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A good friend of mine was in the same situation with his son. A shy quiet kid that didn't cause trouble. Perfect target for bullies. My buddy did turn his son loose on the bully after months of trying to get something done. His son, like yours, has been taking martial arts for years. He didn't hurt the other kid, just very quickly showed him enough was enough. His son was suspended and moved to a different school and now has that on his perm record. Nothing happened to the bully.
What my friend failed to do was document anything. He had visited the school multiple times but had not formally charged the bully or his parents. He also did not seek help past the principal of that school. He had no proof other than his word. No one at the school would get involved even though they all really liked his son. It is a sad commentary that these things aren't dealt with better. We are having more and more Coloumbine-like incidents every year. Good luck! Jeff- |
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At this stage the other kid is "salvageable" and can have a good life. He is being taught some poor behavior at home, but with the right intervention by others he can have a better life. |
Hey Eric, sorry to hear about this problem.
As much as I would LOVE for your son to kick this kid's ass up and down the street, he'll probably be the only one that gets into trouble. It's sad but true. If I were you, I would go see the highest person in charge and let them know that you are not going to stand for this to happen any more. Let them be fully aware that you are going to lawyer up and let them know that. Then, I would speak to an attorney and tell him your side of the story and see what he says and take it from there. GOOD LUCK with everything buddy. |
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I went over the principals head yesterday, right to his direct boss. If that fails I have the number for the district supervisor, and the state office that oversees them. If need be I will just keep climbing that ladder. as far as I need to and make it as public as possible. I will not wait for an incident of serious injury (or any injury again) at this point. I am done waiting for them to respond. |
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The first step is the lawyer, and then making it VERY public. My first priority is my son. But I did also make it very clear that I know they have a legal obligation to help the other kid too. I guess I am working on his behalf too. He's 5. He was taught this crap at home and needs something done. That is not something I will do directly but I will sure pressure the school into doing something about it. When I spoke to the district office and the supervisor over the school principal he was pissed about the whole thing. He did not say anything out of step, but I could hear it in his voice. He is now aware of everything including a possible lawsuit. That is something they just do not want. I am VERY surprised that they have not at least suspended the other kid yet. I just don't get that. The teacher has made the principal very aware of all of it, I did too. I spoke directly to him. But his lack of action is sickening to me. Now he will have no choice but to act. |
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Man I though alot about this subject last night after I read this whole thing...and what I would do. Tough situation to be in...
Yes, you should feel some sympathy for the other kid...he probably has a crappy home life etc etc, but he's not your problem. You wont be able to change that his parents or his home life. Your priority is your son. Hopefully your actions will start the ball rolling to check on the home life of this kid, but its still not your problem. Despite everyone wishes and high goals, schools cant solve these problems. Schools cant solve crappy parents and a crappy home life. They have hundreds of kids to deal with and minimal resources. I think alot of crappy parents just use the school as a daycare to babysit the kids and expect them to "raise them" and teach them whats "right and wrong". If you dont have good parents, that rarely happens. I'm still of the same opinion....go through the right channels...document everything up the ying yang. I'd tell the school and all the admin that if this continues that you have given your son the "green light" to beat the tar out of this kid. Either they take care of it or your son will be forced to defend himself, end of story. If you have everything documented and the whole school system is aware of whats going on, your son should be fine if he has to do whats necessary. They have been warned and its all in writing. Moving this kid to another class wont change anything if this kid is gunning for your son. You mentioned that some of the incidents have taken place on the playground, in the lunchroom etc etc. At best it will make the kid target some other poor kid in the other class and probably still your son during the "open season" parts of school. Yes it would suck that you may have to let your son use violence to solve a problem at 5 years old, but if you do the right thing, talk to him in depth about doing things the right way....trying to walk away, let it go, the kid has problems etc etc...... but sometimes you have to stand up for yourself. Its a good lesson to not let other people push you around....both emotionally and physically. |
Thanks Ned. I agree that the other kid is not my problem, but it is a legal responsibility of the school to do something including calling in state agencies to help him.
And you are right in that if it's not my son, it will be someone elses down the road. This kids location in the school does not matter, it is his personal issues that are the problem. When all else fails I will green light my son to do what is needed to put a stop to it. Until then, gotta keep my head on straight. |
Just a little add-on to my earlier post, the school made a big deal about my buddy's son being "trained to fight". That was the issue that got him black listed. None of the earlier stuff mattered, they zeroed in on the martial arts part and the good kid became the out of control monster. Just FYI.
Jeff- |
The problem is if your son does not at least knock him on his ass, he will be the sissy who's daddy handled it for him. We did that one time and it got really bad for my middle son. After we had him moved from the class he was getting screwed with from everyone. Lucky for us we were moving anyway to a better school district.
When all 3 boys went to the new school, of coarse someone wants to try you. They all had their moments and handled things at the bus stop. One even got his ass kicked by the bully, black eye, but even the bully respected him for standing up for his self, they became friends, and no more problems, ever. All our problems happened in elementary and middle school when the kids are young, small and cannot do much damage. Come High school when these guys can really hurt one another, we had ZERO issues which is good because non of my boys were exactly big tough guys, but none are pussies either. Not one of my kids was in a fight ever after early middle school and moving to the new schools. I attribute that to standing up for themselves early and carrying themselves with confidence. Now with that said that was at least 12 years ago and things have probably tighten up even more since then as far as punishment for standing up for yourself. But reputation in school is everything. |
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Document everything, in writing, to the school system. Take pictures and send them along with your letters. Talk to other parents who have kids in your son's class, call CPS for the kid that's doing the bullying, hire a lawyer and sue the school system and the parents of the kid that's acting out - but in today's PC world, do not let your son retaliate. |
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LOL---yeah, her classroom is always the cleanest since I've been there. Sorry for the hijack--- Doug |
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[QUOTE=ProdigyCustoms;264155]The problem is if your son does not at least knock him on his ass, he will be the sissy who's daddy handled it for him.
I agree Frank, and how I would love to turn my son loose on this kids ass! But, his age, the current state of PC crap and the fact that everyone is lawsuit happy keeps me from doing that. One day this kid will get it, from my kid or someone elses. But at 5 (almost 6) it needs to be handled carefully on my end. My son has training to fight. He is taller, stronger and I think alot smarter than the other kid. It would be an unfair fight to say the least. The legal end of this is not one I want to be on the defending side of. The last thing I need is for this kids parents to come after me because my kid waxed the floor with thiers. And if this kids dad wants to come to me and call me a sissy for handling it, let him. I can handle most situations on my own that way just fine. Ten years ago, no sweat. Now, it is a problem. But I do appreciate the advice very much.:cheers: |
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I hear what Frank is saying and agree to a point BUT
hell have PLENTY of chances to do that soon enough.. Ive always been a true believer of "choose your battles wisely. if that needs to be Daddys battle then so be it.. just remember these are the building blocks of life man.. hes gonna have to knuckle up one day.. just maybe this isnt the day. |
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If I have to confront them and get that kind of response it will get real ugly real fast. I don't need that kind of excitement in my life right now. But if all else fails.....:_paranoid My first thought is to make it VERY public if they(the school) does nothing to fix the problem. Thanks for the input Tracy |
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He is a tough kid. He knows he is doing the right thing as of this point. He also knows he can defend himself at any time. He is very patient and will tolerate a lot. But when his line is crossed he will respond. Just like me that way. My line is crossed in a big way. |
Do not confront the other parents off campus. If you are looking for things to escalate and get sued, thats the best way to do it!! At best it would piss off the other parents enough that they will encourage their kid to go after your son more.....at worst, you get in a fight with them and the chance of lawsuits is way higher than if the fight is between kids.
I would probably DEMAND a meeting with the teacher, the principal, the superintendant and the other parents. Everyone should be present, so there is plenty of documentation and witnesses. Then hash it out....with the final position of being "everyone is aware of whats going on....everyone has been warned that when push comes to shove, your son will do whats necessary, including using his martial arts training to defend himself" You wont change this kid or his parents with a meeting...but you will give plenty of warning...whether it be legal plans or physical outcome. I would probably record the meeting too....either voice or video. Have you talked to your son martial arts teacher? He might have some good advice for your son. Martial arts are all about "turning the other cheek, but if you have no choice, kick the guys ass" and "violence is the last choice, but sometimes necessary" |
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I get the feeling the only way the school is going to do the job they should is to get the media and my lawyer involved. I can't believe I am having to deal with this at his age. Just stupid all the way around. I am going to find out in the morning what they have decided to do with this whole mess. If the answer is not what my son and this other kid need then I will demand that meeting but will have my atty present at it. |
It's a very difficult thing to deal with other children bullying your kids. My 13 yr old is a smaller boy than many of his classmates and has had to deal with it too.
In one instance, he dealt with it himself, and got suspended for 3 days. He was astonished when I told him he was in no further trouble with me. I also lit up the Dean at the school because I thought the no-bullying rule wasn't being enforced. Those three days hurt his grades too. However, that bullying stopped, and the bully ended up being a lonely kid as all his friends became my son's friends. It was all a bit primal, but hey, we're nothing other than really smart apes after all. I did enjoy the phone call from the other boy's dad complaining that his son had a large bruise on his ribs. In another instance, we dealt with it with an email to the teacher. The teacher responded by moving desks and pulling the other boy to the side with a little "one-on-one" conference and sending a note home to the boy's parents. I'm not sure that issue is fully resolved, but it has been much better later. jp |
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Good luck Eric.:thumbsup: |
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I will find out in the morning what is going to happen. I'll keep you posted. |
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Sorry to say this, but I had a bully problem growing up also. I learned to fight. Bully problem went away, and I learned to be self sufficient. If I had had my parents do something about him, I would have had two Bully's on my ass the next day. This is how kids determine their pecking order. It's normal. Let him be a normal kid and deal with it. As the kids mature, this crap goes away. Until then, your kid will be better off, and have much more pride knowing he took care of it himself. He will remember the day he took his first stand. I know I still do. I don't physically fight anymore, but I'm not afraid to kick some ass legally, and people know this. I don't have grown up Bully's either. :-) I don't know if this helps, but it is my story. Good luck. Ty |
i think that no matter what happens next, it is a good thing to have some form of written record of what you talked to the school about etc.. so next time you have a meeting with meet somone at the school, hand them a letter from your lawyer explaining your dissatisfaction that the bully-rules set forth by the school itself arent being observed.. and EVERY time you talk to them.. send them letter in a polite tone that for good measure recapitulates what you discussed and agreed upon.. and be sure to write in the letter that a copy will be sent to before said lawyer.. same with letters to the paretns of the bully... dont ever insult them, or theraten them.. just send , or have your lawyer send them a letter explaining what you have observed and that the corespondence will be shared with all parties, the school, your lawyer for future reference...
that way 95% of all trouble usually will be resolved, just give them the opportunity to fix the problem to your sattisfaction without being humiliated or feeling as such... that way you dont have a gunslinging redneck going postal on your family... |
:thumbsup: The same thing happened to my son a few years ago.We seem to talk till we were blue in the face but nothing.Then one letter from a attorney and it stopped and my son did not seem to have that problem any more.Something about a letter that has real meaning seems to hit home to the powers that be.Good luck.Tell your son to to keep pushing forward & Mean people are never sucseccful in life.
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Speak softly and carry a big stick!!! I would let my kid go kung foo on them!! And if that didnt work I'd give him some pepper spray, theres no way you should let your kids go through that I dont care if you get sued or your kid gets thrown out of school he needs to defend himself NO MATTER WHAT!!!
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Hey guys, little update.
I met with the school this morning to see what they intend to do about this mess. They have come up with a plan and asked me if I thought it was acceptable to try. They will keep this kid in the classroom, but there will be another assistant at all times. They will also have the schools counselor, the special ed teacher and the resource person in the class on a rotating schedule to work one on one with this kid. The other parents have been contacted MANY times it turns out and the school just gets the cold shoulder or ignored alltogether. So they will focus on his needs while at the school, and CPS has been contacted to investigate the home situation. The rest of the plan is to keep him on a different schedule and very busy in the school. His recess time will be indoors in the special needs program and away from the main population of students. He will sit in a designated area at lunch and be supervised. He will also go into a different PE or gym class with other kids that have similar issues or needs. He will also be separated at library time. So the bottom line is that he and my son will still be in the same class but with direct supervision over the other kid. He will be separated from the other students anytime they are out of the classroom and will still have direct supervision. They know there are jobs and a very serious lawsuit on the line here and they are taking it very seriously. My son will be safe and the other kid will get some help. I made it very clear this will not be tolerated anymore. And that they have dropped the ball in a huge way and are open for a serious lawsuit right now but that I am willing to work with them. I do REALLY APPRECIATE EVERYONES comments, thoughts, suggestions, sharing of stories and support in this. This is what makes this place so great, the people. Thank you all very much! I will keep this updated and see where it goes. :lateral: :hail: |
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Sounds like good news, Eric. I hope the kid gets the help and supervision that he needs. Also, I really think that CPS needs to look hard into what is going on at the home.
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I hope he does too. Obviously my son is my priority, but the other kid can not be swept aside and forced through the system. He will end up shooting me in a 7-11 someday or end up in prison and be a tax burden to us all.
He can be saved and have a great life IF the school and state do what is right. He is only 5 for gods sake. He is not at fault here. But I can not spend my time worrying about him, my son is my priority and I have to focus on that. |
you're doing the right thing Eric, sounds like things are going to be fixed. :thumbsup:
Jody |
Sounds like that kid is going to elemtary school prison. Good for you buddy:cheers:
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Eric, great way to handle this, parenting can be very trying at times. I hope they do follow through and the other little guy gets the help he needs and deserves.
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Eric, I just read through this thread and want to commend you on how you've handled this so far. You've done much better than I probably would. I constantly had to put up with bullies in the neighborhood I grew up in and I promised myself that when I have kids one day I'll teach them how to fight back like I had to. However, after reading through this thread and seeing how you're handling it, I admire the fact that your trying to create a situation where your son just doesn't have to fight at all(at least not yet), and that maybe the other kid gets some real help instead of just a beatdown. So kudos to you man! :thumbsup: I certainly hope the steps the school is FINALLY taking with this other kid will solve the problem permanently.
Cheers, :cheers: Chris |
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