You don't want the Z06 rotors, they are junk.

??? Why! Why!! Why!!! I need to know why!!!!

if you read whats in teh link that I provided on the first page, you would know. You seem to be too busy defending yourself instead of listening.

I find this funny, on a differnet forum, I find you giving peope this advice, sounds just like what we are telling you, but for some reason you don't like hearing it.

Posted by nitrorocket on another board:
"
Just a question? What is the most powerful car you have driven or been in?? 1000 hp is NOT childs play. It may sound like a nice easy roung number, but that is serious power. I rarely ever use my power. On the street I only use about 700 hp of it tops! Even 700 hp is hard to control, I would sure hate to always have to worry about shifting not to mention that you will ALWAYS be spinning the tires and shifting in the middle of a controlled slide could be a little dangerous!! .......
I am not trying to shoot you down in any way, I am just offering the best advice I can give to make your life a little easier and cheaper."

But you do have a legitimate question, and IMO you have recieved a TON of good info on both your brake/suspension and some really good info on trackdays etc. Hey you must already know everything, I mean even if every single person posting on this thread says the same thing, hey who cares, thats not the info you asked for, right?

oh and heres what my tire looked like after 3 trackdays and was toast; so be prepared to start spending money on tires if you want to go fast
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/4301/p1010232zo4.jpg
:D :D

go c5 calipers with z-51 front rotors (13-3/8) do not use the zo6 14 inch rotors for one have fun making it work and two they weigh like 26 lbs or something

probably won't fit with his 17" wheels, and plus the problem with the Z51 rotors is the same as the Z06 which is the fact you can only get 2 left hand side rotors. The right side is not going to cool very well due too the vents being faced backwards. Plus they are crossdrilled. THey should be good for a street car, but for a track where you see 150mph repeadetly I would stay away from them. Actually I would stay away from them for any track time. 6, 20 minute sessions in one day will toast an inadequate rotor if you are pushing it at all.

What does a c5 rotor weight?? From what I have actually found, the new Zo6 brake problem seems to be the calipers??

i agree about the cross drilled but, but i highly doubt vettes are the only ones that use the same rotor left and right, lets see some proof that a non cross drilled rotor will not work well for a non race car doing some track days.
wheres carlc or the orange crush dude

What are you talking about? Of course a non cross drilled rotor will work fine???? And neither of those guys are running 2 left hand side rotors. That is the prob, way worse than crossdrilling. If you look at some rotors, the vanes inbetween the pad surfaces are sometimes just straight, meaning that you can use them on either the left or the right. The don't cool as great as directional rotors, but they still work. Then look at some other rotors, such as C5's. They are directional, they have a left and a right hand side rotor. The vanes are directional on these, they curve backwards to hellp direct air inbetween the rotor to cool it down. Now for some reason GM decided to skimp and use 2 of the same side rotor. So now the right hand side rotor's vanes are facing foward, which is now competely opposite of what of the rotor is supposed to have. All of the vette guys complained about this.

The Z06 and the Z51 both have this. Its possible you might get by with it, but why? just to get an extra .5" i diameter?? Not worth it IMO, especially for a track like RA where you will be repeatedly braking at 150mph. Stupidist thing GM did to cut costs

Just go with the AFX spindle and some C5 brakes, non crossdrilled, and some good pads. You won't have much at all in the front brakes, and they should be good to go. IF later down the road you feel you need better brakes and such, you can always replace them with a bolt in C5 aftermarket kit from wilwood or one of the other big ones. with the 17" centerlines your are limited, and you also don't have any prior track time. It hink this is the best decision. Won't cost too much and will be easy to change down the road when you need too. :cool:

i am glad some wanna be bike rider is telling all of us how and what we need to do to road race, i for one do not really know, and i doubt there are many of us here that have done this, maybe one or two, so who here HAS DRIVEN 130 PLUS MPH ON A ROAD COURSE MULTIPLE TIMES??
none of this directional , non directional ****, we are not engineers and its pretty easy to over engineer EVERYTHING in these pro touring cars, BECAUSE WE SAW IT ONTHE INTERNET"
nitro, run c4-c5-c6 and make sure evrything is safe, if you have heat issues of cracking issues fix it then, enough of this debate about what brakes,
maybe our new resident HERO BIKE RACER will design and build a PERFECT rotor with the PERFECT SIZE AND THICKNES.
HEY fat life, how many track days have you driven a car on??
i have never driven any road course, so i cannot really say, but i am sure nothing drastic will happen with stock vette brakes, maybe some warping, yes, maybe some small cracks around cross drilled holes, but these are things you check before the track day or just after.

Um....try speaking for yourself instead of "us"
What!!! your kidding me!!................ :rolleyes:

Another fantastic suprise!!
Oh wow! I'm glad your so sure

Wow! what an informative post! thanks for all the great info you just spewed out! I helped you out and edited it for you :thumbsup:
(p.s. I'm truly sorry that the rotors you put on your car are inferior, but don't get mad at me about it :_paranoid )

BTW
:P :P

ok, HERO
what kind of brakes do you have on your car?
how may track days have you done in a car?
where have you read all this? cause i already know the answer to the track day question in a car.
so really by highlighting my reply, you put your self right there with me, as NEVER DOING IT!!!

:_paranoid
Anyone know the difference between 2005 Z06 and standard front calipers ???

nitro the c5 caliper are the same just black or red depending whether its z06 or not.
now the c6 base calipers are the same as c5 calipers, then the c6 z-51 is the same caliper with bigger rotor, and then the c6 z06 is the six piston caliper with 14 inch rotor
ps. fatlife wannabe, why do you fail to answer my questions to you??

This is a post that I had in the other thread that I linked too;

Because you think you are busting me out or something, and think you are so cool, but in reality you just look even more ignorant, and I don't really feel like participating in a who's who war with a nobody :P

Theres a lot of good info in this thread wheter you think I am qualified or not. Lets not lock this thread because you are offended that your brake rotors are not up to real track use

If all of that is completely factual, that is great info, I never saw that post. :rolleyes:

BACK TO BRAKES OR I AM GOING TO KNOCK SOME HEADS!! :mad:

think i am busting you out??
i just said he should go out make his car safe and drive it, change/upgrade things as he goes.
you bust me out saying i am unhappy about my front brakes.
i then ask you what you have for brakes, so i forgot it was a war.

:bow:

should be, I just typed it. Not sure if the F body stuff is directional, and also I think the F body rotor is like 12.3" or something. pretty sure the rest is all %100 correct

So the pistons on the c5 and Z28 front calipers are the same size??? I don't car about the Z rotors, they are too small! :D

Yes, the same size, the only differnece I am aware of, is that the abutment is different to mount the caliper over a smaller rotor, and the caliper doesn't have the cooling fins built into the top of the caliper.

fat life, do you work for ap racing? stoptech?? precision brakes??
wow with all this techincal help its amazing, to think someone from a big brake company is here giving us all this great info and feedback, thanks :thumbsup:

I wonder how much the fins really help disipitate heat?? By abundment, do you mean the caliper bracket the caliper bolts too????

68... We are grown men and are easily mis understood and do not always come off as we actually are through typing. Lets give evryone on here the benifit of the doubt, and start over. I for one knw a ton on drag racing setup and motor building along with turbo and tuning tech, you have your area of knowledge that you a best in, and Fat, seems to have done his research on brakes pretty well.

Sound good?? :D :D :D

yes, that the abutment, the caliper assembly is a 2 piece assembly. If you look at my brakes on my site, you can see it is the shiny black piece. Not sure about the fins doing much, but it gives the caliper more surface area which allows the heat to disperse more. You can come across C5 calipers so easily and cheaply, I dont see the reason to go with the F body ones, unless you they were free. If you shop wisely you can get C5 rotors at napa for I think like $30 each, then all you need is the calipers; ebay prob like $100 for the pair used, then all you need is good pads; $150. This will get you in the door, and you won't have much of an investment. Then down the road you can spend some real coin on a real set of brakes, but you will probably want some better wheels/tires then also, and you can get a bigger rotor etc at the same time. Whether on a bike or car, I know that on my first time on the track, I barely even used the brake!! :wow: Just learning what turn is coming next, and how to get setup for it, takes enough of your attention away. But RA looks pretty easy to remember, and you will be needing some good stopping power on that straight away!! Just get some good pads, that will be the key factor, you might go to a vette site and go to the trackday section and see what people are using;
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=23

while doing some research for you on the vette board I came across this post, which has some info about the z51 rotors which is similar to what I said about the Z51 rotors;

"I have 8 track days on my Toyo and they still have half their tread left.
With the PFC pads ($400 set F+R) since they are so aggressive you will go through solid non drilled front rotors in 6-16 track days. Original equipment rotors for the Z51 are around $100-115 ea. Most track dogs convert down in rotor size to the base non drilled 12.8" instead of the 13.4" drilled rotor. You can buy napa "base 12.8" rotors for about $25 ea. The brakes on all C6 are virtually the same(Z51 has smaller pistons on the rear but uses the same caliper) only the Z06 being vastly different."

and I ran across this also;
"The directional cooling vanes on one side of the Z51 are pointing in the wrong direction, so they are trying to scoop air in while the spinning rotor is trying to throw it out. Someone recently reported an increase on the right side by 30F when racing on the track."

this is all just internet gossip but sounds believable to me.
I'll see what I can find about the pads, I believe carbotech makes a good C5 pad. Heard nothing but good things. Not sure if Ferrodo makes car brakes, but they are really Killer pads

Heres a good thread about brake pads, but rememer you don't have ABS, you have way more power, and way heavier, but still should be some good reading for you, if you get that AFX spindle, which only takes corvette brakes, so it should be good to know whats out there;
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...ight=z51+rotor

and Nitro, what you said is right on, I am no expert, and am no guru either, but I have done a bunch of research, and am just trying to relay the info I have learned, not claiming I made any of it up, or am some expert. I don't think there is anything wrong with that

ok, so lets find out what pads are best for track use and street combo, with the c5 rotors, both 12.8 and 13.4

Yes its another corvette post, but the info is all the same, this is some good reading and basially is saying the same thing we have been saying here;
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/showthread.php?t=673766

Great read for a first time track goer even if it is buy a bunch of "vette" guys :_paranoid

Carbotech
Wilwood
Hawk
porterfield
pic your favorite brand

and when it comes to brake pads for a 4000ilb car for the track, there is no street/track pad. You need a dedicated race pad for the track, unless you are passing vettes in a primer camaro :rofl:

BUT if you were just going out once in a blue moon to just enjoy yourself and weren't really really pushing it, something like a Hawk HPS pad would work good. You just have to really define what you mean by track, and just how good you want the brakes to work. You can always make a compromise and use a street pad like the Hawk HPS but if you want consistenly good brakes you need to step up to a race pad, which is going to dust A LOT and also take awhilie to warm up. But once you get out on the track a few times, and start picking up speed, you will realize that the whole street/track thing is silly, you need race stuff if you want to go fast and reliably. Now if you just want to go once or twice just to say you did it and have fun, you can make a lot of compromises.

I run performance friction race pads now. They actually work good on the street, they do work a little better when warmed up, but I end up overheatin the rotors and calipers and they work like crap if I pound on them too long. For a dual purpose car, I have found best results just using the race stuff, it works best on the track, and better then average on the street. :D

yes, there is always an execption to the rule, and if your willing to live with compromises you can make a lot of stuff work. I've personally never ran a race pad on the street, only heard that they don't work very well initially.

They don't wok as good as they can initially, but I would say they would still work better then the average car if you have the larger rotor and good caliper.(which I dont have yet)

Also, Autozone has the front C5 rotors for $55 each and PFC Z rated pads for $105. Those are the pads I run now, any good compared to other race pads??

I have to call the dealer tomorrow and see what my cost is on rotors.

i would go with differnet pads, those might be good, but I've never heard of anyone using them before, some wilwood H pads would be damn good. also apparantly Napa has the rotors for $25, have autozone match the price
EDIT: you know, if you have already used these pads and like them go for it. You will have to replace them periodically anyway, so you will have a lot more chances to try out different brands. Do some research and then choose from there. I personally would be going with ferrodo (sp?) or Carbotech

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/show...ht=rotors+used


Interesting thread I found on the new 14" rotors, great pic of the rotors hot also!

glad you found some info, looks like a lot of people are blaming it on the 2 sided rotor deal. I believe it. I saw rotors bright red like that one time at Infineon raceway. I went on a ride along in a new Dodge Intrepid....yes an intrepid. I thought it was going to be a joke, but me and 3 other people piled into the car. The driver was a professional instructor and man was I suprised. He went into the turns plowing that pig so hard he was in a controlled understeer the entire turn. I think we all looked a little white in the face when we got out! I looked at the rotors on the car and they were glowing bright red just like the pic in that link. They will also tell you at the track to not leave your ebrake on when you park the car after some laps, as the pad will melt onto the rotor!

Those rotor pics looke like nothing out of the ordinary for an x-drilled rotor that has seen a couple track sessions.

Solid rotors heat check & crack too, but they typically propagate more slowly.

As was stated in that CF thread, there is no one "magic" pad that works great on the street and track. We're talking two wildly different temperature ranges, hence why we have street compounds and race compounds. Using either for the wrong application has drawbacks. Street pads will typically cook and fade away at the track as they were meant to work best with moderate temps encountered in daily driving, and race pads on the street never get up to the intended temp level which can have many effects including reduced coefficent of friction and rapidly accelerated rotor wear.

Lots of good pads to choose from... Carbotech, Hawk, Porterfield, Ferrodo, etc. All offer both street and track compounds.