The Simulator is an awesome training aid! You are very lucky to have access to one. I've used one and yeah....it's shocking!

I'm glad to see that you brought up cover. Big difference between cover and concealment. Best to know the difference.

Greg you bring up a lot of great talking points! I greatly appreciate you doing so. More and more I am amazed at the lack of knowledge people have when it comes to firearms on every level. I firmly believe that education is the key to so much in life, especially when it comes to a life and death subject like owning a firearm.

I hope everyone will seek out training and work to improve not only their skills, but also their knowledge base.

Curtis ---

I'm not smarter than anyone else - just luckier. I've got two good guys guiding me on this the whole way. When you have cops with decades of experience -- you get good info. Good access too... and then I've found even more camaraderie and info while at the range. It's truly amazing how these guys are willing to help and to share info IF you show that you're truly interested in learning. It helps too that I have way more time on my hands than I know what to do with. Let's face facts... most people have actual lives to live... they just can't put the time in... where I can get a phone call -- "hey! The sim is open do you want to come down and play?"

The "cover" thing was something I would never think about on my own. Who would? BTW -- the other thing that's being drilled into my little pea brain.... repetition/practice/and repeat again. This stuff needs to be done without even thinking about it when needed. That's why the officers train constantly. They need to just do - not think. No time to think only time to do.

Obviously we'd never train like these guys do - and that would be silly. We'll most likely be lucky enough to live our entire lives without ever having to draw down on someone. Let's hope that's true anyway. But still -- I feel a responsibility to be SAFER because I wouldn't ever want to injure someone accidentally...myself included. The little things like "what's beyond your target"... those things are critical! What if you shoot at an intruder and kill your neighbor? OMG!! How many windows and doors are almost perfectly aligned with the house next door or just across the street? We don't live in walled fortresses. You start popping off high powered rounds... they don't just stop and drop at your property line.

Anyway -- it's all good discussion. It's been very informative to sit and listen... and there's so many things to think about!


:thankyou:

Curtis brings up a good point. You can't make the decision to pull the trigger when someone kicks down your door. It needs to be made right now. All the simulating and practicing doesn't mean a damn thing if you won't pull the trigger.

Ducks at yardage with 28-30" barrel. At 5-7 yards with a tactical barrel my tests resulted in a 6" hole in plywood. Penetration could be upped with steel, Hevishot, or Bismuth. I hope you're not shooting pheasant with magnum loads unless you're making stew with them. :D

The 21' rule is THE RULE. We practice at the range with the target set at 21' and our weapon in typical conceal carry position a second person advances the target and you have to draw and fire. It reinforces that rule well. You have to be well practiced to place a double-tap.

Siegster....


Going into the sim room for the first time... holstering a weapon EXPECTING that there was going to be foul play.... But in the blink of an eye - you have to recognize - draw - decide that you need to pull the trigger.... That 21' gap is closed and the perp is all over you. AMAZING! As in OMG! So on the next scenario - you get all jumpy and squirt the guy and all he was doing was going for his registration...:lol: :lol: :lol:


By the end of the session -- things actually seem to slow down - your heart rate is better - you on target - you're not as jumpy... you're looking at things completely differently.

So - again.... I can't imagine waking up - dazed and confused - heart rate racing - fumbling for the great protector... it's pitch black...you didn't start this action by lighting the guy up for a traffic stop... so you're unprepared for the situation... and then all it really is.... your daughter is sneaking back into the house. (how many of US have been there done that!!)

I am very impressed with the direction this thread is going. My hope is that the discussion here will encourage people who own firearms to attend some sort of training course (or additional course).

Greg, you're not smarter, but you are putting forth the time and effort to improve you knowledge base. Just the mention of how crazy it was when you first started to use the simulator and now how it almost seems like things are slowing down is proof that you are improving. It's obvious that you are seeing more and more while thinking about 'what if's'. That's huge! It might sound corny, but I really don't care. It brings a huge smile to my face to hear about what you are doing and I am proud of you. Yes you have more free time than...well anyone I know, but there are tons of weekend courses out there. Plenty of gun ranges that are open in the evenings where one can shoot after work. There really isn't an excuse for not practicing. A person can even use a blue gun (or an unloaded one) at home for certain drills.

Todd, thank you for reinforcing my previous statement. I honestly believe that if you are buying any type of weapon for personal/home defense, that decision should be made before you buy your weapon. If you can't or won't use your weapon to take the life of another who is trying to do you or your loved ones harm, then it will most likely be used against you.

By the way Todd, if you would like to join me at the range I'd be more than willing to lend you one of my AR's and you're welcome to shoot any of my hand guns. Give me a call and let me know. Oh and I have something here at the house for you.

Greg - The friend/foe recognition adds a completely new dimension doesn't it!

That little drill we do at the range really is an eye opener for most gung-ho concealed carry people. If you set the stage you can create a little hype, add a little distraction, and not knowing when the target is going to start advancing and you realize 21' ain't nothing.

Taking a sight picture.....ain't happening.
Coat zipped or buttoned........ain't happening.
Fumbling the draw..........knifed.

You must put a lot of thought into where the gun is placed, what it's placed in, and what you conceal it with.

Practice the moves over and over and over. Clear, grip, draw, and get the muzzle on target asap. I try to have the muzzle rotating up onto the target as soon as it clears the holster/wasteband. My free hand joins the grip during that rotation, and first rounds are discharged without advancing the gun towards the threat. Pretty much like a gunfighter in a quick-draw fight.

Live fire practice and more practice until you can comfortably look the rounds into the center of mass from the hip or sternum height firing position at 15' with a stationary torso target. Once that's comfortable, start practicing on advancing targets. Teach yourself you do not need sights to place accurate shots.

It's a lot of fun and real challenging. :thumbsup:

Sieg...


The clear and get the muzzle on target has been shown to me... and this is another thing that folks don't think about --- without being shown -- prior I would draw - raise up arms extended - sight.... of course by that time I was already dead. :lol:


None of this is automatic of course... I still want to stand up straight instead of presenting the smallest possible target... and I still want to sight. I've only been in the sim 3 times now... my buddies have probably been in there 100's of times. They see stuff that I don't - you know - like the woman with the grocery cart 50 yards out directly back of the perp... just little things like that <grin>.

I know you've mentioned competition. It would be so much fun! I'm not allowed in the training area with the actual live fire and moving targets. That's police only. I'd love to be shown that area and be able to use it - but it's the busiest portion of the range.

Funny -- if you'd have asked me 6 months ago about owning a handgun I'd have said "Why would I want that?". But it was my friends that said I SHOULD have one given my plans with the new rig. They were aghast that I would park along side an interstate and go to sleep - or pull off into some "area" on a deserted state road somewhere. Since then - I've asked myself why I didn't do this years ago. It really is fun.

My hope is to NEVER have to even think about actually pointing it at someone. But I now know I'll sleep a lot better knowing it's there and that I kinda know how to use it.

+++++++++++++++++



Curtis,


Thanks!!

Here's a very good read with solid handgun techniques and tips: http://www.worldwidedojo.com/reality...steven-seagal/

People can say what they want about Seagal, but the man is a documented master with a 1911 in his hand. :guns: