Thomas -

You want to go see one of the best run shops EVER - IMHO - take a spin down to the bay area and check out Roy Brizios shop.... he builds killer cars - has all the skilled guys - and tools - in a fairly smallish shop... He's been doing it for years - has a fabulous reputation - and the product speaks for itself. I spent some time there discussing my recent frame build - and here's an HONEST shop - he told me - "well, I can build it for you - but it's going to be the same chassis you could buy for half the money from one of the regular frame guys... I'm just not set up to crank out frames so we charge by the hour and really only do them if a customer asks us to".

The club I belong to often has major discussions and "lessons learned" at our meetings -- one thing that we discuss often is the quoted shop rate... the guys that have been doing this stuff awhile - will all tell you what Rodger said above... the rate doesn't count nearly as much as how long it's going to take... 'cause $35 an hour sounds cheap - but not if it take 3 times as long!
And $35 an hour is real cheap - until you have to pay $95 an hour to have it all re-done.

Build your shop car - make note of every single hour you have in it - including the time to chase down parts - and go fetch etc - and every shop rag you use - and tape - and welding supplies... you might be shocked at what you really have into the build! Then see if you can sell it at a profit to start your next build... :woot:

So your only interested in Volunteering? I don't know about you but I would rather work on my own car, then volunteer free labor for others. If that is the case, I will bring you 2 cars on monday to volunteer on. Let me know when your done, I will bring you 2 more.

Rodger

Greg,

Should I add the smoke break time? If so, I have one hell of an expensive car!! :lol:


P.S. After reading some great info from guys in the know, it backs up my thoughts of when have your own buisness, it will monopolize your time, period. I love my time off and the fact that when I punch out, work is never on my mind.

Yes Rick definitely understood to the shhhhh game. I priced the car out personally at a local place down the street on the damage to see if maybe I'd pay out of pocket. That quote was 3400.00. The insurance quote was 4600.00 with very little difference in labor/material itemization.

Sorry guys for steering this off track a bit. Back to the OP.

Brizio is one of the few that is probably just as good a business man as a builder. He runs a well oiled machine. He turns out multiple cars per month. But his client list gets shorter every month. Another street rodder dies every month. Will his business ever slow down? probably not. Will he ever win a national event award? Not intentional I guess. He knows there is no money in award winner, one off, set the world on fire cars. He does the same thing over and over and uses a proven system.

I think from a business side of things, So Cal Speed shop does a great job. They sell a crap load of T shirts, but builds and sells a very quality product. So did Jesse James, but he did it in 2 years, So Cal will be selling T shirts in 20 years like Mooneyes. Jesse James will just be married to Sandra Bullock in 20 years. Well in hind sight that sounds like a pretty good business plan also. :D :D :D

1 Go out and buy alot of Top Ramen
2 Plan on having no life for the first few years
3 No its not like discovery channel just because you opened a shop!

Cost
My savings account
Numerous girlfriends
Put all my own projects on the back burner

I worked and went to my shop at night for the first year,I quit a good paying managment job and went to my shop full time, It was a drastic change. I worked 7 days a week and 16-18 hour days for a long time, and still due when needed. Determanation and hard work, and being straight up and honest is what has worked for us. We have put out some cars that were not intended to be indoor show cars and have managed to beat up on some very big name builders and win alot of awards. Oh yeah...its Sundayand I am at work right now, I have been block sanding so long my firgers are ready to fall off.

On the serious side, if its what you are passionate about, and really want to do it...... go out and do it. There seems to be plenty of good people on here that would be more than happy to give you pointers along the way. Good Luck.

Im north of Chicago ...Near that Swartzs charachter . Lots of big Body shops that work on volume and give the labor & extras away to the insurance companies so they can stay open another day . I make less than I did 10 years ago . Shops that charge 52.00 dont get as much insurance work .
The body shops recooped there losses by reducing pay or double sheeting the techs. Sorry to get off topic rant over

I could go for days about this topic. Thank God for Roger!!! He knows how to put the words down. Everything he's said I coincide with down to the t's crossed and i's dotted. It's not easy one bit. Roger and I are in our early 30's and for us to know and understand how things work and what it takes to do what were doing say's alot about a good honest hard working Hot Rod Shop.

I opend my doors in August of 2000 and was sweating at how I was going to pay my $550 rent and $100 bucks in utilities. For the first 4 1/2 years I worked a night job which pretty much paid for my tools. Start work at 7:30 pm work till 4 am or later if overtime. Go home sleep from 4am till 9am wake up get to my shop at 10 or so. Work till 6pm go home shower eat and be at work 20 miles away by 7:30 pm. I was late(by 5 minutes) about five times in those years. I left a $85,000.00 a year job for my passion. Five years later I don't regret it. There are plenty of days where I wish I worked for someone else.

Shop rates vary not only on ones quality of work but also location. I'm in the heart of California where the cost of living isn't cheap. If I could tell you guys what it cost to live a so called blue collar lifestyle you would probably fall over where you stand. Shops that do the same level of work might have different cost cause of location.

This is a great topic but is only the tip of the iceburg on what it takes to run a Hot Rod Shop in this day and age.

The key to any succseful shop is honesty,good work, responsibility,and will. And like I said before Doing better than your best and never letting it rest !!!!

I can't add much from a business owners perspective but I can offer an observation:
I know two guys who both have jobs that were born out of their hobbies. One guy owns a wakeboard/ski boat shop, the other owns a pretty busy garage (not a hot rod shop). The guy that works on boats never makes it to the lake anymore. He is always busy getting clients back out on the water. The guy that owns the garage has multiple projects of his own in various states of completion in and around the shop that he never works on because he is busy on cars for paying customers. By the time he gets all of those done, he is beat and wants to go home and see his family. He never makes any progress on his own stuff.

I can't fathom what it takes to get into a niche market that you are very passionate about and try to make a dollar. I can understand the allure of trying to combine a hobby and a job, but you can't serve two masters. You are either going to have to treat it like a job or treat it like a hobby and your success or failure would be dependent on your ability to do so. I would imagine very few people figure out how to do both at the same time and be financially successful (success can be measured other ways, I am sure these guys live for months off of the smiles they get when they hand over the keys on a completed build).

Either way you go, good luck. There have been some great posts on this thread that apply to business owners in general and I think it is cool that you have generated this great banter from some respected builders on the site.