speed tech sub
 

anybody have any thoughts on the camaro sub they came out with, trying to deside which way to go, loved the DSE/AME discussion
dave

We have the first Speedtech subframe in Project EmptyNest. Because of some "SMEA Thrash" items, and a jammed packed shchedule of shows and photoshoots since SEMA, we have not had the pleasure to get it up and running, and driving. So I cannot give a seat of the pants opinion yet. We should have a driving report in mid January.

The subframe is built strong as can be and mounted in perfectly. It measured so good on the first shot using the line up holes, I questioned the tape measure. The suspension numbers are good and it is priced awesome. Were selling them for $4800, which is a good $1400 + under the other quality frames out there.

Right now we are in the unique position of having 4 different quality subframe's we offer in price ranges from the mid $4000 range to $7500 range. We sell DSE, Art Morrison, Chris Alston, and Speedtech Subframe's. All the rest out there are not a consideration for us as they are all street rod crapola and we will not sell crap for the sake of profit!

No one else has as wide a variety of subframe and suspension products. So I think this makes us uniquely UNBIAS financially. In other words, we do not have to promote one frame or another just because it is the only one we sell and make money on. I think each frame has is distinctive market position.

Feel free to call me and discuss the virtues of each frame, along with your needs / requirements / wants / budget which are all different caveats in your subframe selection

thanks for the info frank
being a new product i havent seen alot of write ups on this one. the shop that im having do some of the body mods (perfection autosport) is still suggesting a c5 front. I have been in contact a couple of times with ed over at 21st century. Looking at achived forums and trying to combine my rear ( custom 3 link, fab 9 ) with the front is been tough. I was not aware that you are a vendor? sorry new to site
dave

frank
nothing against DSE used it on past projects but the thing with this project is "show and go" and i feel the look of the fabs flow through to the rear better. I basically got 3 to choose (AME, Speed tech , 21st) Im not going to buy a "packaged frame" and plan on picking my own bolt ons but I do like speed techs arms despite there mig welded
Are shops are scarce here that i can trust so my past knowledge and forums is what im relying on
dave

You want to buy a frame and then outfit it with susp.?

I wouldn't do that because they design the frame and susp. to work together.

Not trying to start the welding debate again but theres not going to be a problem with them being mig welded vs tig on the control arms

mig vs tig
peas vs carrots

either one is good for 99% of everything on a car, mig is faster and all that is needed,

speed tech sub
 

thanks guys for the input, what i meant as far as bolt ons to the subframe is im still looking at having the shop modify c5 to a prefabbed frame or just go with 21st century if i go this route. I too have nothing against mig welds vs tig but its just my opinion for suspension i prefer the tig
dave

Steve of twist machines would be a good
 

person to ask this question. He has driven a variety of frames, including a 21St Century and would give you an honest opinion. Frank knows his stuff too, but I cannot remember if he has driven a 21st frame. I am sure he will chime in and I would take his word for gold as well.

I happen to have a 21st frame and it is a top notch piece. My office is about 10 minutes from Ed's shop. If for some reason you are down this way, I will be more than happy to let you drive my car.

I think you would be hard pressed to really feel a difference in the DSE, 21st Century, AME from a performance standpoint.

Steve Rupp is running a 21st Century with a Lateral Dynamics 3 link in the rear. He should be testing his car soon so you should have some hard numbers to go by.

Hey Payton,

I have not Driven the 21st Century and probably should group it with the others. It just does not seem as popular so I tend to forget it. But everything I have heard has been good.

Hey Payton,
ironically the pict Ed sent me of the frame install was of your car. I mentioned to Ed that I thought i was doing a double take when i saw it. (same color)
Hey Frank,
You cant group it with the other chassis on the market, its a different animal than others like WD were. As far as its popularity not being there I feel because so many are tuned and dialed in with the existing suspensions. Just wait i feel a change in the future similiar to the 3links and truck arms in lieu of the 4s

Yea Frank
 

I have to agree with you on them being not as popular as the others. I think that has more to do with marketing. I have not driven the others metioned so I really can't speak of the differences in performances ( which I think are very small if any)

I think the biggest difference in the 21st frame is the ability to make adjustments. Eccentric bolts on the lower control arms and the circle track style adjustment tabs for the uppers. That was the main reason I went with it...not that I have run it any different than it comes.

I really do believe that all of the frames have their own merits and all would do an great job.

Not to change the direction of this thread, but I would like to drive a G Max chassis installed in a 1st gen Camaro.

Payton
Agreeable on the G max. Ironically through this thread Ive been in contact with Dave Jones over at Morrison. The price isnt bad, little over 7gs with the IRS set up and then upgrades from there. I not sure if your aware of this but when Dave emailed me today he mentioned that there changing over to c6 components on the bolt in unit. He mentioned that the only thing needed would be to modify the inner fenders slightly.
dave

I can't remember who I spoke with over there
 

a few weeks ago, but for the G Max frame with the C6 stuff front running a 3 link rear was about $11,000....plus they will build in whatever ride height you want. I am leaning that way ( well really more like falling that way) for my next build. It seems that I am always starting with something that needs floors and a trunk anyways, might as well cut it out, weld in the entire frame and build floors on top of that.

Instead of modifing the inners just make new ones

Hey Payton
 

The only thing with me is that the body is mint and hate to cut it up for a max G. I will be making my decision on which way to go prior to christmas. Or should I say spend the money now before my wife gives me the bill for all the kids christmas gifts. Im gonna contact AM one more time to get an exact qoute on what i want. Keep u posted, nice talkin
dave

Please do yourself a favor and look into the full chassis from Jeff Schwartz.

www.gmachinechassis.com

No body mods required and it mounts to the existing suspension points in the rear. Feel free to call Jeff if you have any questions.

Schwartz frame
 

Thanks, being new to the site Im finding more product info than i ever had in my years of technical info out of mags and local shops. I will contact jeff and check into it. One thing so far is that they are about 40 min. away, maybe Ill stop in.
dave

Art Morrisom C6 3 link GMax .... Cut the floors you won't regret it

Cutting the floors!
 

on a mint body. OK OK OK as I said before Im setting up for show/go. I will agree that fabbed sheet metal is a much killer look under the mirror than stock pans. I just would like to keep the funds down on this one.
dave

If you want to stay with a sub and use C5..... Art Morrison
Check it out its a nice peace

I am not trying to get you to cut up your car,
 

but from a cost standpoint I would guess it would be a wash. Lets say $7000 for the front and $5000 for a Lateral Dynamics rear plus weld in sub connectors and the labor to put it all in. $11,000 or $12,000 for the g max plus install. Man it would only be a few thousand different. Plus you can really run your car low. I would have to put air ride on the G max. I would have the frame designed to run about 4 ride height from rocker. Pump up the bags to get in and out of the driveway and over speed bumps, dump em when parked.

Back to the original discussion....If you don't want to cut the car up the subframes we have spoken about would all do you a great job, Am, 21st, speed tech, DSE. Don't forget to ask about header options for all of the above. They are not cheap!

Comp spec, are you not going a g max with a 3 link in a car right now?

When all said and done the price difference is in the fab work on the floors.
I know its hard to cut up a nice car but like Payton King said the ride heigh with nothing hanging underneth is hard to beat.

Yes were in the middle of a 66 chevelle gmax c6 3 link right now and another gmax 3 link 66 here for the same thing

I don't want to hi jack this thread
 

so I will give you a call hopefully next week or send you a PM on the install of that frame.

Let me know. I'll help anyway I can
www.competition-specialties.com

Back to the 1st question

There subframe is a real nice peace I got to see 1 at SEMA.
Lets you run a 10in rim and you can use stuff you already have or update as your budget lets you
Did you see the built control arms they made for the subframe talk about a trick setup

yeah those control arms were sweet!! :thumbsup:

Where is Blake to sell his product?? :lol:

I am wearing the cheerleading skirt for Speedtech, Blake said it did not fit him!

Boy the choices out there get tougher and tougher. I've thought about adding a DSE Speed 2 kit to my existing frame but the Speed Tech unit is pretty tempting. The other ones on the market are out of my budget/justification for my use. I guess I would really have to see it in person to give a look see if it is truely an option for the extra coin.

Remember there's nothing wrong with updating the stock frame....

Maybe Blake will put up some pictures of the frame from SEMA let everyone see it up close
He's done lots of updates so far so that means they must be working it
R&D thats good

Wheres Blake
 

That would be sweet If someone posted these pictures your talking about.
Hey Payton feel free to HIJACK the thread. Im pretty much done here for now, I am waiting on some vendors to get back to me on a defined cost and I am going to be traveling to look at some personally soon. Thanks guys for all the info. OH YEA I forgot Im starting to but back the 69 stock subframe with aftermarket components, Purchacing a Dynocorn and starting from scratch. Pictures soon as I can figure out how to do the photobuket thing or what ever its called
dave

Here's Blake
 

Wow you would think i never come on here, how does a thread get to 4 pages and you don't even see it :willy: :willy: must be busy!!!
i can post some pics on monday but if you go to the site
www.speedtech-perfromance.com and have a look at the sub frame and all the info is there. we are currently ready to sell the units all i am waiting for is the new High Clearance lower control arms to arrive should be late this week.
like we have said in the past our sub has not been designed to be better that AME or DSE it is designed to be better than original, like frank said it is strong, looks good, fits a big tire we tested it with both air ride ( which bolts on by the way) and coil overs, it fits a 18 x 10 with a 6.25 BS and will turn almost to the rack stops. with air ride and a 285 30 18 the cross member is almost on the ground the inner fenders are the limiting factor. and Frank has the answer for that.
as for the billet arms i am glad you like them, they are on the site as well and if you buy the complete sub (till March 1 2008) tha billet arms are a 1500.00 up grade.

what are the advantages/disadvantages of the speedtech vs the alston subframe for a 69 camaro. Do both allow a 275 tire up front. Frank why did you choose the speedtech subframe for your firebird? Do both have a crossmember to run a tko trans?
thanks

Both the Alston and Speedtech frame are good frames and are the highest of quality construction. Both can handle the 275 tire. Why did I choose the Speedtech for the Firebird? I talked to Blake about his new subframe, looked at the plans, it was going to be brand new, I liked what I saw, I liked the targeted price point and felt like I needed to test it. And I am very happy with it. It is just a screamin deal.

I have the dse upper and lower control arms with the ats spindle. Will that stuff bolt up to the speed tech and the alston frame?
Thanks

Yes Speedtech will use your factory replacment components. That is truley one of the great things about this frame. Alston uses proprietary components.

I have seen the Speed-Tech sub frame in person and it is a really nice piece!!:thumbsup:

I have one of the Speed Tech subframes and am very happy so far. Here's a link to a bunch of pics of it: https://lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=15259

Can you use the steering box? or do you have to convert to Rack and Pinion?

It does require you use the Rack and Pinion