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-   -   BluePrint Engines Pro Series Chevy LS 427 (https://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php?t=40586)

Flash68 09-01-2013 12:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks67 (Post 502538)
The Scat crankshaft forging is made in China, and I personally know that Brian Thomson of Thomson Automotive wouldn't use a Scat crank. Brian tests all the parts out and is very selective on the parts. You machinist could check everything, and the crank would fail because of the poor quality forgings from china. It is based on the quality of the material.

Jeff
I am wanting a made in the USA argument to erupt here, but like it or not, the Chinese forgings aren't all as bad as many make out. And a lot of the Chinese products are getting better every day, whether it's widgets or car parts. That is just reality.

Callies Compstar rods and cranks are used by many good engine builders and they are a good product, to name one.

garickman 09-01-2013 12:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks67 (Post 502541)
Callie Compstar rods are made at Japan Kobe. I spent lot of time talking to Brain Thomson on parts. Brian doesn't like the Callie Rods, but has used them in engines. Actually, he said that they make the worse rod in the industry. He prefers Oliver, Crower, and Carrillo rods. So how do you know Callie rods are quality part? Brian Thomson tests engines for GM and see's when parts will fail in engine. I have Crower parts in my engine. Crower uses Pacific Forge http://www.pacificforge.com/whypacificforge.html

I never forget buying a Chinese Grade 8 bolt and seeing it shear in half on the first use. I never buy Chinese products again. Why? China has no quality control!! I have a PhD friend that worked for the Bureau of Mines and said the best iron ore is in the USA. I rather not put the American worker out of work.

Jeff
I have Callies Ultra XD rods in my LS7 that Wegner Motorsports just built. Both Brian Thomson and the lead engine builder Gary Nelson from Wegner told me they were one of the best rods on the market. According to Callies, there Ultra rods are 100% USA, forged in Michigan and fully machined in there Ohio facility.

Flash68 09-01-2013 01:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks67 (Post 502541)
Callie Compstar rods are made at Japan Kobe. I spent lot of time talking to Brain Thomson on parts. Brian doesn't like the Callie Rods, but has used them in engines. Actually, he said that they make the worse rod in the industry. He prefers Oliver, Crower, and Carrillo rods. So how do you know Callie rods are quality part? Brian Thomson tests engines for GM and see's when parts will fail in engine. I have Crower parts in my engine. Crower uses Pacific Forge http://www.pacificforge.com/whypacificforge.html

I never forget buying a Chinese Grade 8 bolt and seeing it shear in half on the first use. I never buy Chinese products again. Why? China has no quality control!! I have a PhD friend that worked for the Bureau of Mines and said the best iron ore is in the USA. I rather not put the American worker out of work.

Jeff
I know Thomson is a reputable shop, but I guess if Brian Thompson doesn't/won't use it then it must be junk. :rolleyes:

My point is -- and the Blueprint engines are an example -- there are plenty of value oriented parts out there.

And who wouldn't "prefer" an Oliver, a Crower, or a Carrillo? Not everyone is building a $25-30k engine.

camcojb 09-01-2013 02:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks67 (Post 502538)
The Scat crankshaft forging is made in China and shipped to the USA for finishing by SCAT, and I personally know that Brian Thomson of Thomson Automotive wouldn't use a Scat crank. Brian tests all the parts out and is very selective on the parts. You machinist could check everything, and the crank would fail because of the poor quality forgings from china. It is based on the quality of the material.

Jeff
I doubt Brian said it "would" fail, but I'll give you that it "could" fail. So can Oliver billet rods, and so can ANY high performance part regardless of quality or price. I built a 482 ZL1 engine for a friends Camaro 5 years ago. And somehow that Scat crank is still hanging in there with multiple 7000+ rpm blasts. I'm surprised that it hasn't broken in half yet............ :lol:

Vegas69 09-01-2013 03:26 PM
I put a Callies Compstar in my ZL1. When I think of Scat, I think cheap and couldn't bring myself to use one in such a high end engine. I really don't know if a huge benefit exists, I just like Callies reputation in crankshafts. With that being said, a Scat is more than adequate for your average hot rodder or drag racer. You do need to start sourcing higher quality pieces when it comes to an all out application like a road racer.

camcojb 09-01-2013 06:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks67 (Post 502590)
Any crankshaft can fail based on too high rpms, but if the part is made inferior then it will fail. Scat crank at 7000 rpm is still with the stated specs. My friend took his big block to 8000 rpm, and the Lunati Pro series crank is still going strong after 13 years. Tell your friend to take to 8,000 rpms and see on how long your scat crank lasts. :rofl: The engine has been rebuilt a few times, but he bought a quality USA made crankshaft. The latest upgrade he bought some expensive heads, but he has made 1100 horsepower and 900ft/lbs of torque.

Actually, he has bought cheap parts in the past for drag racing his 69 Camaro, and he had to replace them more times than buying quality parts.
So, in the end it costs you more in racing.

In this thread, though, I go for the LS7. The LS7 can be upgraded in the future for more power.
Apples and oranges Jeff. An 8000 rpm big block is different than a 7000 rpm setup. Few people would recommend a Scat crank in an 8000 rpm big block. He wasn't building an all out engine, just a nice pump gas big block that was fun to drive. So far it's worked fine, and has worked fine in many other street engines.

I've spent plenty of money in the past with the best parts, but those were for max effort builds. You cannot expect (and don't need) the best parts in EVERY build.

GregWeld 09-01-2013 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by camcojb (Post 502596)
You cannot expect (and don't need) the best parts in EVERY build.


Spot on Jody! I bought a Smeding crate motor for my '32 Ford... a motor I wouldn't DARE or even think about putting in the Mustang for the track. But it's "plenty" and "just fine" for the light little roadster to cruise around with.

camcojb 09-01-2013 09:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks67 (Post 502606)
You can also buy OEM crankshaft from GM. In this thread, it was an LS engine. Although, you have seemed to switched it to a big block. The OEM manufacturer tests their products more than aftermarket products. So, if you was building a LS3 427 then would you chose a Chinese Scat crank or OEM GM crankshaft.

Scat is cheaper, but only about $60. = Summit price is $797 for 4.0 Stroke crankshaft.

LS7 Crankshaft is $859.

http://www.newgmparts.com/partlocato...086&startrow=6

Blueprint doesn't list their stroke, but to get to a 427 with LS3. Most engine builders are using a 4.125 stroke crank, which cost is more. $1,037.
Jeff
I was speaking of Scat in general, and related it to one used in an engine I assembled. Nothing more.

coolwelder62 09-05-2013 06:22 PM
I don't believe the Blueprint LS-427 is an all out road race power plant.I believe it would make an Pro-touring,goodguy autoX motor.I think if you want an 8000RPM full race motor you look at SB2/R07,or if money not a problem then a high reving KaTech LS dry sump style motor.

camcojb 09-06-2013 08:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparks67 (Post 503480)
No, I think you miss the point that was I trying to make. Jody stated that he had built one engine with SCAT crank (Chinese crank), and never had an issue with it. I have recently found 2 engine builders that have built 5 engines each, so 10 engines. The Scat cranks had failed in engine. Horsepower on the engines were 370hp. Scat put out this disclaimer on the breaking the nose crankshaft. http://www.scatcrankshafts.com/scatt...k_the_Nose.pdf Anyway. If my goal was a 427, then the LS7 would better choice. One reason is better resale than an LS3.

Jeff
Actually what I said was that an engine builder who I trust uses them in his lower dollar builds and has no problems. They are not LS engines however, mostly big block Chevy's. ;)


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