Laurie, thanks for the great info. Concealed in a casino is ok or is that a gray area also? Thanks.

I believe that's the case, but the few times I've been pulled over I've advised the officer that I'm carrying and have a permit.

I've had a permit in Oregon since '84 and carry frequently and have never had an incident with LEO's, property, or business owners. But I do my best to conceal my handgun with proper clothing. What people don't know doesn't hurt them applies in this situation.

Open carry in Oregon's "outback" has never been an issue and legal for as long as I can remember. Most natives assume locals are armed, primarily to protect themselves from Cougar, Bear, and now Wolves. Simply put, the issues come from metropolitan immigrants, usually well educated except when it comes to a State Law they don't know or agree with. :bang:

Cougars are a real danger. Especially at some of those 'outback' bars! Last thing you want to get cornered by.

Not agreeing with the law...That IS the main culprit. Good comment.

Carrying in casinos is definately frowned upon. Keep your eyes peeled to any signage that is posted at the entry doors or in the parking garage, ususally by the elevators. Again, if carrying concealed, don't display any imprint or make it obvious and what they dont see.....(wink wink)

They might just ask you to put it in your car or they might offer you a safe box in the security office. I would kindly refuse both options and go someplace else.

I don't agree with you most of the time. Whatcha gonna do about it? :poke:

brave man....... :peepwall:

So true, I'd much rather wake up with a hungry wounded Mountain Lion......They smell better and much less chance of wound infection. :D

Laurie, thanks for sharing.

I find the above true in most cases, and particularly with the police in general around here. Maybe they are ignorant or maybe they don't care. I do think our town has a good force. Even if they have a retired military tank, at least they aren't roaming the streets in it. :warning: My brother in law is a cop, and he's the one telling me that federal law trumps state law. I had to remind him of the 10th amendment. :rules: I think any officer should be required to be educated on the laws they are supposed to be enforcing. I'll go a step further and suggest that officers should be more like firefighters and remain in the station until they are called upon. :idea: But I digress.

It's one of the reasons I got a Utah permit, because I really did not want my CCW permit to be tied with my drivers license. What does driving have to do with carrying a firearm anyway? Therefor, I would could keep any CCW info on a need to know basis if pulled over. I believe we have the castle law here in MO that states my vehicle, like my home is my property. MO residents can transport and keep a gun in the car as long as its concealed. No permit required.

For NEVADA...

NRS 200.120  “Justifiable homicide” defined; no duty to retreat under certain circumstances.

1.  Justifiable homicide is the killing of a human being in necessary self-defense, or in defense of habitation, property or person, against one who manifestly intends or endeavors, by violence or surprise, to commit a felony, or against any person or persons who manifestly intend and endeavor, in a violent, riotous, tumultuous or surreptitious manner, to enter the habitation of another for the purpose of assaulting or offering personal violence to any person dwelling or being therein.

2.  A person is not required to retreat before using deadly force as provided in subsection 1 if the person:

(a) Is not the original aggressor;

(b) Has a right to be present at the location where deadly force is used; and

(c) Is not actively engaged in conduct in furtherance of criminal activity at the time deadly force is used.

-OR-


as the old saying goes....



I'd rather be judged by 12.... than carried by 6

Laurie found this and shared it with me. http://friendorfoe.us/ Great tool!

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphot...57718460_n.jpg

:rules:

When seconds count........
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=34a_1317870586

I always loved my black Beretta. Just got a permit to pick up a 9mm variant as well. With the writing on the wall here in NY, I'd like to be grandfathered in.

http://media.motortopia.com/files/14...Thumbnail1.jpg

Just bought this Ruger 9mm with laser this weekend,

My son Alex would call that an ankle biter!!


Looks like a nice piece!





While over in SV.... I bought a 1965 Browning Superposed - Belgium made - Pigeon grade - 28 ga over and under.... with skeet barrels. We'll see if I can still shoot clay.

Good choice! I know a couple LEO's that use those for "deep cover" backup.

They maybe small and lack a little firepower, but being so convenient and comfortable to carry you'll carry it more often than not and the best gun is the one you have when you need one. :thumbsup:

Very nice. I love my .380 LCP with a crimson trace. The trigger is long, but once you get used to it they're great to carry.

Going to my concealed carry class tomorrow.
Oregon, Utah, and Arizona License. It covers all but 13 states.

Taking the class at http://www.threatdynamics.com/civilian/

Old thread wake up!



I want to buy my son a skeet/trap shotgun for Xmas.... The dealer over here handles Beretta and Caesar Guerini.... I'm favoring the Caesar Guerini but don't know too much about them. Anyone familiar with these??


I can tell ya that I'm loving my '65 Browning Superposed 28 ga O/U for skeet...
The workmanship on that shotgun is just amazing compared to the stuff that is new now.

Are you looking at 12, 20, or 28 ga ?

Will he end up shooting more trap or skeet or sporting clays?

Would you be interested in a good used Browning?

Let me know and I'll check on Browning availability. What specific models of Caesar Guerini and Beretta? I'll get a qualified opinion on those as well.

Good questions!


Skeet and trap... since the range here offers both - but mostly skeet.


I'd like him to shoot 28 because then I only need to stock cases of that -- but he's a macho man and will want to shoot 12 gauge.

Funny thing about kids.... I shot 19 of 25 with my 28.... he put down 17 of 25 with his 12... I'm throwing about a 1/3 of the lead he is down range... but he still doesn't get that his Daddy is a better shot than he is by virtue of accuracy.


Caesar Guerini -- I like the Maxum Sporting -- 30"


After looking over the wood quality and fit and finish of the higher end Berettas --- I don't think I could own one. The craftsmanship just isn't there.

They have a Browning Superposed at Silver Creek that would make a nice "mate" to mine...


http://store.silver-creek.com/Browni...n-p/lel-20.htm


Originally I was just looking to get him a Browning Citori.... But the more I think about it -- I'd rather shoot heirloom quality guns over just ordinary stuff.

Sieg ---


This is the other Caesar Guerini I am interested in:



http://www.gueriniusa.com/gun_models...t_Impact.shtml

I believe this is the gun available but with case hardened receiver and upgraded oil finished lumber. Not sure on adjustable comb stock or rib options.

http://www.gueriniusa.com/gun_models...ent_popup1.jpg

This receiver without the gold.
http://www.gueriniusa.com/gun_models...Ltd_popup1.jpg

I would consider their DTS trigger system valuable due to the length of pull adjustment which is standard on the Summit Ascent model.

http://www.gueriniusa.com/gun_models...mit_Ascent.pdf

More info in a couple days..........

Hey Sieg -- thanks for the input and the call the other day!

I ended up driving to Boise - a gun shop there - Boise Gun Company... it was only a 5 hour round trip and I had nothing better to do. They are Caesar Guerini dealers -- and get this -- the owner told me they had 6200 guns IN STOCK!! Trust me -- this is one heck of a gun shop. I've never been in one that was so packed -- with guns AND customers! WOW!

Anyway -- he had a CG Challenger Impact 12 ga in stock --- it's an absolutely beautiful shotgun -- heirloom quality stuff -- so I bought that.... AND the coupe d gras..... I casually ask him if he ever gets any Wilson Combat stuff in.... OH YEAH he says with wild looking eyes! I got one last week! Out of 6200 guns he has ONE Wilson Combat in. It is the Professional --- 4" barrel --- .45ACP... all black... and yes, that's mine as well.

Sadly -- they had to send it to Seattle to a FFL dealer because while I have Washington and Utah CC --- that won't get ya a handgun in EyedeeHo. I'm dying to shoot this bad boy!

Late to the show here.........the rib on that Challenger is going to be a little tall for you isn't it? :underchair:

http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/prem.../128333-08.jpg

When you're passing through we should take a "range break" at the Baron's Den on I-5.

http://www.thebaronsden.com/

I'm envious of that Wilson Combat! Never shot one, but have always wanted to see if they live up to the hype. Hope you'll share a review once you get a chance to put a few rounds through it.

Congrats

Some day I will have a Wilson Combat myself. Have a Les Baer PII and a SA Trophy Match, both nice 1911's that make me look good at the range. Personal protection is a Glock 19 and a Mossberg 12 gauge.

Geez, I better watch what I say...

Ditto on both.. you're a big dude so I am kinda surprised the G19 fits your hand unless you have a mag extender?

Hopefully you have an "assault" rifle too as backup. :lol:

Yes, I have an "evil black rifle"............ :lol: I did add a different mag baseplate a week ago to get the extra finger support, but it fit me great as-is. Don't have fat fingers.

I know this is a little late and probably has been mentioned before, but it is very important that:

The best defense weapon for anyone is the one that has become a natural extention of your mind, arms, and hands.

Be it a 50 BMG, or a baseball bat, just be proficent!

1. Join the NRA- in addition to supporting the 2nd amendment, membership also gives you liability insurence when dealing with specific shooting groups.

2) Join the "USPSA", and learn to shoot correctly.

If you have not been trained the methods and grips etc., I promise, you do not know how to hold and shoot your gun correctly.

Be open to learning what they teach. Girls usually follow instructions bettter than guys, because guys think they already know everything. Be humble and courteous and you will receive a top of the line FREE education.

People are very friendly and want to help other become better shooters. One word of advice, Be aware of where your muzzle is pointed "ALL THE TIME", loaded or unloaded. They do not put up with people who are careless with their firearms.

Basically tell someone that you are new and you need to go to the "Safe Area". This is a place designated at every meeting. Make sure your gun is unloaded,in a bag or a holster, however you MUST have a holster.

Un-load the gun if loaded, Lower the hammer, or in the case of glocks and other similar pistols, pull the trigger with an unloaded gun. This is considered "Hammer Down". At any of these gatherings there is a safe place are designated, that is the ONLY PLACE you can handle and take your fire arm out of it's holster without being directed by a range officer.

This is also the practice with the IDPA that is a somewhat similar organization listed below.

The finest shooters in the world are found in the USPSA. It can be intimidating to shoot with them at time because you suck so bad. Don't worry, you will suck less with time and practice. :relax:

http://www.uspsa.org

3. Join the IDPA: These are a group of very proficient shooters that are focused strickly on self defense in real life senarios. It is totally different than the USPSA, in this respect.

It would be my recomendation for everyone who hasn't been taught the right way to shoot. (I really mean this!)

http://www.idpa.com

All of you who have guns, please join the NRA and at least your local IDPA, or USPSA group, and shoot all the time.

I am totally serious, you will be amazed at how bad you are without their traing methods, and practice.

They might be intimidating, but hang in their and you will have a great time. In the off chance you meet a jerk, *They exist in all clubs) please meet a lot of people so you can find who you feel the most comfortable with.

Anyone else who has shot with any of these groups, give me your validation.

Join the NRA regardless. Use the two organizations above to get involved with shooting.

Take care,

Ty O'Neal
1964 Corvette
1965 Riviera
1969 Camaro

Everything has a Pro touring attitude. :D

Well said Ty!

My muscle memory is geared to the geometry of the 1911. I can shoot another handguns accurately (self-defense accuracy) as long as the barrel-grip angle is close to the 1911.

Sight pictures aren't an option in most self-defense situations and those angles related to muscle memory when point shooting are critical IMO.

If I point shoot for center mass X on a silhouette with a Glock at 7 yds my typical double tap group is high in the neck area.

Those who carry - Commit yourself to practice that creates muscle memory with what ever weapon you choose. It doesn't have to be live fire drills. Laser attachments make it easy to practice draw and point.

Remember the draw from concealment may well determine if you win or lose the race. The draw should be practiced equally if not more!

No matter what type of fire arms you use you need to need to training to use it properly. And to become proficient with it. He who has had military and police training already know this. Because if you try to use a fire arm an you freeze up and or panic . You could possibly lose you life or somebody other than the bad guy.

Even police who train panic. Unless you a trained killer and/or have been in war many, many times. You will still panic. But, I do agree. One does need to know how to properly use a firearm. No doubt there.

Which is exactly why guys like me go to schools like Front Sight....




It's. No different than if you want to be a "racer". You start out with and periodically go take training.

100% true statement. Training and muscle memory are critical to your survival in a deadly force confrontation. The only thing more critical than that is your mindset. You need to know how you will react to certain certain situations.

The Front Sight course I'm taking for four days following SEMA --- is about being able to draw from a concealed carry and put two "sighted shots" in the torso -- within 1.5 seconds...


There's no Mozambique shot to the head either by the way.... LOL



The drills will include clearing rooms -- or entering rooms -- where the same targets you've been shooting at as bad guys -- are in the room only this time they may only have knitting needles or some other object and should (obviously) NOT be a target.... That ought to get tricky!

I'll, no doubt, flunk the course.

That place and course get great reviews on the Calguns site.

I friend of mine spent a week with them and greatly improved his shooting skills. He learned a ton when it came to defensive shooting. It should be a good course for you.