for assisted living if ness.. later in life...or for whatever.

Seig, it really helps to run the numbers once a year. Also to calculate your NET worth to see where you are at..

Then once a year revisit to see if you are up or down... :lateral: :cheers:

Being the newbie, I wonder what Greg will say..

For me, I don't understand it, I don't get the value in it, and seems more speculation than anything..And if I am going to speculate, it will be in PM's and Commodities.

But again, I don't do facebook , so I won't buy it, and I am a newbie..

My Wife was asking about it today, I said pass..

The other good thing is that my Wife and I talk money all the time..We are passionate about it..

For a couple to talk about money together is very important for a marraige..


I know so many people in Financial trouble that never, ever talk about Money strategies, or plans for the future..Like they are frozen..because I know they care about it. They just won't do anything about it...Or WORSE, they do everything wrong to sabatoge the future. Those,including certain family, I have stopped helping. They will never learn.:cheers:

I only use Facebook as an example because they're the most current IPO that I know of. I'm wondering if its a wise move to jump aboard in the beginning and hope there is future growth along with a decent paying dividend for the long haul. The problem I see with something like a Facebook is that eventually another social media site will/may surpass it. Like what Facebook did to MySpace. But a good company with a solid background and business plan with an IPO might be a wiser choice. I guess its just the luck of the draw. No one knows what the next big thing will be or how to time the market.

[QUOTE=Sieg;393136]Just ran a conservative scenario in the Schwab's retirement planner without my wifes current income or retirement, factoring retirement age of 65, life expectancy of 80..........it's projecting a surplus of $439,000. ......QUOTE]

Out of curiousity, what's your thought process to determine the "surplus"? This is the way that I've looked at it ....

I'm 52, have a mortgage, one kid in college and two more to go.

I"ll work until at least 65.

I don't believe that anything in my current lifestyle will change drastically .... yeah, I'll get the kids thru college, but something else will come up.

So, my goal for my retirement income is to have it equal to my current income. That retirement income will be a combination of SS, pensions and interest/dividends from my retirement accounts.

Is that essentially the way you guys calculate your needs?

I've bought three that went bankrupt and two that have floundered. I found a decent article about FB and the hype yesterday. But haven't seen any indication of price, my guess is it's not going to be cheap.

Newbie here...I guess there is always arun up on some of these things, but it doesn't seem to be long term investing...More like you said, timing to get in..But then will you hold it long term ? Most of them do flounder, but someone made tons..

But I just stay out of that..:cheers:

[QUOTE=billscamaros;393156]Somewhat, but you also have that big variable....Health... That is an asset you must keep working on. Keep fit, Doctor's visits.. I know it sounds corny, but that variable has sunk more retirement plans than any other variable..

Some say you can make it on 80%, but i would project 100% income in retirement..

If you don't need it or spend it, reinvest it.

And good on keeping the HOME out of the income mix... That is another nest egg that should something happen, you have something there too..

The best laid plans can turn to poo, with one medical situation.. So stay safe and healthy, and good luck in your plans..:cheers:

Fantastic question.... and the answer is.... simple. It's gambling. I'm not against gambling --- provided -- that it's money you have set in the gambling bucket.

Most IPOs don't fare real well... that's the history... but when they go - they can make a guy rich. Just ask me how I know. :D

So how to play it. I have no idea what the right strategy will be on Facebook and I'm going to tell you right now - I made a sizable 7 figure deposit in cash yesterday in my Schwab account (the last of the sale of Isilon to EMC)... and I went to bed last night thinking about what "I" should do with this one. I'm not sure I want any part of it - and then the little man on my shoulder is saying "but Dude! What if it doubles and triples in the next three years?!?!?!"

So there is no right or wrong answer --- and the only thing I would say is that this is gambling in it's purest form. Ya plunk your money down and hope ya hit it right.

Now -- I will also add - since this is investing 102 -- that these kinds of "bets" are a good test of your intestinal fortitude. They will show you if you really think you can take risk. Everything is wonderful and the sun will shine if the stock keeps climbing -- but if 6 months out - it starts to fall... and every day you get up and you're dying the "death of a thousand cuts"... then you'll see if you can hold... because these kind of companies tend to have wild swings...

If you pull up a chart of GOOGLE (GOOG) or Chipotle Mexican Grill (CMG) and you look at those dips and the peaks... they're gut wrenching moves. Can you stand that and hold on long enough to live to talk about it and reap the reward... CMG went UP 200% and promptly fell back to even... before it took off and never looked back... Ask yourself when you would have bought and when you would have sold or hold... had you bought near the top would you have held on and watch your money go to half? Or? It's a question you can not answer - not until you're staring down the barrel of the pressure that can put on your mind.

So here's the only right answer.... only play with money you can truly afford to loose. That you just don't care about - it's not the money you were going to buy a new set of wheels with... it's not anything you're going to miss if it's gone. If you have that - then by all means - if you want to buy an IPO... go for it.

Now - if you're going to play - I'd suggest you buy HALF of what you think you can play with - sit back and see what happens - if it goes up buy a little more -- but I'd wait at LEAST for their first quarter report before committing new money. Maybe you'll miss some of the run up - but you'll have gotten some of it. But you'll also be happy and think you're pretty smart if it's gone down 40% - at which point you might want to take that other half and average down. It's BALANCE... try not to get knocked off balance. Try to curb the greed on the way up too... you'll thank yourself in the long run.

toe curl
 

Greg,

thanks for chiming in...Without you , on occasion setting the rudder, we can go off course..

Just wanted to say great advise on the gambling thing...I have small plays that are just that..heck, I have large plays that are that, but it is not money that I will need right away...Right away to me being 3 to 5 years... "Now" would be called my immediate cash, which is the only cash I have ,because those employees are slackers and just stand around doing nothing...your fired..:cheers:

But to my point of this post...When you said you just made a sizeable seven figure deposit into your account, I could feel my toes curl in my Slippers,haha.

Well Done... That was my whole NET worth, just deposited like nothing..

KUDOS..:cheers: I never envy or take things as bragging...More like the goal I want to achieve...

That is why I read this thread.And why I post some of my limited knowledge. To help if I can...Someone get independent and secure no matter what...Or for me, to take it to the next level...:lateral: :woot: :cheers:

See this investing thing REALLY does work!! :cheers: now everybody smarten up and start investing ......... and when those dividend cheques start to roll in .................. never mind.:_paranoid

Here's the article, I thought it was a decent read...........
http://navelliergrowth.investorplace...ebook-ipo.html

Everybody listen up...it does work...

So does the speed tech setup. We are racking the car after a hard round of tests...

All money made in the market, over time...:woot:

This thread is the best...It will only make me smarter...

And to those just getting started ?? This thread is something 10 years ago and more, you would NEVER get this info..

Now online, you get stats the bankers only had..

Greg is peeling back the curtain and giving you a tour of backstage...:hail: :cheers: :cheers:

I'm sharing my deepest darkest secrets in an order to put PERSPECTIVE in the thread so all can see how my wheels turn in relationship to your (all the readers) own.

If I have that kind of "new" money (it's net worth that is taken into a cash position - so it's not new but it is freshly minted cash which now needs to go back to work!). BTW - this was made from a gamble taken 6 or so years ago -- !!!!AND I'M CONFLICTED ABOUT INVESTING IN FACEBOOK!!!!.... where should your thinking be?

That's the "context" I'm trying to provide. Here I sit on a bunch of new "employees" that need some retraining and I'm wrestling with where to deploy them.

I "might" and this is a big "might" put 50K in this IPO... but I might also chicken out. I just don't know if at this point in my life, whether or not I'm willing to take the gut wrenching ride these things can do. Even though it's money I can take out into the middle of the street and toss it away... The brain wants you to make a home run out of EVERY investment you make.... and when they don't go your way - your mind starts working on you. I don't care who you are or how much money you have.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++

When I owned a business in NYC -- my partner used to say -- "the only guy that ever screwed me was the guy I trusted". By that -- he was saying that if you don't trust the person - you wouldn't loan them money in the first place... so the only guy that you loaned money to was people you trusted - putting them in a position to upside-down and screw you unintentionally.

Here's why I'm adding this. EVERYONE thinks FACEBOOK is the next Microsoft... EVERYONE is dreaming of the millions they're going to make off "only" a lousy $1000 investment. So like the loan to your friend/customer etc just make sure you can be disappointed if it doesn't work out.

[QUOTE=billscamaros;393156]There are MANY websites that you can simply plug numbers in and they'll show you what you need to have to retire on - how long it will last - and what you need to save between now and then etc... and they'll factor in inflation etc. So you can play with the numbers as much as you like. Ignore them at your own peril!

If you need to "make" 100 grand in retirement -- be prepared to see a gut wrenching number that you need to have to do that - and live until you're 80 or 90.

An old saying comes to mind... Liars figure and figures lie.

When 'playing' with these numbers you must be really honest with yourself about how you see yourself living in retirement... :cheers:

Bill, here's the basics of Schwab's:
-Are you including your partner? Yes/No
-Date of birth
-Retirement age
-Life expectancy
-Effective Federal tax bracket
-Current tax advantaged savings intended for retirement (IRA's, 401K, etc)
-Current annual amount of contributions to the plan
-Investment and bank account taxable savings intended for retirement
-How much do you plan to save yearly to these accounts

It then summarizes your total current retirement savings and total annual contributions.

Then asks how will your portfolio be invested prior to retirement.
-Short term (expected return 3.1%)
-Conservative (expected return 4.3%)
-Moderate Conservative (expected return 5.4%)
-Moderate (expected return 6.4%)
-Moderate Aggressive(expected return 7.2%)
-Aggresive(expected return 7.9%)


Then it asks how your portfolio will be invested after retirement.
-Short term
-Conservative
-Moderate Conservative
-Moderate
-Moderate Aggressive

Then it asks how much you plan to spend in retirement
-Percentage of your current income
-Monthly amount you will spend
-Annual amount you will spend

Then what income do you expect to receive in retirement
-Social Security
-What age you begin to receive benefits

Other Retirement Income
-Monthly amount
-One-time lump sum amount

It then gives you
-Your Projected Retirement Savings and Income
-Your Retirement Funding Needs
-Your Projected Surplus
-Likelihood of Meeting Goals Chart in percentage to projected age


That's the laymans summary. How honest and realistic you are with the data input is critical IMO.

The Schwab site and I'm sure others have some pretty valuable tools for the independents who want to quickly run and save multiple scenarios. :thumbsup:

Thanks Sieg. I'll look thru the Schwab website tonight, as well as Fidelity's. Although I think that I have a fairly sound evaluation of how I'll retire .... it's good to bounce ideas off of other folks too.

Solar - I'm with you 100% on the health viewpoint. It's all a matter of balance .... making these plans to fund future lifestyles while at the same time making sure that we enjoy the family, friends and life around us today.

Best thread I've ever been a part of!!!!!!

Who needs me? You guys got it going on!!! :thumbsup:



Bill et al....

So here's something everyone needs to give some thought to - in a funny backwards sort of way... about retirement. I know this -- because I'm living proof having been retired 20+ years already (I'm 58 now - and plan to live to be 300!)

I - being retired - want to see RAGING INFLATION.... and you hope that when you retire you'll have the same. Blasphemous you say! How stupid is that idea!!

Well.... let's think about it this way -- In retirement I should already own my house.... shouldn't be buying new cars as often - should maybe already have enough "toys" to carry me into my 70's... so what are my costs to live? Heat, Gas... phone.... food... property taxes and home maintenance... simple clothing... the trips I used to fly to I now have time to drive and enjoy...

So... if I could make 10% on my tax free muni bonds (more than double what I'm getting now on average!) my income would be FANTASTIC! Either I could have saved HALF what I needed and get to the same income -- or my income just took a giant jump... I can afford the "inflation" on prices of basics because I'm really not buying that much or that often!

If you want to see what this looks like -- plug in some wild numbers to the "retirement calculator" -- keeping your "required income" the same -- but the rate of return on your investments "high"... use 8 or 9% (unrealistic currently) rather than 4%.

Personally -- I'd love a return to the 80's when I could get 14% on a simple CD... :_paranoid :D

[QUOTE=solarguy09;393143]Congrats.:woot: Knowing the numbers is so important..



Also I never include my Home Equity. I do count it in my NET worth, but not for future living expenses..

That way I am excluding approx 300K of non liquid assets from my projection.


QUOTE]

I read an interesting quote went something like this
Customer to Advisor. My current house is worth 300,000(say)fully paid for. I only actually calculate it at 100,000 in value" why is that? " because I will have to live somewhere and if I figure when I retire I will down size and spend 200k then that leaves me 100k in assets to work with not the full 300k.
Something I never really thought of. In that context anyway. dDoesn't really flow with what is happening here but may add some light.

Just to get back on the Facebook IPO for a minute or two, would their IPO have a possible positive affect on the companies doing the underwriting? Just looking at the charts for Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan I wouldn't think to buy due to their lack of performance but Im trying to think outside the box.

The current discussion on the solid market, steady eddy dividend payers is great, but I'm now looking at the gambles for those with a higher risk tolerance. I'm trying to disect all angles, sometimes you've got to take risks to reap rewards. Although it might not be for some, others will make that move. Whats your take on the possible positive affects it could have on other stocks or companies involved?

My seat of the pants calculator had you funded to age 330.........but then you entered into an affair with Roger. He's quite talented and I've become concerned about your fiscal well-being. :D

Facebook,

Greg you have stated before to keep things simple. You used your Apple visit to the mall senario,and it prompted you to look into it and purchase it. You have had a nice ride up.

Now wouldn't you use that same thinking in Facebook. Everyone but you (and a few) are on it. I'd say about 80% of the vendors on this message board are on it. Its another way of advertising. They currently generate income from advertising and social games.
Looking back at google as an example it started at under $100 its now $585
It does have its wild rides but how about the long term?

Oh man, that would be the ticket.... I would be my own King...Cash and no debt.....sweet...

You are right about the Inflation, but the regular investor needs to be making money on their money and low in consumer debt, with a fixed home loan in the 4% range...

If inflation, or when Inflation really takes off, I will be ready...I am deleveraged, and ready to rock.:cheers:

[QUOTE=killer69;393212]Excellent, just being more conservative...When my wife and I bought our REO at the bottom, we went with the larger home with more Value...

That leaves us with the downsizing option too.. My plan is to stay here or move to an equivalent home someday.. Or just downsize later in life..

Similar to you...Maybe the house is 350K, and the sole survivor, her or me, can use that money any way needed.. 200k home, or just assisted living..

I plan to die with money invested... That way i am never spending to the edge of my comfort range...:cheers:

Hi Greg
I have been researching some company's that I am familiar with on Google finance. just checking the charts and dividend payout. One thing I learned was to pay attention to the % of the dividend rather than the $ amount as it was confusing me. I was discounting some companies because the divined $ looked low but in reality the % was good. I am not ready to ask opinions on my choices yet as I need to do some better research but I have a question. How do I determine if a stock (company) is "higher risk"? I have been going through this thread trying to find the answer but I haven't found it. So I apologize if it is in here and I am being redundant. As a side This money is in my "if goes up great but if disappears I won't lose a lot sleep" bucket. So I would like a fair amount of risk.
Thanks
Ray

It seems that Greg has a lot to teach and I have alot to learn. I am in the process of trying to invest my money.

There is alot of good info here. It is going to take a while but I am going to read every last post of this thread.

Great Advice Greg:thumbsup:

RE: FACEBOOK


I just left my local Schwab office.... where -- sorry to say -- I get some preferential treatment as a large account type customer... so after we do some "bidnezz"... we start talking about Faceybook and they'll allocate 100 shares to me -- and as over subscribed as it is now - I might get "50"...

Oversubscribed means -- more people want in than want to sell... So if Faceybook issues 100 shares total -- there's people lined up to buy 300 shares -- thus "oversubscribed".

My VP guy wants to buy it for his kids account.... but his take is -- he's going to wait for the first big drop...

So here's my "take" - which I've discussed above... it's gambling - for those that want to take the risk -- I say -- you're all adults -- JUST DO IT! Me? I'll see what it does and tip toe into it... and even tip toeing into it -- it will be a very very very small % of my investable funds. I'm not AGAINST investing in these -- it's more about "at what price" and how much. With "seasoning" (age) comes a certain outlook on life and I don't have to jump into the fray == I prefer standing on the outside and picking around the edges...


RE: APPLE


COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ANIMAL HERE! COMPLETELY!

Apple was a public company for a very long time -- that had it not been for Bill Gates bailing their sorry asses out - would have been long gone....

When I was seeing the line at the mall -- THE STOCK -- was not up (@ $85ish) so we had not yet seen the real rise yet. The STOCK was not in demand YET.... so I was EARLY.


FACEBOOK is going to come out of the gate in HIGH DEMAND... Which equates to a high price (given all the metrics of P/E and blah blah blah) so does it RISE from here or come back to earth? We just do not know. But it was, and is, a very good comparison Bob with your statement about "everyone" is using it and wants it!

Read the advice with a grain of salt.... ;) This thread is about trying to get people to THINK about investing -- Think in rational ways -- Think about their money in a different light, i.e., as a tool to make you more money. To think about actually doing just a minimum amount of research and comparison BEFORE they invest.

There are ten gazillion OPINIONS about how this is all done... I'm just one of the ten gazillion. So what I'm trying to write about is some basics that folks can use to GET STARTED.

I'm happy that you're interested and like the thread - so far it's been a lot of fun -- and time consuming :yes: ----- THERE ARE NO DUMB QUESTIONS... I've tried to put myself out there to show that nobody should be embarrassed about this subject. We ask about car parts and how to weld and how to put bigger tires on our cars etc... and we don't seem to feel stupid about doing that.... so I'm trying to say "let's talk about investing the way we do about our cars" --- I'll show you what I'm doing - that doesn't make it right or wrong it just one way -- and then, like our cars.... you start to take that and "make it your own". :thumbsup:

thanks
 

Greg,

Thanks for spending the time and the passion to share some ideas..

All taken with a grain of salt, all put into the mix, and not followed without personal research and homework.

Being the non mechanic but crazy driver, I am drawn to this thread.

You have done something that is hard to do...To keep an Investing thread alive and growing...New ideas and discussions all the time..

Why do I say that ??? Try starting a money thread on other sites...They sink like rocks, never to be heard from...

I have pointed a few people to this site to read this thread. I hope they do..

This stuff is what gives us so much...It is not how much you earn....It is what you keep....And then it is what you do with that money, that is a key.

At least the guys on here are hardcore serious... If they buy Coke or pepsi, or one energy distribution over the next..the are doing research and putting the employees to work..

:lateral: :cheers: :woot:

RAY --- Great question!

Glad you saw the light and figured out the percentage was the important part... Frankly - there are so many figures on a page -- a guy can easily get messed up! That's one of the reasons I say to make a page and write stuff down === then go back and look at them all over again --- double check your "facts" and weed some stuff out -- re-check the charts etc. One time I bought a stock but had entered the wrong trading symbol... and ended up with 10,000 shares of some crap I didn't know anything about! Lucky for me - I was able to sell it within minutes and buy the one I was trying to get.:wow:


Now to the question about RISK....

Generally --- and this is really really broad brush "generally" -- RISK carries a higher dividend PERCENTAGE... so if something is paying 10% in a "5% world" -- it would raise the hairs on the back of my neck to start looking at WHY THEY'RE PAYING SO MUCH.... There can be MANY MANY reasons... so you need to look at the competition -- look at the sector they're in -- read as many articles as you can find -- so just google them and see if there's something in there that explains the risks (or not).

Now --- remember that this is a very broad general explanation... There could be a very good reason they pay an above average dividend. Kinder Morgan Partners is set up as a Master Limited Partnership and as such they MUST pass through "X" percentage of their income -- so if they have big income - the dividend will reflect that. This isn't to say they aren't risky -- it's just one reason for one company.

HYG (an ETF) invests in high yield (risky) corporate bonds... so they're trying to strike a balance of risk and yield (same thing we're trying to do = right?) and if they do it right -- you get a nice dividend (actually it's INTEREST so be careful here and understand the difference tax wise!) yield. Your RISK is if interest rates suddenly RISE -- then the face value of the bonds they're trading would FALL... and so would the price per share of this ETF. SO..... here's where you need to be DILIGENT and when you hear/read/discover that something is changing (up or down) you need to understand what that will do to your holdings! You can not be a SLACKER and think you can just go blindly about your life and your money will take care of itself. That's not to say you have to look every 15 seconds (like I do) you need to just keep your brain engaged. MANAGE your money and your risk - that's not TRADING! It's just being diligent.

It's like checking your oil and the air in your tires! You don't just put oil in the car once and forget about it.... and if you have an oil burner (A HIGH RISK POSITION) then guess what -- you need to check it a little more often!

Dude! How simple is that for an analogy?? :lol:

Generally all the discount brokerages have some kind of assigned "risk" gauge/rating somewhere on the stock page when you're researching. I usually glance at these - check the long term chart -- the dividend - then look at a couple more charts -- then compare them with other known competitors and see if I can get a better chart with near the same dividend etc... Then I scan the news associated with the company to see if there's anything I should pay attention to...