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-   -   1968 Camaro "Badmotorfinger" v2.2 (https://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php?t=28515)

Flash68 04-12-2012 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by preston (Post 407344)
One regret I have on my engine was building it with Eagle/SCAT rods and crank. Not that they haven't performed, I've had no problems. But I want to support American manufacturing and companies as much as I can (used a DART block and AFR heads at least).

There was the cost of course. I don't know what other people's experiences are,and maybe this was more with the crank then the rods as I already had the rods for this buildup, it seemed like it was going to be a nominal 6 week lead time to get a crank (which means 10 weeks in the real world). Whereas SCAT and Eagle both had the crank in every configuration ready to ship (ie juggling main and rod sizes and balance options).

Some people seem like they spend years buying parts and putting together an engine. I tend to pull a damaged engine and want to get it back in the car asap. My machinist already takes long enough to get it out the door as it is, and he will barely glance at your engine after teardown until all the parts are sitting on the build table. I just couldn't take spending MORE THAN TWICE as much for a crank and then also having to wait who knows how long (BTW this was for a 427 Windsor with small 2.5" mains and chevy rod journals, zero balance).

That was my experience anyway. Next time I replace rods I will go USA and name brand - If I can get them! Maybe I just didn't talk to the right people or try hard enough but seems like they all had a long lead time.

Greg since you are on this thread (well, you are on every thread), do you have an engine builder you like in the NW ? Who do you plan on taking your Mustang engine too ? PM if you want to avoid thread jacking.

I hear you and won't argue your support of American products, and I don't wanna tangent into anything political or too controversial, but I have no issue with buying overseas stuff if it's decent quality. With regard to machine work - that's where the Americans come in and make sure it's up to snuff. :D

I am a business owner and I feel that if someone somewhere else can do better than me (or just as good) for a better price, then good for them. Asian and overseas products get a bad rap for a lot of stuff, but our dear Americans churn out a lot of junk too unfortunately. Like anything... caveat emptor. :thumbsup:


Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 407355)
I have special jacking privileges

Greg! That is TMI buddy... TMI! :rofl:

makoshark 04-12-2012 03:18 PM

The forged Eagle stuff is nice, strong stuff. However, they are rarely within spec. Ask any machinist, they will tell you. My Eagle forged crank had to be blueprinted due to it being so far out of spec.

GregWeld 04-12-2012 03:23 PM

So then --- what part of that is "nice"?


Don't answer - it's rhetorical question. Just saying' --- that if you buy parts and have to completely rework them -- then the prices are "cheap".... so you might as well have paid for a good piece that IS nice.

makoshark 04-12-2012 03:27 PM

The nice part about them was they were free to me:yes:

intocarss 04-12-2012 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by makoshark (Post 407380)
The forged Eagle stuff is nice, strong stuff. However, they are rarely within spec. Ask any machinist, they will tell you. My Eagle forged crank had to be blueprinted due to it being so far out of spec.

100% correct... Eagle is not machined here, It's done in China. I ran SCAT stuff in my 1,000 Hp n/a 540 drag eng, because they are machined in the USA (and my budget) . They are still going strong after 7 years and 300+ runs seeing 8,200 rpm and some of those were with a 250 shot of N2o

Can't stress enough, That with the proper parts, clearances, balancing and and a very very clean assembly and routine maintenance is the key to making an engine live I do also agree that as far as "longevity" the China stuff won't last as long as the high $$ stuff

At the end of each season at the very least I changed valve springs, Lifters (rollers) Timing belt (Jessel) & rod bolts (ARP 2000) Every other season was bearings and rings if needed

And for what it's worth some of the big brand Co's do have their lower level $ stuff made in China but it's machined here

Disclaimer.. I am in NO way pushing China products and I am in full support of buying AMERICAN but sometimes you can't

makoshark 04-12-2012 03:47 PM

Scat is definitely the way to go for durable entry level parts ready to go out of the box. Mine was remachined in the USA:lol:

Ron in SoCal 04-12-2012 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sik68 (Post 407333)
:hail: Very cool!

I can think of some expensive rods...Crower stuff can get pretty astronomical. They are, per the analogy, the Megan Fox of belt notches.

Ahaha...thx Steven! Maybe I'll rename my car Megan :D I used Crower billet Max-lites. At first we ordered Oliver road race rods. When they arrived we weighed them - 630 gms each IIRC. So we backtracked to Crower. Final rod weight was 580 gms. I was all over that.

I agree w Greg. Rod selection is critical...::lateral:

Flash68 04-12-2012 03:59 PM

Bottom line... no matter what rods we get... they are getting the full body cavity search by Mike and will be 100% made ready to go. :thumbsup:


Ron in SoCal 04-12-2012 04:08 PM

^ What are you trying to say Dave?

I'll let Todd take this one...:lol:

Flash68 04-12-2012 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by intocarss (Post 407389)
100% correct... Eagle is not machined here, It's done in China. I ran SCAT stuff in my 1,000 Hp n/a 540 drag eng, because they are machined in the USA (and my budget) . They are still going strong after 7 years and 300+ runs seeing 8,200 rpm and some of those were with a 250 shot of N2o

Can't stress enough, That with the proper parts, clearances, balancing and and a very very clean assembly and routine maintenance is the key to making an engine live I do also agree that as far as "longevity" the China stuff won't last as long as the high $$ stuff

At the end of each season at the very least I changed valve springs, Lifters (rollers) Timing belt (Jessel) & rod bolts (ARP 2000) Every other season was bearings and rings if needed

And for what it's worth some of the big brand Co's do have their lower level $ stuff made in China but it's machined here

Disclaimer.. I am in NO way pushing China products and I am in full support of buying AMERICAN but sometimes you can't

I agree Jerry. My PBM block was cast in China but it is machined here... and will be checked over and have final machining done at Watson. 2 American layers of work after the Chinese layer. :thumbsup:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron in SoCal (Post 407393)
Ahaha...thx Steven! Maybe I'll rename my car Megan :D I used Crower billet Max-lites. At first we ordered Oliver road race rods. When they arrived we weighed them - 630 gms each IIRC. So we backtracked to Crower. Final rod weight was 580 gms. I was all over that.

I agree w Greg. Rod selection is critical...::lateral:

That's another thing.... these CAT rods are pretty heavy. Another reason I am looking at a something sub 600 grams ideally.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron in SoCal (Post 407397)
^ What are you trying to say Dave?

I'll let Todd take this one...:lol:

I'm not sure if that's worse for Todd... or me. :_paranoid

6D9 04-12-2012 06:27 PM

Damn Dave that sounds like she is going to be one rowdy girl! Should be badass and something different from the ls route.

Rod P 04-12-2012 10:07 PM

pictures Dave we need pictures!!!!!! :willy: I cant handle it without pictures

fleet 04-13-2012 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rod P (Post 407470)
pictures Dave we need pictures!!!!!! :willy: I cant handle it without pictures

Agreed, my show-touring section in photobucket is kinda sparse with BubbleButt not completed yet.

Flash68 04-13-2012 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6D9 (Post 407420)
Damn Dave that sounds like she is going to be one rowdy girl! Should be badass and something different from the ls route.

Thanks Ron. I really think this is going to be a bang for buck motor too when final numbers are compared with those other guys (LS).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rod P (Post 407470)
pictures Dave we need pictures!!!!!! :willy: I cant handle it without pictures

Rod that's all I got buddy! :willy:

Quote:

Originally Posted by compos mentis (Post 407567)
Agreed, my show-touring section in photobucket is kinda sparse with BubbleButt not completed yet.

paging Dr Renner...

DFRESH 04-13-2012 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flash68 (Post 407577)

paging Dr Renner...

Is this some sort of a slam or a degrading remark? Being mentioned in the same vicinity as BubbleButt leaves me feeling uncertain about how to effectively respond, given your current city locale and the name of your car being stinkyfinger---or something like that.

Dub

fleet 04-13-2012 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFRESH (Post 407613)
Is this some sort of a slam or a degrading remark? Being mentioned in the same vicinity as BubbleButt leaves me feeling uncertain about how to effectively respond, given your current city locale and the name of your car being stinkyfinger---or something like that.

Dub

:lol:


The Dub is good, long live the Dub.

:woot:

Vegas69 04-13-2012 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 407328)
This might be new news for you young guys -- but choosing your rod is critical, unlike choosing which bimbo you're going to notch your belt with (pre engagement days). :unibrow:

WTF.... It's my wallet -- go for the best!

I just can't believe you beat Doug to Daddy Warbucks wallet. I would've bet the farm on Douglas. :unibrow: :lol:

Flash68 04-13-2012 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas69 (Post 407621)
I just can't believe you beat Doug to Daddy Warbucks wallet. I would've bet the farm on Douglas. :unibrow: :lol:

G-Dub knows how to align himself with winners :D

Shouldn't you be out trying to keep up with some Mopars about now?

Vegas69 04-13-2012 06:35 PM

Was hoping to get out there today but I had a good client in town and that F'd that idea. Tomorrow looks like wind and rain so I may go to the SCCA event on Sunday and skip the Mats deal.

DFRESH 04-13-2012 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas69 (Post 407621)
I just can't believe you beat Doug to Daddy Warbucks wallet. I would've bet the farm on Douglas. :unibrow: :lol:

I have Greg's respect--to some, that's much more important.

That being said, Greg, if you are giving away blocks, crankshafts and various car parts, i'll be glad to allow some slide on the respect scale. :lol:

Love the GW---can't imagine what we would do without him---I still remember when I thought he was the other Greg Weld--way back when---

And remember when DG was a wee lad with a pro charged 68 and a Porsh?

Todd was just a normal Camaro guy---

Skip, well, Skip is still exactly as he was---happy, trusting in the right God, the only one that matters

Payton had a street car---

We wondering about Auto X and Road Courses---

Optima meant a battery--not a sudden urge to spend 100k for a single event

Man, that was only like 4 years ago---shoot--maybe 3---

Anyways, GW, if you would like to continue to be a part of transforming my race car into an extreme hardcore PT car (Silver State, One Lap, etc), just let Rodger know. Oops, let the secret slip---no photos yet. Soon---but we will keep the Pro Charger and limit it to about 16 pds---for something over 1000RWHP. Racepak/MSD is on board along with Morrison, ProCharger and CARS. Just need a new front sub and someone to fab it into the rest of the car---You in?

DUB A LICIOUS

Ron in SoCal 04-13-2012 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas69 (Post 407621)
I just can't believe you beat Doug to Daddy Warbucks wallet. I would've bet the farm on Douglas. :unibrow: :lol:

^ That'd be a good bet. I think Dub Renner just took the lead...:lateral:

fleet 04-13-2012 08:06 PM

Wow, Doug, now that's what I call a creative accounting. :cool:

If your building a brand folks, that's how you do it. As this is seen all over the world, 'The Renner Legend' label surely is multiplying in scope and depth. :unibrow:

Seriously Doug, thanks for the complimentis. ;)

Flash68 04-13-2012 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFRESH (Post 407613)
Is this some sort of a slam or a degrading remark? Being mentioned in the same vicinity as BubbleButt leaves me feeling uncertain about how to effectively respond, given your current city locale and the name of your car being stinkyfinger---or something like that.

Dub

Stinkyfinger promises to be nice to Wanda once she takes her pro touring training wheels off.


Quote:

Originally Posted by DFRESH (Post 407647)
I have Greg's respect--to some, that's much more important.

That being said, Greg, if you are giving away blocks, crankshafts and various car parts, i'll be glad to allow some slide on the respect scale. :lol:

Love the GW---can't imagine what we would do without him---I still remember when I thought he was the other Greg Weld--way back when---

And remember when DG was a wee lad with a pro charged 68 and a Porsh?

Todd was just a normal Camaro guy---

Skip, well, Skip is still exactly as he was---happy, trusting in the right God, the only one that matters

Payton had a street car---

We wondering about Auto X and Road Courses---

Optima meant a battery--not a sudden urge to spend 100k for a single event

Man, that was only like 4 years ago---shoot--maybe 3---

Anyways, GW, if you would like to continue to be a part of transforming my race car into an extreme hardcore PT car (Silver State, One Lap, etc), just let Rodger know. Oops, let the secret slip---no photos yet. Soon---but we will keep the Pro Charger and limit it to about 16 pds---for something over 1000RWHP. Racepak/MSD is on board along with Morrison, ProCharger and CARS. Just need a new front sub and someone to fab it into the rest of the car---You in?

DUB A LICIOUS

Hey get out of here with that... get your own Greg Weld. :lol:

Nice review of the last 4 years of Lat G indeed..... :thumbsup:

If you do actually build this hardcore PT car, will you please name it "FAIR"? :thumbsup:

DFRESH 04-13-2012 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flash68 (Post 407660)

Hey get out of here with that... get your own Greg Weld. :lol:

Nice review of the last 4 years of Lat G indeed..... :thumbsup:

If you do actually build this hardcore PT car, will you please name it "FAIR"? :thumbsup:

LOL--get your own GW---that was a good one.

If it happens, we will call it "Stupid".

If GW climbs on board, we will call in "Investing 666"

BG WNDA

ironworks 04-13-2012 09:55 PM

Boy walking into this thread and looking around on this thread is like walking to a room and finding 2 people you did not even know were dating are kissing all over each other on the couch.

Just a little bit awkward, As you were. :_paranoid :_paranoid :_paranoid

Way too much heavy petting in for me.

DFRESH 04-13-2012 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ironworks (Post 407667)
Boy walking into this thread and looking around on this thread is like walking to a room and finding 2 people you did not even know were dating are kissing all over each other on the couch.

Just a little bit awkward, As you were. :_paranoid :_paranoid :_paranoid

Way too much heavy petting in for me.


XXX-OOO so you don't feel left out. You must be missing those bear hugs from Todd about now--u know, the ones where he picks you up off of your feet? I never wanted to say anything, but it's ok---not that there's anything wrong with that.

DR

DFRESH 04-13-2012 10:10 PM

Is this thead about Dave's car? I thought it was the Open Discussion section.

Vegas69 04-13-2012 10:11 PM

:lol:

Sieg 04-13-2012 10:35 PM

Priceless :D

Rod P 04-13-2012 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFRESH (Post 407672)
Is this thead about Dave's car? I thought it was the Open Discussion section.

Daves car?? who's Dave? what kinda car?

tones2SS 04-17-2012 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFRESH (Post 407672)
Is this thead about Dave's car? I thought it was the Open Discussion section.

lol :D

GregWeld 04-17-2012 05:54 PM

I'm glad I was gone to "the other Washington" and missed this whole "affair"...


Renner.... I have some left over wire from re-doing Rudy's Camaro... some of it's long enough you can still read the labels. Oh - and I have the diagrams too... you're welcome to them if you need it.

makoshark 04-17-2012 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rod P (Post 407677)
Daves car?? who's Dave? what kinda car?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7gWB7IzxtU

Rod P 04-17-2012 09:23 PM

its OK Dave I never gonna give up on you man!! LOL!!

RICK ROLLED!

:unibrow:

DFRESH 04-17-2012 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 408339)
I'm glad I was gone to "the other Washington" and missed this whole "affair"...


Renner.... I have some left over wire from re-doing Rudy's Camaro... some of it's long enough you can still read the labels. Oh - and I have the diagrams too... you're welcome to them if you need it.

Woo Hoooo! Big Wanda loves getting wired.

XX-OO

Flash68 04-19-2012 11:59 AM

I'm finding out cranks are in short supply these days unless you are very flexible with what you want. Got my order in for crank and rods. Going with medium to light weight stuff and small journal sizing. Mike didn't wanna do Honda journals (1.888) on this setup for longevity reasons.

Scat F43 lightweight 3.625 stroke, small journal (2.000), approx 44 lbs
Callies Compstar 6" H-beams w/ ARP2000 bolts, approx 590 grams

Heads are in the "cylinder head room" today and we should have flow and chamber numbers soon. Piston design and order will follow (Diamond first option, CP is backup). Mike likes the "boxed Nascar style" pistons he said for added strength and they apparently last quite a bit longer. He listened to me when we talked because his recommendations are consistent with the longevity theme I stressed.

Cam design will follow as well. Bullet is Plan A, CamMotion is Plan B.

Was really close to getting some dry sump parts together, but decided to KISS and stay wet sump and an accumulator. It works for many here and I didn't wanna make this a longer and costlier time than it is already. Dry sump will be V3.0 in a few years.

With the slight backlog at the shop and the slow delivery time for the crank (6-8 weeks), this is probably looking like a 10-12 week ETA from now to be safe. So that means June 30 @ Thunderhill ain't lookin good. I'll try to get a shakedown in July sometime as August will be hectic (wedding) and worst case I am shaking it down while passing Todd on the straight at Buttonwillow in Sept. :unibrow:

Now back to looking for that Braswell carb I want.....

EBMC 04-19-2012 12:22 PM

Hey Dave i may have a Braswell carb for you. I cant remember if I sold it or not. I can let you know tomorow.

GregWeld 04-19-2012 02:19 PM

I know of a couple of real p u s s i e s on here that once they commit to marriage the car parts go to the wayside... WTF?! Today I took Gwen out and bought her a helmet -- next thing you know she's shopping for driving shoes. :woot:

I'd say you p U s s i e s need to marry a little better maybe?

Flash68 04-19-2012 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EBMC (Post 408802)
Hey Dave i may have a Braswell carb for you. I cant remember if I sold it or not. I can let you know tomorow.

Steve, that'd be cool. Hopefully if you do have it, it's the right specs or at least close to it. Thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 408817)
I know of a couple of real p u s s i e s on here that once they commit to marriage the car parts go to the wayside... WTF?! Today I took Gwen out and bought her a helmet -- next thing you know she's shopping for driving shoes. :woot:

I'd say you p U s s i e s need to marry a little better maybe?

And you are referring to whom? :_paranoid

Hey Focker - my lady was at RTTC with me in full support mode. :D :woot: :thumbsup:

Vegas69 04-19-2012 02:55 PM

Good luck Pal. :unibrow: :lol:


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