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-   -   WELD/SUTTON DIRT MISSILE build (https://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php?t=56209)

Ron Sutton 05-22-2018 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jlwdvm (Post 677871)
Maybe I should switch out my T56 Magnum for one of those...it might be easier than modifying my pedals! Speaking of trans, will you do anything to the exhaust pipes that run right along the trans to decrease heat transfer? I'm sure you will be running a trans cooler, but that looks like it would fry the trans.


The headers & exhaust system are all double coated (inside & outside) by Jet-Hot with their 2000° thermal barrier. It's the only way we can do this.

carbuff 05-22-2018 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Sutton (Post 677851)

On our Track-Warrior front clips ... all 4 versions ... the LCA & UCA brackets have slots for our slugs. When I designed each of these front suspensions, I made them so we can build them "semi-custom" for each customer, with different ride heights, frame widths, etc. I placed the slots in a location that allows me use precision slugs to optimize each semi-custom front frame & suspension.


I read that as the slugs aren't for tuning then, they are to allow you to reuse the design in various applications. Once you have determined the desired mount height, you choose slugs and never change them again. Am I interpreting that correctly?

Ron Sutton 05-22-2018 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carbuff (Post 677880)
I read that as the slugs aren't for tuning then, they are to allow you to reuse the design in various applications. Once you have determined the desired mount height, you choose slugs and never change them again. Am I interpreting that correctly?

Sort of. But a little off track.

I have my design so refined, it only takes small changes ... like 1/16" or 1/8" changes at a pivot point, or ball joint studs .100" taller or shorter ... to achieve any setup I want.

This allows me to optimize a front clip for Aaron Oberle that wants a ride height of 5.5" at the firewall ... and another client that wants a 4" ride height.

This also allows those clients to "change their mind" about their car. Aaron could decide he wants to drop the car 1" all around. If he called & told me, I'd tell him what the ride height change did to the geometry. And if he wanted to optimize the car for that height ... which slugs to change.

Another thing is the car owner's priority. I set up Aaron Oberle's AXT front clip to be optimum for larger autocross courses, like SCCA, CAM, Optima, etc. If Aaron decided he wanted to change & run only GoodGuys AX (tiny courses) ... or change and only run the car on road course track days, with small slug changes we could optimize his car to be the best at whatever he chooses to do.

So it's not that the car owner will never change it. They may, or may not. It simply allows them to optimize their geometry for whatever ride height or types of track they favor.

Byron, as you have one of my Speedtech Extreme front clips ... and that clip is NOT slugged ... so you know there is only one optimum ride height. The front LCA bolts need to be 8-7/16" from the ground. That is where that geometry ROCKS. The priority is AX, but it works well at road courses too. You can raise or lower your car, but the geometry would be less than optimum.

carbuff 05-22-2018 12:59 PM

As always, thanx for the more detailed explanation. It makes total sense.

Getting my car to 'exactly' the 8 7/16" LCA bolt height is, well, challenging. Move one corner, all the others move. I'm within 1/8" at the moment, and will tune it the rest of the way once all of the weight is on the front of the car...

Blake Foster 05-23-2018 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carbuff (Post 677890)
As always, thanx for the more detailed explanation. It makes total sense.

Getting my car to 'exactly' the 8 7/16" LCA bolt height is, well, challenging. Move one corner, all the others move. I'm within 1/8" at the moment, and will tune it the rest of the way once all of the weight is on the front of the car...

yes it will be a bit of a challenge if you are trying to set the corner weights at the same time, i would start by setting the ride height front and rear level. then scale it with the driver an fuel in it and in reality you should only really have to adjust the driver front and pass rear a small amount.

Ron Sutton 05-23-2018 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blake Foster (Post 677915)
yes it will be a bit of a challenge if you are trying to set the corner weights at the same time, i would start by setting the ride height front and rear level. then scale it with the driver an fuel in it and in reality you should only really have to adjust the driver front and pass rear a small amount.

What he said !

Set ride height & rake first ... then scale.

:gitrdun:

carbuff 05-23-2018 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blake Foster (Post 677915)
yes it will be a bit of a challenge if you are trying to set the corner weights at the same time, i would start by setting the ride height front and rear level. then scale it with the driver an fuel in it and in reality you should only really have to adjust the driver front and pass rear a small amount.

Not trying to hijack Ron's thread, but no I'm not trying to set corner weights yet. Just trying to set ride heights. I have never been able to adjust height at just a single corner independent from the others, and I think that is expected. So trying to determine which corners to turn to adjust a single corner is challenging.

If you have a resource with tips, I'm all ears/eyes. Ron has told me how to adjust corner weights before, but getting the ride height correct always proves to be a challenge to me...

Ron Sutton 05-23-2018 12:38 PM

Hey Everyone! Two Quick Announcements



1. I'm outta here for 10 days. Going on my annual family vacation. This year we're in Yosemite with NO cell service! :)
* So I won't be posting on here or answering questions until after I get back June 4th.

2. Ron Sutton Race Technology is having a huge sale. I call this one: The Boss is Gone on Vacation Sale !
We only hold a "SALE" twice a year. Once during the end of year Holidays ... and once RIGHT NOW - May 23 to June 1st
* Dave Hanson & Susan Kinnicutt are Handling the Big Sale while I'm Gone.


#1 - FREE SHIPPING on EVERYTHING in our Catalog during this sale ! Save $100's if not $1000+
#2 - Plus - Free 2018 Ron Sutton Workshop Ticket (Regular $349) with any purchase over $1500
#3 - RSRT Bonus Bucks to Spend on ANYTHING in our Catalog !!! (See each item for amount)


See ALL the Sale Specials HERE.
See Online Catalog HERE.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you need anything while I'm gone, contact ...

Dave Hanson (Sales Manager)
844-722-3832 Ext 1
[email protected]

Susan Kinnicutt (Office Manger)
844-722-3832 Ext 3 (Only while I'm gone)
[email protected]

Vegas69 05-23-2018 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carbuff (Post 677922)
Not trying to hijack Ron's thread, but no I'm not trying to set corner weights yet. Just trying to set ride heights. I have never been able to adjust height at just a single corner independent from the others, and I think that is expected. So trying to determine which corners to turn to adjust a single corner is challenging.

If you have a resource with tips, I'm all ears/eyes. Ron has told me how to adjust corner weights before, but getting the ride height correct always proves to be a challenge to me...

It's a lot of work to dial it in dead nuts. Optimally, you are mid stroke on all four shocks and then corner weight it. Invariably, you won't like your stance after corner weighting as it will not sit square anymore. Do you want max performance or max stance? You can't have both. Isn't that life...:D

carbuff 05-24-2018 11:38 AM

The static heights on the rear of TOW are never level. I presume there is some side to side variation in the sheetmetal as compared to the suspension points. So I do my best to get the front to the right heights, and Ron requested that I get the rear trailing arms level to the ground. I'll do that, and the fender heights will be what they will be.

From what I recall (it's been a year since I've done this), Ron told me how to adjust the coilovers at opposing corners to move weight around with really altering the height at each corner. That's what I have done before with reasonable results. Once I get all of the weight on the car, that is my plan...

Next battle is getting alignment right such that the car will drive straight. ;)

rustomatic 05-25-2018 08:58 PM

Just a note back on topic: After crawling all over a new Trans Am Camaro racer at Sonoma today, it is easy to see how this build, frame and everything, is quite similar--this is a compliment, as the chassis on the spec racer, according to the owner, was built by Howe. The Sutton version is just more exotic and probably a lot more fun (read: potentially way faster) to drive (when it's done). What's funny is that on a cost basis, the bespoke (for Greg or other people) Sutton version seems like a considerable bargain when put up against a spec Trans Am racer . . .

GregWeld 05-26-2018 09:40 AM

A group from Lat G spent a few days at Performance Racing Industries show (PRI) in Indy last December..... of course I was in the throws of picking the few parts I get to on the ' 70.... and we spent considerable time looking at all the other chassis and car builders and their offerings....


Yeah ---- I'll take my RSRT car.

FETorino 05-26-2018 09:53 AM

It’s ok Greg. I remember trying to get some good BBQ and Brian hijacking the trip.:stirthepot::lmao:

GregWeld 05-26-2018 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FETorino (Post 678043)
It’s ok Greg. I remember trying to get some good BBQ and Brian hijacking the trip.:stirthepot::lmao:

Git ya sum!!!!

https://saltlickbbq.com/

carbuff 05-26-2018 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 678044)

:lostmarbles::smiley_smack:

GregWeld 05-26-2018 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carbuff (Post 678047)
:lostmarbles::smiley_smack:

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Oh Bryan ---- it's always the one little thing that a group of guys glom on to and won't let it go. It's almost like it becomes "the theme". LOL

carbuff 05-26-2018 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 678048)
LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Oh Bryan ---- it's always the one little thing that a group of guys glom on to and won't let it go. It's almost like it becomes "the theme". LOL

It makes me feel loved. ;)

Ron Sutton 06-03-2018 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rustomatic (Post 678026)
Just a note back on topic: After crawling all over a new Trans Am Camaro racer at Sonoma today, it is easy to see how this build, frame and everything, is quite similar--this is a compliment, as the chassis on the spec racer, according to the owner, was built by Howe. The Sutton version is just more exotic and probably a lot more fun (read: potentially way faster) to drive (when it's done). What's funny is that on a cost basis, the bespoke (for Greg or other people) Sutton version seems like a considerable bargain when put up against a spec Trans Am racer . . .


Thanks for the kind comments.

Greg Weld's Track Warrior will be quicker than a Trans Am 2 car, but not as quick as a Trans Am car. The chassis, downforce, suspension & overall grip would be equal to a TA car, but the 700hp is the limiting factor. Today's Trans Am cars are making north of 850hp.

Greg wanted a tame LS7 ... and 700hp is the lowest power version of LS7 I offer. We have them up to 900hp, but as you can imagine, those engines come with a lot of maintenance requirements. Besides, this thing will be a beast with 700HP.

---------------------------

I just returned from my 10 day vacation in Yosemite. I'll jump on here Monday & post some updates & some dyno sheets.

:relax:

GregWeld 06-03-2018 10:19 AM

I didn't grow up winning go kart races at 13..... I'm old..... I didn't start doing this crap until I bought Old Yeller..... and that was a mere 7 years ago. 700 HP is all I'm going to sneak up on right now. When I can drive this SOB to new track records..... then maybe I'll add some more gasoline to it.

FETorino 06-03-2018 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 678304)
I didn't grow up winning go kart races at 13..... I'm old..... I didn't start doing this crap until I bought Old Yeller..... and that was a mere 7 years ago. 700 HP is all I'm going to sneak up on right now. When I can drive this SOB to new track records..... then maybe I'll add some more gasoline to it.

Whaat?

Everyone knows you need max hp right out of the gate to be fast. Quitter. :stirthepot:

rustomatic 06-03-2018 09:47 PM

I was indeed referring to a TA 2 car--I know nothing about actual racing classes and whatnot. What I thought was cool about the the engine setup--basically an LS3--was that they were using an LS truck (bread box) intake, and they still had MAF running. Supposedly, it was limited to 500 horses, per series rules, but the cam chop seemed to indicate other possibilities. The truck intake and 15-inch wheels (1.25 inch-thick rotors) were interesting, but I have low standards . . .

Here's looking forward to more build updates.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Sutton (Post 678303)
Thanks for the kind comments.

Greg Weld's Track Warrior will be quicker than a Trans Am 2 car, but not as quick as a Trans Am car. The chassis, downforce, suspension & overall grip would be equal to a TA car, but the 700hp is the limiting factor. Today's Trans Am cars are making north of 850hp.

Greg wanted a tame LS7 ... and 700hp is the lowest power version of LS7 I offer. We have them up to 900hp, but as you can imagine, those engines come with a lot of maintenance requirements. Besides, this thing will be a beast with 700HP.

---------------------------

I just returned from my 10 day vacation in Yosemite. I'll jump on here Monday & post some updates & some dyno sheets.

:relax:


Flash68 06-03-2018 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 678304)
I didn't grow up winning go kart races at 13.....

LOL... now that's funny right there. :peepwall:

GregWeld 06-04-2018 07:31 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Attachment 65813

Ron Sutton 06-04-2018 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FETorino (Post 678307)
Whaat?

Everyone knows you need max hp right out of the gate to be fast. Quitter. :stirthepot:

Says the guy with 3xx hp. :poke: :lol:

Ron Sutton 06-04-2018 08:04 AM

This dyno sheet is Greg's engine. It is our "Track Warrior 3 LS7".

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...1&d=1528125184

You can see a detailed list of all the internal components in our catalog HERE.

Three things should stand out ...
1. The build components are almost overkill for "only" 700hp. That's to increase longevity.
2. The ARE dry sump is simply the best dry sump & best protection for the engine in a car with high G's.
3. The power curve is relatively "linear" which makes these engines easier to drive fast.

A few other notes:
A. The "dead on" dyno at Scoggin-Dickey shows 707hp. It will make 8-11 more horsepower once we we change the oil from Driven BR break-in Oil to Driven LS oil.
B. We did NOT dyno the engine with step headers. If we did the top end power would be the same, but the power band from 2500 to 6000 would show higher & even flatter.
C. Greg's headers are the RSRT "tuned" Step Headers ... 1-3/4" to 1-7/8" to 2.0" and will have more power from 2500 to 6000 than the dyno curve shows & be even flatter.
D. This same engine with the very basic, single stage GM OEM LS7 dry sump makes about 15 less HP.
E. The happy window power curve on this particular Track-Warrior engine is 2500-7500rpm on track.

Front end, hood & doors mount this week. Powertrain next week. Still on track to track test June 28th. :)

:cheers:


ironworks 06-04-2018 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 678048)
LOLOLOLOLOLOL

Oh Bryan ---- it's always the one little thing that a group of guys glom on to and won't let it go. It's almost like it becomes "the theme". LOL

Funny I told that story to an employee this morning that is moving there in the fall and wants to go check it out.

I told him I heard it wasn't that good and the line is too long.

Vegas69 06-04-2018 08:29 AM

Looks perfect to me!:)

carbuff 06-04-2018 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ironworks (Post 678327)
Funny I told that story to an employee this morning that is moving there in the fall and wants to go check it out.

I told him I heard it wasn't that good and the line is too long.

Hope he listened. ;)

Flash68 06-04-2018 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ironworks (Post 678327)
Funny I told that story to an employee this morning that is moving there in the fall and wants to go check it out.

I told him I heard it wasn't that good and the line is too long.

Quote:

Originally Posted by carbuff (Post 678330)
Hope he listened. ;)

LOL... here we go.

Ron Sutton 06-04-2018 11:43 AM

Car Year & Model: 70 Ford Mustang Fastback
Competing in: Track Car & Occasional NASA TTU races
Front Clip/Suspension: GT Track-Warrior
Rear Clip/Suspension: GT Track-Warrior
Engine: Track-Warrior 3 LS7 700 HP
Trans: PPG Sequential Shift T56 6-Speed
Brakes: StopTech 14” ST60/ST40
Owner: Greg Weld
Builder: Randy Chastain – One-Off Customs

I'm back from my 10-day family vacation in Yosemite. While the awesome crew at SDPC Raceshop & my EFI Guru Scott Clark were wrapping up the LS7 engine ... Randy Chastain at One-Off Customs made a LOT of progress on the car. See photos below!

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...2&d=1528135400

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...3&d=1528135442

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...4&d=1528135455

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...5&d=1528135470

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...9&d=1528136886

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...7&d=1528135536

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...8&d=1528135560

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...9&d=1528135597

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...0&d=1528135617

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...1&d=1528135652

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...2&d=1528135683

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...3&d=1528135697

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...4&d=1528135735

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...5&d=1528135753

Continued in next post ...


Ron Sutton 06-04-2018 11:44 AM

Continued from previous post ...

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...6&d=1528135774

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...7&d=1528135799

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...8&d=1528135847

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...9&d=1528135862

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...0&d=1528135889

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...1&d=1528135904

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...2&d=1528135914

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...3&d=1528135957

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...4&d=1528136000

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...5&d=1528136018

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...6&d=1528136041

http://www.pro-touring.com/attachmen...7&d=1528136053

GregWeld 06-04-2018 12:40 PM

I need to go buy some adult diapers.......

DBasher 06-04-2018 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Sutton (Post 678324)

Front end, hood & doors mount this week. Powertrain next week. Still on track to track test June 28th. :)

:cheers:
[/COLOR]

Ron, it’s proving to be harder than expected to marry into the Weld family and with time running out I’ve decided to send you my resume. As you’ll see I’m extremely qualified...not so much in your line of business but I do adapt quickly. I’ve also taken multiple photography classes during my short stay in high school and feel I would be able to assist in the media side of the business, as well as the Star Girls calendar—Sieg is old and can not be trusted.
I’m available as soon as the 28th, shirt size is an XLT and as long as the hat is for an adult it’ll fit.

Thank you for your consideration.
:action-smiley-027:

GregWeld 06-04-2018 01:38 PM

Poor Basher.........



LOL

Ron Sutton 06-04-2018 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DBasher (Post 678341)
Ron, it’s proving to be harder than expected to marry into the Weld family and with time running out I’ve decided to send you my resume. As you’ll see I’m extremely qualified...not so much in your line of business but I do adapt quickly. I’ve also taken multiple photography classes during my short stay in high school and feel I would be able to assist in the media side of the business, as well as the Star Girls calendar—Sieg is old and can not be trusted.
I’m available as soon as the 28th, shirt size is an XLT and as long as the hat is for an adult it’ll fit.

Thank you for your consideration.
:action-smiley-027:

:ohsnap::rofl::dance::willy:

Ron Sutton 06-04-2018 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DBasher (Post 678341)
Ron, it’s proving to be harder than expected to marry into the Weld family and with time running out I’ve decided to send you my resume. As you’ll see I’m extremely qualified...not so much in your line of business but I do adapt quickly. I’ve also taken multiple photography classes during my short stay in high school and feel I would be able to assist in the media side of the business, as well as the Star Girls calendar—Sieg is old and can not be trusted.
I’m available as soon as the 28th, shirt size is an XLT and as long as the hat is for an adult it’ll fit.

Thank you for your consideration.
:action-smiley-027:

By the way ...

Who were you trying to marry?

If you're in for Greg & offer Gwen something of value ... anything of value ... you may be able to work out a deal. Just sayin'

Blake Foster 06-04-2018 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld (Post 678337)
I need to go buy some adult diapers.......

It is starting to look that way !!! :confused59:

Panteracer 06-04-2018 03:21 PM

Track Warrior
 
Once you set the tire in place the view from the back
makes it perfect... I guess that is what most people will
be seeing on the track:)

Bob

DBasher 06-04-2018 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Sutton (Post 678344)
By the way ...

Who were you trying to marry?

If you're in for Greg & offer Gwen something of value ... anything of value ... you may be able to work out a deal. Just sayin'

I hadn’t thought about him, come to think of it, he did lure me into the toterhome with talk of whiskey and pistolas...er maybe that was Sieg, like I said, he’s not to be trusted.
:lol:

My dearest Greg,

I’m thinking a brown race suit may be your best bet for the new car.
Xoxo
Dan
🙃

GregWeld 06-04-2018 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Sutton (Post 678344)
By the way ...

Who were you trying to marry?

If you're in for Greg & offer Gwen something of value ... anything of value ... you may be able to work out a deal. Just sayin'



Too late --- she's already been gone a week. Seems one of the guys at the construction project down the street had some Snap-On tools a relative left him. So far I've tried the 9/16" box end and it seems to work real well ---- so maybe I got a pretty good deal.


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