What did you use to blend the rocker panel? I always see these nice finishes that don't look like a sanding disc was used on them.

Car's coming along nicely. That front k-member is gorgeous. I think I'd find a way to set it off from the rest of the chassis it looks so nice.

Just a careful application of 50 and 80 grit roloc discs, followed by 36 grit on my DA. Patience is key to keeping the heat out of the panel and getting a flat finish.

David

Thank you. I appreciate the information

Put a 3/4” dimple in the rear cap.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...a8cecb904d.jpg

Trimmed the front of the rocker, repaired some boogered up surfaces, and capped it.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...5c45324a66.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...1c23f89e9c.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...fc2a052857.jpg

David

Spent several weeks sorting out the chassis updates.

I moved away from the 14/16ga unibody in favor of .125" boxed tubing laid out more like a traditional frame car. It will still be a unibody, but one that relies heavily on the frame members for rigidity.

Next up: tying the factory rear rails into the new frame structure.

David

That sure is very nice work:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Yes, indeed...

Thank you! I've never built out a chassis inside a unibody, so I'm trying to be detailed and measure, measure, meausure.
Thanks! Appreciate it.

Quick updates - the rear frame rails are again connected to the rockers. The intermediate rails are the normal 4x2, and "torque boxes" are 4x4. It's interesting, but this portion of the chassis is actually about the same weight as the factory unibody stamped structure, but should be substantially more rigid - speaks to the strength in structural shapes over layers of stamped.

David

Front frame connectors, or "torque boxes" are built and mocked up. The front torsion bar crossmember is out, and the front rails are trimmed about 18". I still have to TIG and blend the boxes before squaring up and tacking them into the car.

Hard to get a good shot of both boxes and the frame trim, so here's a short video.


David

Torque boxes welded, blended. Most of this will be hidden, but I like stuff to look pretty.

David

Continued progress building out the chassis.

Front and rear "torque boxes" are burned in and now one continuous structural member from front to rear. I took my time with setup and welding so everything stayed level and square. I'll wire-wheel and blend all the MIG welds later.

Next up is the front frame expansion - looking to make a stronger connection between the front rails and the torque boxes, improving rigidity, and transferring loading to the (not yet built) inner rails and rockers. There's a lot of pock marks in the frame, so I'm filling with my TIG and smoothing as I go.

David

Front rail expansion continues. One more plate goes to the interior and ties the shock tower to the torque box.

David

Last night's progress - passenger side interior plate is in, and inner plate is mocked up. The passenger rail flange is trimmed and welded in preparation for fitting the interior rail plate.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/X-...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Mf...=w1024-h768-no

Plate is fit and in. Working with the rails up close like this, it's easy to see the variations in assembly from left and right. It makes it impossible to reference and measure from features, and I have to rely on finding level and measuring from set points on the frame table.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2l...=w1024-h768-no

Now, it's easier to see where we're going. The rails are about 7" tall at the crease, and the interface between the torque box and rail is a square 5". Recall that the boxes are 5" wide and 4" tall, so the interface is width matches the depth and the plates internal to the boxes also align with the overlay plates.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/rE...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/bj...w1024-h1365-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/IE...=w1024-h768-no

It's a lot of steel up front, but the improved stiffness should be worth the small amount of added weight. I'm looking to get back out there tonight.

David

Awesome job!

Thanks! Learning a lot as I go.

David

I'm not afraid to change a design when it isn't working. There was a part of the interior and inner frame where they overlapped and created a 1/4" thick segment of rail. While I acknowledge my offroad fabrication past, this isn't a stunt car and doesn't need 1/4" rails. I segmented the two plates and replanned my weld steps, and added about 1.5 lbs of lightness to this little bit of of the project.

Rev1 inner frame plates tacked and cleco'd. I'm building the top and lower plates today and this week.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/MO...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Oz...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/vO...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Qr...=w1024-h768-no

David

Looks good, David. Keep up the quality work!

Thanks! Fine fitting the rails and top plates is a slow process, but that’s the next milestone.

David

Fine fitting the top plates, which consumes a crapload of time to get the open corner welds set just right.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Eu...=w1024-h768-no

On the plus side, I'm finally getting a feel for welding these original 14ga rails. It's been challenging finding the right setting without bringing up the contaminants on the inside of the rail where there's still some old corrosion and (now) Eastwood primer. I broke the process into two, and have used it successfully several times now.

First pass with .045 wire.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Ci...=w1024-h768-no

Cover pass with 1/16
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Rk...=w1024-h768-no

More to come. It should only get up to 105 today.

David

David ---- just started at the beginning of your thread and after the quarter panel "reveal" post --- I saw this.....


Sorry guys --- this is an utter failure to understand not only the AGE of these cars -- but the simple truth that for many many years (decades) NOBODY WANTED THESE CARS....or '69 Camaro's either.

Body shops -- yes I worked at one --- were paid for insurance work -- and a bodyman gets about half the labor quote.... The faster he can get the car out of the shop and back on the road -- the more money HE makes..... We were in the era of "bondo" -- when I started -- we LEADED repairs..... that's right -- leaded.... with wood paddles etc. When sheetmetal came in wrinkled like this -- we'd pull on it - beat on it - stretch it - shrink it - use "crease pullers" and dent pullers -- and slathered it with mud.... I'm "ASSuming" this might have been an older repair that was deemed "okay" given the value of the auto at the time.... these weren't all $100,000 cars for their entire lifetime.


NICE PROJECT and fun to watch come together!

Thanks, Greg. I think you're reasonably safe in your ASSumtion, and it's clear this car was unloved for an extended period of time, yet managed to survive with the important bits still intact. It's mine now, and I've cut out most of the offensive stuff.

I've studied several of the builds you've shared, and it's greatly informed my way of thinking as I pursue a predictable and stable chassis that lets the suspension spread the workload as evenly as possible across the tires. There's a long way to go before it's back on tires and motivating under its own power. I just want to have the engine and trans stabbed before the end of the year.

It's a record-setting 109F today in Dallas, so I'm hydrated and headed out to the shop to get in some hours on these front rails.

David

If y'all are tired of looking at front frame rails, too bad. There's still a good ways to go, but we're down to final fitment and welding. The most useful tool I have in my drawer is time, and I use it liberally to keep me moving ahead and avoiding as many mistakes/rework as possible

All the plates are welded, blended, and required only minor refitting to account for shrinkage. The Cleco holes all still line up, which is a good sign. I also went ahead and added a gusset to better transition the shock tower to the outer frame plate. Acute angles like that on a structural area bother me.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/kc...w1138-h1516-no

Why go through all this effort to expand the front rails? Here are two photos to illustrate. Before:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/P2...=w1024-h768-no

After:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/9s...=w1024-h768-no

The section height at the critical connection is about 2x from factory. While the inner fender sheetmetal does transfer loading from the front rails to the firewall and the rest of the unibody, it's not up to the task by itself given the handling goals for the car.

Final task is prepping the rails for welding - making sure the control arm hardware doesn't interfere with the lower plate and welds, grinding the uneven flanges on the upper part of the rail, and making sure I seal up the new frame shape from any water intrusion. Just taking my time, mocking up, and setting up the weld sequence.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/sY...w1024-h1365-no

Busy week ahead of day job stuff, but I'm grabbing the hours where I can.

David

Thanks for the detailed photos, David. I appreciate the work you're putting in there so people like me can drool and aspire to more.

Glad to share progress. It takes me a while to figure how I want to approach some parts of the chassis build, and taking a lot of photos is as helpful in planning next steps as it is documenting.

David

Just catching up progress.

Front frame rails are just about fully welded. These will get blended and corners rounded. Inside:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Wt...=w1024-h768-no

Driver outside overlay after wire-wheeling:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/We...=w1024-h768-no

And a parting shot, all cleaned up.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/bW...=w1024-h694-no

Lots of hours on this sub-project, and I'm idling the Charger for a few weeks as I prepare my suburban for its next adventure. I'll pick this back up after SEMA.

David

Looks good, David. Is that a Handler 140 behind the car? Is that what you've been using this whole time? It's what I have and love. I especially like it now that I have 023 wire in there now. It does everything I need well enough for my skill level.

That’s my 210MVP. Big fan. That 140 handler is a good pick, too. When I convert to 110, that’s basically what it becomes.

It’s about as close to the good soft Miller arc as I’ve been able to get without actually buying a 211.

David

The Trail to SEMA is done (episodes start airing 12/12), and I'm back on the Charger.

The passenger rail is welded and blended. I spent Saturday dialing in the welder, and getting back in the groove. It’s been 4 weeks since I’ve struck an arc.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Eb...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Zl...=w1024-h768-no

And then there’s this. Working with some new contacts and partners I met at SEMA, there’s a real possibility I’ll be able to push the engine back a significant amount. In addition to recentering from the factory position, the weight balance should be much more favorable.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/rb...=w1024-h768-no

I’ve been working on a revised plan for the rear chassis and the front suspension, and hope to have some clear updates on that in the next couple of weeks. Again, I’ve learned a lot in the last few weeks, and it’s better informed my approach to the suspension design.

In the meantime, I'm working the litany of open detail fab projects - firewall, finish weld and blend the rockers, etc.

David

Sounds awesome! I can't wait to see your updates. Good luck!

I’m glad to be back working on it, and plan to focus a good bit on this project in 2019.

David

Happy new year. Let's catch up.

The torque boxes are expanded slightly, and taper down to interface with the inner chassis supports. This is all .075" 14ga, as there's already plenty of 1/8" in the rockers and torque boxes.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/rX...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/HJ...=w1024-h768-no

Closed in, and I'm holding off on welding and blending until I get the inner chassis members measured, tacked, and ready.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/eY...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Hw...=w1024-h768-no

A good view of my office for the last few days.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Hz...=w1024-h768-no

Before I can measure for the inner chassis members, or even the rear suspension, the engine and trans have to be placed.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/IH...=w1024-h768-no

As we looked at earlier, the engine needs a deep setback to achieve the desired weight balance. It may come forward an inch or two from this position, but the shifter location is already close to ideal (for me).
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_Z...=w1024-h768-no

The assembly is offset to the passenger side by 1/2".
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/bY...=w1024-h768-no

Next up: fabricating the inner chassis members and motor and transmission mounts.

David

Insane! I love it.

Thanks man. It's a handful getting the powertrain placed exactly where I want it, but I'm fairly close. I like to take my time at points like these.

It started at 2-5/8" backset from the suspension centerline, and I've pushed it forward to 1-3/8" to gain some flexibility on the shifter location. I can use remote mount directly on the TR6060, or the forward placement on the T56 tailshaft I have yet to order and install.

After the inner chassis members, I'll be able to more finely place the engine and trans relative to the floor. It would be good to be able to have a (nearly) flat bottom beyond the bellhousing. It's fairly close - maybe another 1-1/2".

David

Sounds like a great plan. It's going to look awesome when done.

Let's catch up.

I've been working on powertrain placement, setting how much to offset it behind the front suspension and side to side, settling on:
1-3/8" backset and 1/2" offset to the passenger side.

From there, it was time to start figuring out how to mount this assembly into the chassis.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2i...=w1024-h768-no

The super offset Chris Alston Chassisworks mounts, mounted with the forward bias.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/nb...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/FN...=w1024-h768-no

Set. Time to design and fab.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Ly...gfoSP=s1024-no

Removed the upper core support mount to ease ingress/egress of the powertrain.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/w-...=w1024-h768-no

After some revisions, here's the mount and cradle design.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/jz...=w1024-h750-no

Loosely assembled on the bench.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/MQ...q=w477-h358-no

Mounts and overlays, all .110 mild steel.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/AB...z=w437-h328-no

Mocked up in my lumber yard of a Charger.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/y0...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/di...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/zg...=w1024-h768-no

How all the plates stack.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/UB...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/zb...=w1024-h768-no

The tradeoff is that it takes a lot of filler and argon, but it's a light and efficient and stiff design.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Wj...=w1024-h767-no

David

Consequently, I've been TIG welding for a couple of days now.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/0w..._=w437-h328-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/iJ...=w1024-h768-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/zW...l6Ong=s1024-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/r-...=w1024-h767-no

More time coming up under the hood.

David

Beautiful work David! Why the offset to the passenger side?

Also, did you have the plates for the front cradle cut or...?

Andrew

Thanks, Andrew. The plates were plasma’d using a friends arclight table. I drew up the design in BendTech.

Offset is for a few reasons - more room for my feet and rear end (I’m 6’3” with a size 12), some weight balance for a 220 lb driver, and an easier packaging of the steering column and brake booster.

David

David,

The offset makes perfect sense, given your goals.

Can you elaborate more on the material used in the crossmember and why it was built the way it was, etc...?

Andrew

love the engine cradle