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-   -   Budget '69 Camaro Track Car - NO WHINERS! (https://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php?t=34130)

Flash68 06-28-2013 09:45 AM

With as fast as you are and a constantly improving suspension with tuning I am surprised this motor has lasted as long as it has without an accusump or dry sump.

Vince@Meanstreets 06-28-2013 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flash68 (Post 490045)
With as fast as you are and a constantly improving suspension with tuning I am surprised this motor has lasted as long as it has without an accusump or dry sump.

With his increased speeds and forces he will be seeing soon its going to have to happen but not at the expense of other very important aspects of the car that shall be left unidentified.

Gaetano and I need to sit down and pin point actual issues and correect them. Doing that on a budget is tough on all of us. One change at a time.

Flash68 06-28-2013 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vince@MSperfab (Post 490049)
With his increased speeds and forces he will be seeing soon its going to have to happen but not at the expense of other very important aspects of the car that shall be left unidentified.

Gaetano and I need to sit down and pin point actual issues and correect them. Doing that on a budget is tough on all of us. One change at a time.

Certainly you guys have a handle on it and are the only ones to decide the priority order best for you guys, but I would think protecting a very expensive aluminum block monster would be pretty high. :peepwall:

I was very glad to hear G purchased a full set of proper safety attire recently. :thumbsup:

Ron in SoCal 06-28-2013 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flash68 (Post 490050)
I was very glad to hear G purchased a full set of proper safety attire recently. :thumbsup:

x2! :hail: :thumbsup:

Vince@Meanstreets 06-28-2013 11:36 AM

Don't get me wrong, there is a valid point in oiling protection but at this point is it truly a concern if he has adequate oil pressure, adequate oil cooling and filtering. With this type of usage engine failure is unpredictable but safeguards within his ability are in place. Come winter this car gets its planned teardown. It has been through three seasons with one failure.
We can throw tons of money at it now and it might fail just due to age. You never know and what I do know is we need to address the concerns that I can't mention without getting the stink eye.

It took him this long to replace his home depot bucket for a real one and thats only cause I took a dump in it. ROFL

intocarss 06-28-2013 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flash68 (Post 490050)

I was very glad to hear G purchased a full set of proper safety attire recently. :thumbsup:

IT'S ABOUT TIME AND I HOPE YOU DO THE SAME

Track Junky 06-28-2013 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas69 (Post 490015)
A properly plumbed accumulator will use a one way valve or drain back filter so the oil is pushed from the accumulator right into the main galley. Payton is right, it will lube the crank and fill the pan so the pump doesn't cavitate. There is a pressure gauge on the accumulator with the manual valve. You just subtract the 6psi precharge off the total. I would simply rev up the engine with my right hand and close it at say 60 or 70 psi.

My understanding of the accumulators with the mechanical valves is that they will kick in at the oil pressure it was shut down at. If your shutting it down at 60 or 70 it wouldn't dispurse until you reached 60 or 70.

Sieg 06-28-2013 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vince@MSperfab (Post 490068)
It took him this long to replace his home depot bucket for a real one and thats only cause I took a dump in it. ROFL

Now that's motivational!

Vegas69 06-28-2013 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490162)
My understanding of the accumulators with the mechanical valves is that they will kick in at the oil pressure it was shut down at. If your shutting it down at 60 or 70 it wouldn't dispurse until you reached 60 or 70.

Your overthinking this whole deal. Once the manual valve is open, engine oil pressure and accumulator pressure are equal. If you start to lose oil pressure in a corner, the accumulator piston will simply push oil into the engine until pressure resumes to normal, then the accumulator piston will return and the cylinder will be at full capacity. It only reacts to a decrease in oil pressure on the engine side. It's like a shock for your suspension.

Flash68 06-28-2013 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vince@MSperfab (Post 490068)

It took him this long to replace his home depot bucket for a real one and thats only cause I took a dump in it. ROFL

That's one way to :gitrdun:

:D

Quote:

Originally Posted by intocarss (Post 490159)
IT'S ABOUT TIME AND I HOPE YOU DO THE SAME

I got everything except a HANS and it's on the shopping list.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas69 (Post 490195)
Your overthinking this whole deal. Once the manual valve is open, engine oil pressure and accumulator pressure are equal. If you start to lose oil pressure in a corner, the accumulator piston will simply push oil into the engine until pressure resumes to normal, then the accumulator piston will return and the cylinder will be at full capacity. It only reacts to a decrease in oil pressure on the engine side. It's like a shock for your suspension.

Don't mess with the SAE mechanic. :rules:

Vegas69 06-28-2013 10:57 PM

Really good article... http://www.stockcarracing.com/techar..._accumulators/

FETorino 06-28-2013 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas69 (Post 490195)
Your overthinking this whole deal. Once the manual valve is open, engine oil pressure and accumulator pressure are equal. If you start to lose oil pressure in a corner, the accumulator piston will simply push oil into the engine until pressure resumes to normal, then the accumulator piston will return and the cylinder will be at full capacity. It only reacts to a decrease in oil pressure on the engine side. It's like a shock for your suspension.

Todd is right :headscratch: Did I just say that :headscratch: Yea I did.

Another way to look at it. It's a big syringe. Setting it up the first time You put 50+ lbs of air into the back side with the engine off and the valve open. That pushes the piston all the way down. Then you bleed the air pressure down to about 10lbs.

Now you have an empty syringe. When the engine starts up the engine oil pressure fills the syringe and pressurizes the air on the backside. The syringe is set to give the shot.

If the oil pressure drops Dr Air pressure give it a nice smooth shot of oil.

As soon as the oil pressure rises back up the syringe refills.

Don't get confused by the valve. It doesn't do squat while the car is running. It's only purpose is to trap oil in the syringe when you shut the motor off. You have to close it before the motor is off so it traps oil in the syringe.

The only reason to run a cable or electric valve is convenience. You don't have to get out of the car while it is still running to trap the oil in the Accusump.

Hope I made it more confusing.:popcorn2:

Track Junky 06-29-2013 07:28 AM

Thanks for confirming that guys :thumbsup:

Vegas69 06-29-2013 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FETorino (Post 490213)
Todd is right :headscratch: Did I just say that :headscratch: Yea I did.

Another way to look at it. It's a big syringe. Setting it up the first time You put 50+ lbs of air into the back side with the engine off and the valve open. That pushes the piston all the way down. Then you bleed the air pressure down to about 10lbs.

Now you have an empty syringe. When the engine starts up the engine oil pressure fills the syringe and pressurizes the air on the backside. The syringe is set to give the shot.

If the oil pressure drops Dr Air pressure give it a nice smooth shot of oil.

As soon as the oil pressure rises back up the syringe refills.

Don't get confused by the valve. It doesn't do squat while the car is running. It's only purpose is to trap oil in the syringe when you shut the motor off. You have to close it before the motor is off so it traps oil in the syringe.

The only reason to run a cable or electric valve is convenience. You don't have to get out of the car while it is still running to trap the oil in the Accusump.

Hope I made it more confusing.:popcorn2:

That's a good analogy. There's a reason I'm not a teacher. :D

intocarss 06-29-2013 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas69 (Post 490256)
That's a good analogy. There's a reason I'm not a teacher. :D

You can teach things good... It's just that you'd scare the kids!!! :underchair: :poke:

intocarss 06-29-2013 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490243)
Thanks for confirming that guys :thumbsup:

Just hook it up and let her eat already JEEEEEEEZZ :headspin: :rules:

Track Junky 06-29-2013 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by intocarss (Post 490272)
Just hook it up and let her eat already JEEEEEEEZZ :headspin: :rules:

Wont be till after this track day so I'm going to try and refrain from pushing to hard.
Completed the alignment today and she's already loaded in the trailor.

Was up at 5:00 a.m.. Went to the grocery store to pick up food and drink for today and tomorrow. Picked up the trailor, loaded it, took the car for an alignment, loaded the car, then put fresh rubber on the hauler. And its only 11:45 a.m.. Gitter Dun!!!!!
Temp forecast has changed at T-Hill from 106 and is now supposed to be 108 on Sunday. Going to spend the day eating healthy and hydrating. :relax:

intocarss 06-29-2013 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490274)
Wont be till after this track day so I'm going to try and refrain from pushing to hard.
Completed the alignment today and she's already loaded in the trailor.

Was up at 5:00 a.m.. Went to the grocery store to pick up food and drink for today and tomorrow. Picked up the trailor, loaded it, took the car for an alignment, loaded the car, then put fresh rubber on the hauler. And its only 11:45 a.m.. Gitter Dun!!!!!
Temp forecast has changed at T-Hill from 106 and is now supposed to be 108 on Sunday. Going to spend the day eating healthy and hydrating. :relax:

YOU ARE A RACER ;)!!! BE SAFE GO FAST AND WHOOP SOME ASS :trophy-1302:

FETorino 06-29-2013 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490274)
Wont be till after this track day so I'm going to try and refrain from pushing to hard.
Completed the alignment today and she's already loaded in the trailor.

Was up at 5:00 a.m.. Went to the grocery store to pick up food and drink for today and tomorrow. Picked up the trailor, loaded it, took the car for an alignment, loaded the car, then put fresh rubber on the hauler. And its only 11:45 a.m.. Gitter Dun!!!!!
Temp forecast has changed at T-Hill from 106 and is now supposed to be 108 on Sunday. Going to spend the day eating healthy and hydrating. :relax:

Have a good time out there. :thumbsup: It's hotter than F:censored: down here. I feel like I'm in Austin except there is good food around the corner and decent beer to be found.

Looking at the thread made me think Accusump probably has their instructions on line. Even better, they have a FAQ page. I'd read through that before I listen to the Jackstand Army members.:innocent:

http://www.accusump.com/accusump_tech.html

Track Junky 06-29-2013 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FETorino (Post 490315)
Have a good time out there. :thumbsup: It's hotter than F:censored: down here. I feel like I'm in Austin except there is good food around the corner and decent beer to be found.

Looking at the thread made me think Accusump probably has their instructions on line. Even better, they have a FAQ page. I'd read through that before I listen to the Jackstand Army members.:innocent:

http://www.accusump.com/accusump_tech.html

Thanks Rob. Once the Accusump gets delivered I'm sure I'll get all kinds of literature on it but I'm glad I got you guys to watch my back. 10 heads are always better than one.
Its 104 in El Dorado Hills right now but I'm good. Chillin' inside with the ac on.
Cooler is in the garage and I will be filling it in the morning before I leave. You can be sure that that cooler will have 4 Guinesse's in it and at the end of the day tomorrow you can count on at least two of those being thrown past my tonsils. The other two will be providing back up just in case. :thumbsup:

intocarss 06-29-2013 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490320)
Thanks Rob. Once the Accusump gets delivered I'm sure I'll get all kinds of literature on it but I'm glad I got you guys to watch my back. 10 heads are always better than one.
Its 104 in El Dorado Hills right now but I'm good. Chillin' inside with the ac on.
Cooler is in the garage and I will be filling it in the morning before I leave. You can be sure that that cooler will have 4 Guinesse's in it and at the end of the day tomorrow you can count on at least two of those being thrown past my tonsils. The other two will be providing back up just in case. :thumbsup:


You ever think about getting a cool vest, Lots of models out there ..here's one


http://autofabcart.net/stroudcoolvest.aspx

Track Junky 06-29-2013 06:20 PM

If I had a bit more advance notice/time I probably would have went with something like this.
http://www.ogracing.com/media/catalo.../1/213_web.jpg

intocarss 06-29-2013 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490327)
If I had a bit more advance notice/time I probably would have went with something like this.



http://ts2.mm.bing.net/th?id=H.49370...h=175&c=7&rs=1

THOSE ARE NICE Mr :G-Dub:

HERE THIS PLACE IS IN LONG BEACH CA

http://www.goodvibesracing.com/DeistSafetyKoolVest.htm

Track Junky 06-29-2013 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by intocarss (Post 490328)
THOSE ARE NICE Mr :G-Dub:

HERE THIS PLACE IS IN LONG BEACH CA

http://www.goodvibesracing.com/DeistSafetyKoolVest.htm

Yeah right. I wish cash was flowing like that for me. Replaced the link with the correct picture.

I think the vest you showed was more for the quarter mile felller's that are out of their cars in seconds.

intocarss 06-29-2013 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490331)
Yeah right. I wish cash was flowing like that for me. Replaced the link with the correct picture.

I think the vest you showed was more for the quarter mile felller's that are out of their cars in seconds.

I never wore one. my friends did and theirs lasted a couple of hours.. Do some research big guy.. Think about it you're freezing ice packs that go into the vest :newbie:

Track Junky 06-29-2013 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by intocarss (Post 490341)
I never wore one. my friends did and theirs lasted a couple of hours.. Do some research big guy.. Think about it you're freezing ice packs that go into the vest :newbie:

:lol: :lol: :lol: Yeah, I'll think about it. OK I've thought about it....

The guys I've run with in the past use cool suits just like I pictured. If I ever want to nut up thats the direction I'll be going drag racer :hello:

intocarss 06-29-2013 08:27 PM

:gitrdun: :patriot:

GregWeld 06-29-2013 09:04 PM

Just so you know -- they sell the whole set up at the shop at T-Hill.... But my guess is -- they might just be out of stock this weekend!!


Have fun up there buddy!

Vegas69 06-29-2013 10:14 PM

Sweat your balls off, you can likely use it as I haven't seen you around my Healthy 101 thread in some time. :D

Vince@Meanstreets 06-30-2013 11:34 AM

he's on his 3rd session and he should be posting times after lunch. So far all the changes are working for him.

engine temp is 190 max

Sieg 06-30-2013 12:01 PM

Temps good assuming it 85-90* already.

How's the oil pressure?

Vince@Meanstreets 06-30-2013 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sieg (Post 490446)
Temps good assuming it 85-90* already.

How's the oil pressure?

he just said it was fine. I assume its good cause if it was bad I'd hear it.

He should be done with session 3 now. shows its 91 degrees up there now.

intocarss 06-30-2013 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vince@MSperfab (Post 490441)
he's on his 3rd session and he should be posting times after lunch. So far all the changes are working for him.

engine temp is 190 max

I didn't realize this was today DOH

Vince@Meanstreets 06-30-2013 05:05 PM

I guess he fell asleep in his arm chair?

Track Junky 06-30-2013 06:21 PM

Just got home. Had a good time. If the track wasn't so slick from the heat I probably would have had a great time. The track was very, very slick. In all the years I have been doing this I have only been 4 wheels off one time. Today I was 4 wheels off twice. Brought the car around in turn three in the third session and drove all four wheels in the grass on the inside. No big deal as I was able to counter enough to drive straight on through to turn 4. Session four I went 4 wheels off in turn 4 and couldn't counter quick enough to keep me pointed in the right direction. Ended up with th back of my car pointed toward turn 5 bypass. Car stalled. Fired it up and got back on the track. The fastest guy getting timed in open class was driving a newer Z06 and at the end of the day he was only faster by .300 of a second. His name was Brian Lock. I'd seen his name on the NCRC site often when I'd take a look at track times and remembeed his name becaus he was always the fastest guy at least 90% of the time. Very cool guy and we talked for awhile. The new rear sway bar set up is doing its job. Car is feeling neutral again.

Thanks to Todd and his Healthy 101 thread I feel great. Still have a ton of energy. I'm amazed.

I'll start loading photos and see if I got anything out of the Go Pro as it was acting up.

Sieg 06-30-2013 06:29 PM

The inside of three :sieg: .........your entry speed wasn't nearly fast enough!

Glad you had a good time buddy, greasy track is no time to try and set records, just keep pace amongst the fast group.

300-400TW rubber may have actually produced better times in this heat???

dstryr 06-30-2013 07:00 PM

Glad my sway bar clamp I made for you guys worked LOL

Track Junky 06-30-2013 07:05 PM

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/a...3/NCRC5541.jpg
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/a...3/NCRC3539.jpg
http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/a...3/NCRC5584.jpg

Vince@Meanstreets 06-30-2013 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Track Junky (Post 490525)
Just got home. Had a good time. If the track wasn't so slick from the heat I probably would have had a great time. The track was very, very slick. In all the years I have been doing this I have only been 4 wheels off one time. Today I was 4 wheels off twice. Brought the car around in turn three in the third session and drove all four wheels in the grass on the inside. No big deal as I was able to counter enough to drive straight on through to turn 4. Session four I went 4 wheels off in turn 4 and couldn't counter quick enough to keep me pointed in the right direction. Ended up with th back of my car pointed toward turn 5 bypass. Car stalled. Fired it up and got back on the track. The fastest guy getting timed in open class was driving a newer Z06 and at the end of the day he was only faster by .300 of a second. His name was Brian Lock. I'd seen his name on the NCRC site often when I'd take a look at track times and remembeed his name becaus he was always the fastest guy at least 90% of the time. Very cool guy and we talked for awhile. The new rear sway bar set up is doing its job. Car is feeling neutral again.

Thanks to Todd and his Healthy 101 thread I feel great. Still have a ton of energy. I'm amazed.

I'll start loading photos and see if I got anything out of the Go Pro as it was acting up.

Now we have to sit and determine if the sway bar change induced snap over steer or if your tires just weren't working with the track. I predicted that you would have to tune for neutrality and just not tight.

Vince@Meanstreets 06-30-2013 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dstryr (Post 490528)
Glad my sway bar clamp I made for you guys worked LOL

needs some tweeking but it is working great. I'll be modifying the bar this winter.


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