big problem varishocks
 

today i will do my first testdriving with the new suspension in my camino.
lower a arms from spohn and varishock coil overs 575lbs.
the first problem when i will move out of my garage: steering ! i can not steering easy:(
back on the car lift and i can see the tie-rods both side scrups on the chassis.
the next what i see and feel: no damping and absorbing, and i see the problem.
the lower a arm bumps on the chassis.
this pic is shot with the jack under the front end
http://www.chevy-elcamino.com/varishock2.jpg
what is the problem ? is the spring rate too low ?
when i install the new parts, the camino comes 2" lower than before:question:

I think what you're saying is that the ride height simply needs to be raised.

scott
thats what i´m think. but with the coil overs i can only down not up.
the springs are too short ?:_paranoid

Really? You're out of adjustment, can't raise the ride height more? If that's the case, and you're on the bump stops, you definitely have the wrong free length spring.

It sounds like you need to get taller springs. BTW - like the frame mounted air horns!

hmm, i think so.
i send marcus a email, and we will wait again.
the old stock a-arms with the hotchkis springs have a straight line under the car, the new spohn arms have a angle up !
i will post later new pics.

hmm, markus send me now a mail.
mark says:

You`ve got the ride height set WAY too
low. The suspension is bottomed out. Add some preload to the ride height
adjusters.


when i give more pre-load, the spring have no more space for working.
the coil windings are for the moment narrow nearby:_paranoid

This is all part of putting a really adjustable suspension in a car. You need to adjust it. The motion ratio of the coil over is such that 1/2" of coil over travel equals about 1" of wheel travel. On a lowered car we don`t have much jounce travel left so the coil over shows even less. That looks funny to people at first but as long as the coils aren`t actually touching at any point (coil bind) you`re fine. Using a longer spring would mean that it`s compressed height is also higher and it would coil bind before the shock has used it`s full travel. It`s permissible to use a 1" coil spring preload spacer and it`s sometimes a handy tuning aid but it shouldn`t be necessary with 575lb/in springs on a small block G body. We can`t help without enough information though. We need more info as far as where the lower seat is (can`t see it in the pic). Posting threads like this before the client has even spoken to the vendor is almost always counter productive because you end up with a lot of wild speculation from (well meaning) people who have never worked with the system before. It just muddys the water and makes it harder to get things done. It`s best done after the tuning is done,then it can be a help to others. Mark SC&C

hi markus,
i have you now send a mail with pics.
adjust is not the problem, the problem are the spohn arms.
i have now the springs fully compressed, for the arms can free moving.

chassis grinding is the next:(

yeep, here is the problem
first pic, under the car, springs fully compressed.
messurement from centerbolt to a-arm
http://www.chevy-elcamino.com/0P1020504.jpg

second pic
old a-arm, messurement from a-arm to centerbolt

http://www.chevy-elcamino.com/0P1020507.jpg

difference 0.7":(

Klaus and I have been working this over and the primary issue is that the car is simply set much too low. He raised the ride height some and the arms had a lot more clearance. At this point the pivot axis of the lower ball joints was still above the inner pivot axis where the arms bolt to the frame. That`s too low. You want the inner pivot far enough above that you allow for some brake dive before the geometry goes south. See pic. The orange line is level. The red line shows where a line between the pivot axis is now (at the "raised ride height") and the blue shows where it really should be for best geometry and performance. Basically the Spohn arms use the cross bar in lieu of a bumpstop to prevent over compressing the suspension and causing shock or steering linkage damage.

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t.../P1020527b.jpg

At that height the car is still about 1.5" or so lower than stock and everything has plenty of clearance and travel. If you want the car lower for cosmetic reasons simply use tall lower ball joints (in this application) or spindles with some additional drop like AFXs and you can have lots of travel,great geometry and the stance you want. Coil overs aren`t the end all be all of lowering a car and making it handle,they`re just another useful tool in the box. Like any tool they have to be used properly for best performance. A new option BTW are the SPC Performance tubular lower arms which offer 1" of additional drop and more clearance as well as enhanced geometry and bumpstops. We`ll have them up on the site as soon as our web guy gets off his butt. Mark SC&C

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t...C/lowerarm.jpg

yesterday i have my first rollout after the wintertime
the bad news first.
the car is undriveably.
why ?
the car is now 2.5 inch lower than before with the Hotchkis springs.
steering is the biggest problem, you cant turn from left to right.
the car is definitive to low.
i think this are 7" long varisprings, will i helps when i replace this with 9" ?

and last but not least, the biggest joke are the lower tubular a arms from spohn.
this a-arms have no steering stop limit and no bump stops.
the centering for the ball joints is not the same as on stock arms.
and this will say, i come with the steering parts more backwards.
i think i replace the lower arms and buy the g-plus from global west.
the global west have all the features, bump stops, steering stops.
greets
klaus

yea, its done.
the problem is solved.
yesterday arrive my new lower tubular a-arms from Global west.
i replace the spohn arms with the global west arms, and ??
yeep, the car looks for the moment as a bigfoot on the front !
i only change the lower arms and this raise the front 2.5" !
the geometry is much more better than before.
that says to me: the spohn arms will not work on my car and the upper arms.
pics follows today.
when you have the two brands on the table, you can see the difference.

here are now two new pics.
the first pic on the left side the spohn and right the global west.
the global west comes with bump stops and steering limiter and stabi-rods, the spohn has nothing.
with the spohn you have no place between chassis and a-arm.
http://www.chevy-elcamino.com/spohn-global1.jpg
on the second pic you can see on passenger side the global west and on drivers side the spohn. both sides the coil over fully compressed.
http://www.chevy-elcamino.com/spohn-global2.jpg

forget the spohn for the g-body:yes:

i will post today new pics when the car is on the ground

aah, i forget to say:
the tool for the varishocks is a big joke.
busted knuckles guaranted:yes:

the tool is not the problem, everyone forgets or is not told about the adjuster bearings that are available for the coilover conversions, they are a MUST!

adjuster bearings ?
thanks killer69, no one tell me about this stuff:mad:

Just goes to show different things work for different folks. We have an `87 GN in the shop right now with exactly the same Spohn lower arms, coil overs and 2" drop spindles and we have it sitting at near stock ride height. I`m glad you have the car where you want it now though.
BTW if you think the Varishock spanner with the 4 huge teeth is a knuckle buster you`ve never worked with the standard 1 little tooth coil over spanners! The Varishock wrenches are really awesome in comparison.
Don`t count on the tiny GW bumpstops,the coilovers will still overtravel and the tie rods will still hit the frame before the bumpstops contact the frame. They`re just for looks. Check your compression travel and replace them with taller ones that will prevent over compressing the coil overs and you`ll increase the life of the shocks and suspension parts. Mark SC&C

back again and the problems are flying away.
the lower spohn arms are the problem.
they dont will work with my upper global west negative roll a-arms.
i install the new lower global west a-arms and this stuff fits great.:bow:
i drive now the last weeks without any problem:thumbsup:
http://files.americar.de/gallery_pic...a9ca7868b7.jpg

Looks Good
 

El Camino car looks great now. I like the color and the stance.
Wayne

thanks waynieZ;)
this was a hard way to the result.
a lot of money and much more small talk with brainless peoples and companys.
http://www.chevy-elcamino.com/Sanem2008/P1050779.jpg