GREAT VIDEO Greg!
the key to any of the suspension choices is balance!
when you assemble the suspension you dont just shove big bars on and soft springs and its all golden.....balance.... what does the car weigh, control arm lengths, pivot points for arms and rear suspension links, wheel base, track width, caster, camber, ride height, spring preload, sway bar ratio's, pivot points from center line, Shock valving and the LIST goes on, but once you have all of that and you combine it to find the sweet spot for that car (here is were experience and knowledge help) you get a car that is easy to push to the limits and has the desired neutral effect,,,and now that you get that... you can lightly tweak the car for under or over-steer to help with each track you encounter

"Like"

Hey Greg Weld,
Thanks for the kind words & sharing your experiences. We do have a lot of fun at the track.

:D

Sounds complicated Rod. :headspin:

Big bar vs soft springs
 

I also think the shock and spring technology has
come light years recently.. turning knobs actually does
something compared to times of the past.... guys like Ron know how
to interact the two in order to get the most out of a setup

I need to change my hood and front nose on my bird to
get over 100lbs off the front end (hopefully this winter)
then I can measure and weigh things for a real conversation
with Ron

Bob

Heck, I'm just glad Greg raised his camera a half inch so now I don't have to strain my neck to look over his hood!

:trophy-1302:

Nice driving Greg! Know what I noticed most besides your great lines...nary a whimper from the tires when you turn in to a corner. When you wanted to turn in, it just reacts smoothly and confidently. That makes everything else so much nicer when trying to get faster.

ha ha ha ha ha ...... yes it is! if it was easy everyone would be fast.....now when you getting your ass back out there? and drive? hope your doing well brother its been a minute

I'm right there with ya Lance -- when I watch those videos I'm trying my damnedest to sit up in my chair and and see over.... LOL


I hope people understand the points I'm trying to make using that video.... that is NOT about me... I own the car -- before and after --- I could have NEVER driven like that before the RSRT suspension re-do! NEVER! My driving has improved since we did this - but not because of anything I've done in particular.... but the CAR and the new suspension has allowed RON to turn into a coach instead of a hand holder. His coaching is every bit as valuable as his suspension knowledge. The two do work together and I get it.. but the one thing (car) has to work - before the other can do his job. I used to just fight that car to the death every session.... and as I've said before - now I don't want the sessions, or the weekend to end. I can't tell you how much of a change that has been.

I used to think it was ME... that I just sucked as a driver - that my buddies Charlie / Chet / Pete were just so much better drivers than I was.... that it was braking too deep - or that I was off line - or that I was going too fast for my ability.... I used to tell myself - WTF - It's just an old Mustang... what do you expect? Little did I know what I could expect!

Now -- when I see people WAY down track.... I know I'm catching them and I'm going to do so EASILY... I don't have to drive over my head (very low skill level)... I just know the car is beyond capable. Can't remember where I was on track - and Sutton radios me that the next car(s) to catch is a "X" whatever... Vette I think.... I don't respond to him immediately... but when I do - I told him "oh hell, I'm past them already". LOL. We both got a chuckle going on that one!

Back to Maier -- which kind of started all of this (and also the very unsportsmanlike bickering).... If I was going to auto cross.... I'd be talking to him. I'd be talking to several people... I have ZERO auto cross experience - and don't intend to change that at all. It's just not something I want to do. But I look at SSLance and the gains and improvements he's seen with his car... and it's not a car I would expect to see at ANY auto cross event! You read his thread and you'll see he has had similar improvements to his set up --- and he's done this in stages -- which is the way I would assume most would do. So you don't have to go out and cut your car up to gain some meaningful handling change.

so on the second part of that is why I often recommend using a kit from a single manufacture as much as possible, and what ever they dont make find out what they recommend....thats a great place to start.... like if your going to use Mike Maier suspension stuff and since he doesn't make a shock what does he prefer to run... what does he like for steering components, and so on...and that would be what is optimal for his suspension....

I'm not saying that just because you use one manufactures stuff on the whole car the car will be perfect...I recently worked on a car that had awesome chassis and suspension products built by one single company and once all the measurements that i described earlier where gone over I still had to fix some issues with stuff within allowable parameters....there suspension required tall lower ball joints and the steering rack to be moved upwards different springs than they sold in there kit along with a shock valving change and a bumpsteer kit....

and after that the car was easier to drive and neutral ....that owner is very happy now

its not easy

I figured I should make this clear and show what stage I'm at. I think its been two years ago now that I bought a camaro with a clean title for reaalllll cheap(with lots of rust). Its purely a skeleton, needing most sheetmetal replaced(roof, quarters, fenders, rockers, trunk, etc...) leaving me a blank slate. I haven't started actual work on the car yet, mostly planning and putting the stock frame rails into solidworks. I intend to build the car all in one shot, so unless something doesn't go to plan there won't be phases. In theory, a thread will be started soon.:lateral: :superhack:

https://lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=23997

you should check out this thread.

I may have started a little further out than you are...

http://i1138.photobucket.com/albums/...pse7746a8b.jpg

I went with Ron Sutton as well on my suspension design

I followed your thread, my car isn't too far off from that. No engine, everything under the car is useless to me except the subframe, and half the body needs to be replaced. There's a reason why family thinks I'm crazy for doing this project. :lostmarbles:

Definitely have, I've been through the whole thing start to finish 3 times and gone back a lot, it has been of great help.

Depending on your plan, starting with a rough car is the way to go if you plan on doing something radical.

Looking forward to your build thread

Man, I love Brian's Camaro. Mike & him did an awesome job on that car.


:cheers:

been there ...built that

http://i752.photobucket.com/albums/x...psohkmtmsq.jpg




here's the story on my car on BangShift

Didn't anyone ever tell you guys... "Buy the body, build the drivetrain"

:buttkick:

2007

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...S/Outside5.jpg

2015

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/cU...e=w960-h637-no

:gitrdun:

That's exactly what I did with TOW!

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m...ps7012a26f.jpg

25 year old paint job. It's shows its wear, but put me years ahead on the project!

to follow up on this....I can not mention some of these customers names (many are top in the industry and dont wish to have this help reveled) I will say that most of the re-configurations done to these top drivers cars was with Rons input...and these drivers look for that sharp edge to help them stay up top...

my own car was under the knife to have Rons help last season and I hurriedly put her back together to move to another state and shop, so Jane isnt even the Jane of last year, but this winter she will have the suspension picked at, re-examined, and move as needed, I know it will be an investment in time and money to Jane back on top along with a second project to run next season....hopefully...I do know that one will be a SEMA car ..that booth is already slotted

you speak in tongues :poke: :D :popcorn2:

time to do the extreme upgrade rod.

This thread came up around the BBQ last night - with SpeedTech and Mary Pozzi and a couple others.... Three things were the main topic.


#1 - How quickly the discussion became NON LAT G like. All said the reason we love Lat G is because it remains a welcoming non flaming website.


#2 - How many DIFFERENT WAYS there were - and how many good manufactures there were - to achieve handling that's right for the task(s).


#3 - Biggest part that could be improved, was the nut behind the wheel. LOL

I dont know what is better or worse, but I believe that if you are gonna drive your car much on the street and use it as a driver.

Softer springs and stiff anti roll bars could make it a bit more comfortable ride maybe.

I may not be right though. Even though maybe hard bushings is the worst comfort killer of all.

I remember reading an old magazine article on second gens.

Herb Adams vs Dick Guldstrand I think it was, they had "soft vs stiff" setup. Different opinions. Same goal.

I've got PolyUrethane body bushings, 100% delrin suspension bushings, and a Big Bar Soft Spring setup and my car rides fantastic on the street. It's one of my favorite features of this setup, well that and the way it turns at speed.

Mary Pozzi was very impressed with you and your driving!! Just FYI.

That's a real compliment right there folks! Your the man Lance!

I agree with this statement more than any other involving car racing...

Mary is quite possibly one of the nicest people I have met thru this racing adventure. So many want time from her at an event and from what I have seen she doesn't turn any of them away. True ambassador of the sport.