Greg, what do you think about all the talk surrounding Tesla Motors. I know that they are a growth play. I knew Tesla might have something when I kept seeing their sedans around.

We've discussed them a bit a while back..

They were on par with the likes of Apple.. they are a "perfect" company... as in. If they arent "perfect" their stock's gonna dive. lol.

More along the line of a gamble versus a long term hold. Thats my thoughts anyway. I've seen it swing both ways with them, and I'm personally not comfortable with that.

Now if I had some "play money" leaking out my back pocket, I might toss it that way. But I would then be OK with losing it. lol

With companies like this you just never know.... I think their current sedan is fantastic... their first car - not so much....


IF -- and only IF -- you have money you can afford to loose --- then I'd buy some. Why not if you like the products and think they're a winner. I think they're winning right now.... but I ONLY buy dividend paying stocks -- so won't play that game. But if I was still a gambling man - I'd be a buyer.

Remember that it's not "investing" -- it's gambling.... and we've covered all that here many times. Nothing wrong with gambling if you can afford it IMHO.

Ah...... July...... Seems the buyers have all fled the market -- and you all are probably asking yourself why you're invested. HA!! I've been telling you for months --- remember these good days where the market seems to go up every day!

It's summer.... summer always sucks. It usually begins in May -- but this year it started later. People just seem to be doing everything other than "the market". It's a good time to pick away at putting some employees to work -- just know that after you buy - the stock will take a dollar dump the next day.

My guess is -- we continue the death of a 1000 cuts -- thru August. I know personally -- I'm doing a bunch of fun stuff rather than looking outside and seeing the rain fall and buying stocks. The market goes up when more people are buying than selling.... the market falls when, even if people aren't really selling in earnest -- but there's nobody around to bid 'em up. Learn the difference of a market sell off ---- and a period when there's just no interest in buying. They're markedly different.

So I know you guys are probably all tired of me harping about dividends...


But today is another day that reinforces why I like them over a similar name to invest in that does NOT pay a dividend.... in other words ---- why choose to put money in a stock that doesn't pay a dividend -- when there is probably a very similar stock that DOES pay one? Oh sure --- when the market is humming along and going up every day -- you're making money regardless! I like that too.... but after about 20 plus years of doing this (daily) I KNOW that the market doesn't always just hum along churning out daily gains in price. Some times you might be 2 and 3 YEARS running at a loss. If you're getting a dividend --- at least you're getting paid to sit on your hands (sounds like a union job huh? === Sorry Union guys!)


I write this today because -- the market sucks -- it's down almost 200 points this morning - and was down yesterday --- BUT --- I looked at one of my accounts and I got a check yesterday from Kinder Morgan Partners (KMP) for $13,200 -- That's real cash I can spend. Do I care what the market is doing today?? Not really (okay sure I do)... because I can pay my bills with the CASH the dividends give me.

If you're re-investing (DRIP - Dividend re-investment plan) then it's great that the market is DOWN during a dividend payout -- because your dividend will buy more shares (or parts of a share - whatever)... so it's to your BENEFIT!!

I'm also quite alright with it dropping a little lower right now. I'm getting ready to dump some money into stocks. Nothing major but I'll take any little amount I can.:G-Dub:

Maybe this is obvious to everyone else, but I just caught on so I am hoping to make some sense of it...In my Schwab, stocks set for "reinvest dividends" the dividend payouts add to the cost basis of the stock, and are not counted as gains.

For example, say you bought 10 shares of MCD @ $100. 3 months later say the share price is still $100, but you've been paid a div. 10x$0.80 = $8. In your "Gains / Loss" tab, the report will show a ZERO gain, but changes your cost basis to $1008.

This is the case with all my stocks...but I want to see my total return (share price delta + dividends)! So I emailed Schwab, and their response was murky: "for tax purposes, dividend payouts are added to the cost basis of the stock, and are not included in the unrealized gains of the holding."

Any tips for using the Schwab site to show my actual total return? Or am I going to have to track my buys and total return manually in a spreadsheet?!

Thanks guys.

With Vanguard, I simply do the math because it's the same way. Reinvested dividends are counted as a cost. I understand why it's listed that way but for me, I like to do the same thing you're doing and count it as a return. With Vanguard, it's line itemized though so it's very easy math.

Life -- according to Schwab....



Average cost basis is one method to determine the cost of mutual fund shares at the time the shares are sold or redeemed. Schwab uses the single-category method, which simply divides the total dollar amount invested in a particular fund position by the number of shares held prior to the sale trade date. Reinvested dividends are considered actual fund purchases and are included in the cost basis.


In other words -- you'll have to do the work yourself. But remember this.... There's the IRS rules of engagement -- and Schwabs way of calculating for it's retail customers... and only your accountant can tell you (once you have a real actual realized gain/loss) what is correct. Most people just use an "average cost" to determine their cost basis. Because for many folks -- their stocks are held in IRA's etc for LONG periods of time -- and the thing gets so jumbled up that it doesn't pay to have an accountant try to determine the actual cost for stocks you bought 30 years ago - and have been receiving dividends (re-invested) all these years.

It makes no difference for accounting purposes NOW -- other than YOU want to know.... IF your shares are held in tax deferred accounts.... because there's no capital gains taxes to calculate until after you start to withdraw. Then - because this money (IRA/401k's) was "TAX DEFERRED" it is assumed that you now owe taxes on all of it at the current income tax rate. The old "Gotcha".

Steven ---


Have you tried using "Portfolio Performance"


That will give you some info - but it's based on your total portfolio rather than broken out by stock. It will show you contributions -- and total gain/loss etc for various periods.

I see, thanks guys. Things are pretty simple for me right now...in most cases, just 1 purchase per stock; but I can see where actual cost basis gets a bit more cumbersome to track over the long haul.

Well I better create a spreadsheet; just another excuse to practice my Excel-fu.

Thanks for the 'Portfolio Performance' tip Greg; the summary table helps.

I just assumed this was known by everyone..... But here it is for Investing 102


So get out there and bang away my friends!!!



http://www.nbcnews.com/business/earn...ays-6C10945740

I get a shocking amount of PM's asking about investing. Most of which I can't really answer - because they're asking "what should I buy". As you all know - I don't recommend what to buy - and this thread is not about what to buy or what to sell.... it's about YOU GUYS learning some basics so that you're comfortable making these decisions on your own.

But the tickle for this post was the usual --- "with the market down.. shouldn't I wait to add more to my 401K?"

I think most are shocked when I respond -- HELL NO! ADD MORE!

Is this a "contrarian" view? No. It's a long term view with history on my side... and the knowledge that the market will go higher and if you buy "now" (whenever that is) 10 years from now it will be higher.

So the last month or so has been real poopie.... and this always gets people wanting to coast or back off the market. The exact wrong thing to do! Think of a period like this as suddenly seeing that '69 Camaro you always wanted that the guy was asking 100K for -- is now 70K.... do you wait for the guy to drop to 65? Chances are - someone smarter than you snaps it up and you miss out. The stock market is that way. The prices drop -- drop some more -- and you wait for ever better prices..... only to miss the day or two where the market snaps back and runs 5% -- then everyone feels good and piles in. Don't be "that guy". Save your dough -- and plow ahead... let your IRA/401 keep investing. And if you're saving on your own - set a date or amount - and every first of the month -- or every $500 -- INVEST IT. High or low. You'll buy more shares when it's low - and fewer when it's high... so your AVERAGE cost will smooth out over time.

Wealthy people get even more wealthy because they step in front of that moving train -- they'll buy buildings or businesses - or make investments - at bargain prices. When things turn around - they make even more money. Be like the wealthy and you'll be glad you did.

So I got tired of my savings account only earning 0.8% and have moved some money from there to another brokerage account. This account is outside of my Roth IRA so I'll have to pay capital gains taxes on it but I am paying taxes on my savings too. I won't be invested in any MLP's though with this account. I didn't move enough money from savings over to hurt me should I lose it all. I'm also simply going to be following the long term path I've started.

With that said, I was looking at this link http://dripinvesting.org/tools/tools.asp in order to check out different companies that pay dividends. What I haven't noticed before but did after going through the list is apparently some companies charge a fee in order to be in a DRiP. Can someone explain this to me? Is it something I should be concerned about? An example would be Verizon, VZ. According to that list, there's a fee. How are they able to charge me a fee to invest in their company and why?

EDIT: Further investigating on my part shows that a number of the companies I am already invested in a charging a fee. I'm guessing this fee isn't that big of a deal then. I just want to make sure I get the dividend I should and don't end up getting smacked with fees.


Thanks

Hey Greg, which underwear stock should i buy?

Seriously though, since i've opened up my Schwab acct, everything has just gone RED and so have my eyes. Its kinda funny, like the little man (with the top hat? is it the monopoly guy?) comes in just to mess with us....

But, where in the thread, or can u explain/elaborate on "priced for perfection"?

thanx, Mike

Here's one of the replies regarding priced to perfection, Mike.

Makes "perfect" sense, i remember reading that awile back. And if i had the chance, id buy or build an apartment complex right now, primarily cause i know real estate more than companies...

thanx

woohoo!

Altria Group, Inc. (MO) declares $0.48/share quarterly dividend, 9.1% increase from prior dividend of $0.44.
Forward yield 5.66%
Payable Oct. 10; for shareholders of record Sept. 16; ex-div Sept. 12

Ya got to love getting a raise don't ya!


EEEEEEEHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAA




I own 20,000 shares -- so that's --- 20,000 X's .04 = $800 per quarter increase X's 4 quarters ='s $3,200 per year * 12 ='s $266 per month for doing absolutely NOTHING....


Tell me what's wrong with that dividend ownership???

I'm ok with those numbers :yes:

Works for me!!! thats my 2nd increase with MO. First was 7% now 9%. I'm happy. :D :D

Eventually you could be like Warren Buffet == where he gets in DIVIDEND what his initial investment was in Coke (KO). Wouldn't that be sweet! Now that's a return on investment!!

Well, as I mentioned a couple posts back, I put some money from savings into another brokerage account I had. I put in my orders today. Since I am dealing with lower dollar amounts as I work on being diversified, I pay attention to the actual stock price and not just the dividend payout. I picked up a water utility, Verizon, General Mills, and Hasbro. They all pay a decent dividend and aren't expensive to purchase so I feel I actually bought a good amount and should get good dividend payments. I did buy some KMB. I only bought a few shares since they were "expensive". I need to count all my stocks and get them ordered by sector but I believe I'm about ready to start adding to them this next go around instead of buying different stocks. We will see but I'm positive I'll earn more than the 0.8% I was earning on that money that was in savings. :D

I will say one thing, pipeline and oil and gas MPLs pay a crap ton in dividends. I just didn't want to deal with the tax implications since this brokerage account is free standing and not under my Roth IRA umbrella.

Someone I know -- Mister Bobby B -- owns Sturm Ruger stock (yes folks - the gun maker) .... President Obama is the greatest gun salesman in the universe. Gun sales are off the charts - and like "terbacky" and liquor - you might as well make money off it!




Here's an article on Seeking Alpha about them.



http://seekingalpha.com/article/1655...g_income&ifp=0

Our very own Vegas69 seems to be smart and lucky at the same time! Having seemingly bought at the bottom of the real estate market! I just read that home prices in Las Vegas are up 24.9% (on an annual basis).

Way to go Todd!


I know that home sales in the greater Seattle area are just off the charts... multiple bids - homes selling for more than asking price - waivers of inspections and many all cash deals being done.

I had dinner last night with our broker here in Sun Valley who said sales had cooled here recently - and that they had "thought" things were going to really take off but that it had stalled. I would also say that the builders are begging for our business... all the while trying to post up a good front that they're "busy". They are "busy" but it's mostly because of a lack of qualified skilled craftsman which have moved from the area after such a long dry spell. Not necessarily because so many new homes are in the pipeline.

My friend is a RE agent here in San Francisco, and for the last 12-15 months, he has also seen the incredible trend of all-cash buyers. Specifically, Chinese all-cash buyers. After doing more research, he said the housing market in certain markets is being heavily driven by the new EB-5 Immigrant Investor program. It's a way to buy your Visa into the country so you can send your kids to college here, etc. etc.

Here is a good article on it. http://money.cnn.com/2013/07/08/real...html?hpt=hp_t5

The more I sit here and think about it, the more I stew...are we kidding ourselves into thinking housing is on the rebound, only because we are selling off our market to other countries? Or is there a healthier perspective out there?

(BTW this is not to negate kudos to Todd...Todd's smart and is doing it for positive cash flow and long term appreciation. I am talking about the rapid short-term appreciations we're seeing).

Real estate is a game of LOCATION LOCATION LOCATION.... which means more than what street address you have... it's what STATE --- WHAT CITY --- What's the employment picture look like.

Here's the way I look at these things you mentioned. There's NOTHING you can do about the larger picture (selling to Chinese or Asians or Russians).... WHAT CAN YOU DO TO MAKE MONEY FROM THE SITUATION?


Also -- Buying "CHEAP" property in a town or state because it's cheap --- will lead to poor return on investment. A house in a town that sells for 100K -- that was 90K 10 years ago... is a big ho hum. Buy a 1 million dollar house in a hot market that sells for 1.5 million 3 years later -- that's a win!

I read this article today -- thinking that there was going to be something of interest - something we could learn from - some lick of a hope that there was some light at the end of the tunnel for folks that have found themselves in a bad spot.

Let me preface also by saying -- I've been BROKE... dead broke... and I've been rich a couple of times... THERE IS NOTHING WORSE THAN BEING DEAD BROKE. No question about it... it's a terrible feeling. Money might not buy "everything" but it buys what you need -- and when you need things and can't buy the basics. LlFE SUCKS.

Okay....

So here's my take away from this story....

The family that I wanted to feel sorry for --- was nothing more than your typical American family -- they used their house as an ATM... refi over and over to pull money OUT to live the American dream. Buying stuff and living large. The dude makes 160K a year -- has a Mercedes -- a swimming pool -- an RV -- "bikes and quads for the kids".... all of which was on borrowed money (the house ATM).

Sorry guys -- I don't feel sorry for them one friggin' bit. What did they think they were going to need financially when their FOUR kids wanted to go to college? How about when the roof needed replacing... or any of the other basics of unexpected costs come up. Magically refi the house AGAIN....


The banks were and are most of the problem -- they ALLOWED for people to live the dream as if it would never end.... but you MUST TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR OWN ACTIONS! Period. They dangled the bait -- but you don't have to take it! You're supposed to have a brain! Just because there's coke out there on the street doesn't mean you have to do it!

BEFORE these folks blew thru their "savings" - they should have sold the quads and the RV -- then the Mercedes... and THEN dipped into the savings and in the meantime PRIDE probably kept them from doing any of that.... or getting that second job etc.


http://www.nbcnews.com/business/fami...ent-8C11036099

That's basically why I have not spent much money on my TA. I just don't feel that I have enough of a savings cushion or retirement started. At times I believe I'm wrong and can easily afford to do what I want to the car. Maybe I'm a little scared too as I've never had the kind of money I have now to spend. When I was younger and just day dreaming, spending all this money on a car was nothing. Now that I'm working through the labor day weekend(I'll be up at 3am tomorrow) to earn the money I make, I'm not so interested in spending it quickly. I never want to find myself questioning if I'll be able to keep the house I'm living in. Hopefully, I'm not taking it too far and not living life at the same time but that's for a different thread.

I especially love it when people have to sell their liquid assets (like their cars for example) and say 'I have over $$$$ invested" when it was never an investment to begin with,99% of the time it was a deprecatory item....common sense... but i too have made these mistakes in the past, some of us learn from the history we've made, some of us don't...

Life does have to be lived -- but there's this thing called LIFE AFTER YOU NO LONGER WORK --- that seems to be getting stretched out longer and longer. I don't want to be 82 and working at McDonalds -- I want McDonalds to send me a dividend check!


What happens to ALL OF US -- is that we tend to SPEND early -- and Save too late.... and what we need to do is SAVE EARLY so we can spend later and be able to do that at a far higher rate!

What happens to ALL OF US -- is that we tend to SPEND early -- and Save too late.... and what we need to do is SAVE EARLY so we can spend later and be able to do that at a far higher rate![/QUOTE]

That is a mouthful, and the key to latter success. And stay away from credit cards.

Credit cards are the worst thing to ever happen to "money management". The fact that we can "charge" things -- does not mean that we can afford them. It just means that we've successfully managed to defer paying for them. Usually that means then that we charge more than we can actually afford to pay for - which contributes to LESS cash flow each month which leads to more charging!

A very vicious cycle even for rich folks! Rich folk that I know have 100K limits on their cards --- rather than 10K or 1K for the less fortunate... and I know people that have maxed out 100K cards. OMG -- really!! 100K at 18%....

THEY, of course, don't think they're broke because... after all... they're rich. Dude -- if you're rich!?!?! Then pay your balance each month. Otherwise you're IN DEBT.

"Affording something" is being able to pay for it. Right now - all in all done. Don't kid yourself otherwise. Paying "CASH" -- but using the house credit line -- is not PAYING CASH... You're just full of crap and kidding yourself if you think that's paying cash.

I do, however, think that payments and leases are fine --- IF you're saving a large percentage of dough each month at the same time, i.e., You lease a car but you're also contributing $500 or $600 a month to your 401/IRA/ROTH account. Then it's just cash management --- but if you aren't saving money then you're just stalling the debt.

I personally believe they teach (or don't) the law of exponential math at a far too early age, you should have too take it in junior high, then high school, then again in college to ram it into your brain...to quote "cool hand luke", "some folks you just cant reach..."

Personally, I love my credit card. I use it for everything I can. I get 1% bonus points for each dollar. I pay it off each month. They owe me $600 for using their card :G-Dub:

Nobody burns the plastic better than I do... but it's a convenience that's used in place of carrying around cash. We travel a LOT... and I can wear the stripe off that bad boy. But like you - the bill is paid - and frankly - because I'm so anal - before it's due. I see the bill climbing during the month (thanks to on line banking) I transfer some money to it. For whatever reason the big balance bothers me.

I pay my credit card off everymonth and have never paid a dime of interest or a annual fee. I like getting the cash back bonus and use the money to buy tires etc for my cars. Stuff that you need but don't necessarily get excited about.

I've almost completely stopped using credit cards. I pay with cash or my debit card. I spent years buying on plastic and paying off the bill every month. I just find that the immediate weight of the purchase makes you debate whether it's really worth spending the money or not vs. the surprise in the mail box every month. What really woke me up was looking back over my bank statements for 6 months and seeing what I now consider reckless spending and waste on credit card bills. Every dollar counts as it can be used for investing and ensuring your freedom at a predetermined age.

Americans have been programmed to be in debt over the last 50 years by the banks. To buy the biggest house, a new car every 3 years, student loans, 5 credit cards with balances, you name it. I've never liked debt but I'm at the point now where I hate debt. Live well within you means and invest wisely and you can be very wealthy and weave the lifestyle you desire.

Agreed. You do have to be careful with what you spend your money on when using a CC since it's not immediately coming out of your wallet. I'm too busy right now to do much more than spend my money on the basic necessities in life so I'm not getting crazy with the CC that's for sure.

You're also right about the way we're programmed. The marketing folks in this country are doing a great job. Luckily, their BS doesn't work on me though I am fascinated by it.

Anyone have a thought on what this Vodaphone separation will mean? I have some of it and am a bit on edge...