Poll: LS3 or LS7 vs. GM Crate Ram Jet 502
 

Just when I think I know how I building my car (69 Camaro), I read another thread on this forum and change my mind!

When I started this build, I was pretty sure I wanted a big block 502. I have only ever owned small blocks and was always envious of the power and rumble from an old school big block. I have been reading a lot lately about the LS engines and I am starting to waffle on my initial decision.

I live about 3 miles from Maple Grove Raceway and about 1 ½ hours from Carlisle Fair grounds. I will spend most of my time driving on the highway to and from shows, but will also take the car to Maple Grove a few times a year.

I want an engine that is reliable, bullet proof, awesome performance, neck breaking torque, great looks and around 500hp. I also want an engine that will add value to the build.

So my dilemma is this; should I go with the GM Crate Ram Jet 502 or a LS3 or LS7?

Please vote and write your comments below to support your vote – Thanks!

no..

the real question is WHAT IS YOUR BUDGET!

Okay, you caught me…I forgot the budget! $10-15k for the engine

LS7 or a LS3 with a Magnacharger. The first will get you to 500 hp, the second will get you there plus about 150 more.

If you have the cash...LS7 all the way.

Best of both worlds.....aluminum big block thats injected.:D Not a big fan of the LS series with fuel injection. Now when you put a bad ass hogans intake or carb on an LS7 I am game. I think you can do better than a 502 for the money. That is why I built my 489. More power and a nicer engine for around the same money.

LS engine I know we all think power , but with gas at 4.00 gal. Power and milage would be sweet!!
Wayne

LS7 if you want 500 hp out of the box. If you want to build a motor an LS2 or 3 would be a great choice also. LS motors are moocho goodo IMO.

Don't forget to forge the internals on that LS7.......

Jeff Schwartz? Where are you? LOL!

John

Ls-3
 

The currect (today's) price of the LS-3 "long block" is $4600 USD. (with core charge)

Then add my coil kit, ECU-882C-1 (including software), wiring harness, the items (special for those here) $1995.00.
The GM water pump, ALT, GMPP "spider", injectors, my air door, costs are about $1000.00.

There are "small items" missing about $400.00

The result is a running engine with 500 HP.

Then add a cam for a 50HP increase ? (246/252 .580" 116)

That's a bargin, all new !

Lance

LS-7 all the way!

It also depends on if you want the look of a modern motor, i do not so i did not go with a LS motor. I will say now that you can get a carb for one and you can do some other things that make them look less "new tech" so they are not as bad now in my book.

Here is your best choice(s).

http://www.sdparts.com/product/MMS11...rnKeyWECM.aspx

If this is too much, try these:

http://www.sdparts.com/catalogsdparts.aspx

Turn key and ready to go LS3 engines.

These are the best I have found and they are not even Supercharged yet.

What do you think?

Ty

I've driven a 502 RamJet, I'd opt for the LS engine hands down. Toss-up between the LS3 and LS7; for the money of the LS7 you could have a modded LS2/3 that makes more power.

Jody

I think the LS7 is at the very high end of the budget, engine is 13k out of the box and I dont think that includes the ecm. Add the oil system hardware and electronics and you have to be at 15k, forget about forged internals, these engines go near 20k when done. To get an ls7 to 500 rear wheel hp gonna need a cam change as well(should be close). Im with Jody on the LS2/3 modded will be cheaper. Keep in mind the accessory drive systems for these engines aren't cheap and pipes as well. My vote is for the ls3 with a stroker crank.:thumbsup:
Also has to be 100+ pound difference off the nose of the car comparing the LS to the ramjet.

Rich

I would look into the new Edelbrock/ Pat Musi EFI 555. Can be had for a little over 14k and looks to be a turn key setup. 675hp/650tq. Dart block, Scat forged steel crank, JE pistons, H-beam rods, Victor aluminum heads, pro flo xt fuel injection system, 2 year warranty, and they claim a little over 19 mpg.

i have two bigblocks and i have to say its twice as expensive and half as fun as an LSx engine.... the BBC looks and performs great,,, but you really have to shell out cash to get somthing good.. (and thats not a GM engine) my money would go towards a shafiroff untrastreet engine or a cammed LS3.. you can buy a 550 hp LS3 for about half the price of a 505 hp LS7.. and once you touch the ls7 the warranty is gone...

take a look at www.mastmotorsports.com and simmilar enginebuilders... schwartz is also a good bet.. but im not sure what he chrages....

I really love the LSX motors but to people outside this little community (lateral-g and pro-touring) the LSX is just a transplanted vette motor. Nothing draws a crowd and keeps a crowd like a well built big block.

My vote would be for a forged ls3 with a twin screw on top.

$4K for the short
$2K for complete dart heads with upgraded springs and good valve job.
That leaves alot of money on the table for the blower and the rest of the setup. Plus it looks PIMP!!

This is oh so true.

I am a ls nut and I will stare at a BBC for a long time.

The LS motors are very nice, but very common. If you want, you can always run injection on the BBC.

I would go with a big-block.
However, I am partial to the sound of big block with a lumpy cam, you can't beat it.

As gas is $4.50 a gallon, Id opt for the LS motors. Plus they add value to your car.

They will all add value. I just would not yank a motor out of a junked late model vette slap it in there and expect to have $100k car. Unless its a blown or turbo charged LSX motor it is just another small block to the masses.

i would do the musi edelbrock big block also much better looking engine than an ls unless you go with a sheetmetal intake. plus the thing get like 20mpg :unibrow:

Big blocks are cool. But when you can get 600hp, reliability and 20 mpg, it's hard to think non LS. I've had both. Also listen to Scott's car - sounds awesome (LS7).

co-signed


specially that im running an LS7.

I want to thank everyone for helping me spend my hard earned cash! It figures that 55% of the voters would select the most expensive engine!!!

Based on the comments, a customized LS3 might be the way to go.

I have a sometime, before I am ready for the engine and have to make the final decision. I am currently trying to get the car in paint before my next deployment (Fall 08). When I comeback in the 2009, I will purchase the engine and hopefully finish the build.

Having just had a CUSTOMIZED LS motor built a stock LS 7 will be about the same money, just for your info. Good luck.

This is an interesting thread as I'm considering these options as well. I was wondering does anyone think that an LS motor swap will look dated in 10 years? Kind of like an LT motor does now? Its something I'm trying to take into consideration to try to build a timeless car, so it won't look too dated down the road. No offense to anyone, just my opinion... and having said this I'm still leaning toward an LS2/3/$

I went from a carbed 383 to a modified wet sump LS7 in my 69. I couldn't be happier with the swap, but it is expensive and not for the faint of heart. When making the swap to any LS powerplant you have to consider changing the motor mounts, wire harness, some gauges: if not all of them, fuel lines, gas tank, probably the transmission-with controller if auto, exhaust, drive shaft length, an ECU needs to be added.
You can do a carbed LS for less- but that defeats the purpose unless you just want an LS aluminum block. The aftermarket performance stuff for an LS is outstanding and always improving. I went from 335whp with my built 383 to well over 485whp with a NA LS7, and with a little help from Tyler at ATS- well over 500whp. By comparison on the same dyno a new LS7 Z06 with CA intake, LT headers and manual put down 440whp. Some builders are getting more than 700hp from a NA LS7, so the performance is comparable to BB. With that kind of performance, I don't think the LS powerplant will be outdated in the near future.

Unless you have a smallblock that can outrun one. If it's going to be a bigblock, it better be a baddazz one and be able to outrun every smallblock around. I vote for LS7 (although the polls are closed, lol)

Well then I guess we should all be running the 3800 V6 T-Type motors with a huge turbo.

???

I don't quite follow that thought, I just mean that if someone has a bigblock car, it should make enough power to compensate for the extra weight and also to be able to outrun a smallblock with 100+ less cubic inches. If not, then it's just a waste IMHO. If you are going to have a bigblock that is physically larger and heavier than a smallblock, gets worse gas mileage, is more expensive, but looks awesome, then it better make up for those things when the light turns green. That's all. I'm not trying to start a bigblock-smallblock war, as I have both...bigblock Suburban (496) and a smallblock Camaro (406).

Anyway...back on topic, I vote for LS7, it's lighter, it's a screamer, and with a couple small changes (cam-mainly), you're at 600 reliable horsepower.

i dont agree... if you want an ls7 for the bragging rights, by all means buy it.. but when you can get a built 427 ls3, that makes more power, costs less money and comes with the cam of your choice its just a waste of money.. the second you open the ls7 to change cam, the warranty is gone....

a 615hp 427 ls3 that comes with absolutely everything including a full tune, VVT computer and a valid warranty costs 13k. a 505hp ls7 is much more money just for the engine.. and when you add cam, harness, computer, dynotime dry sump tanks and hoses and gaskets etc. you are well into the 17 grand range, if not more... thats 4000 dollars wasted on the ls-7 name (and a voided GM warranty)... stupid in my book...

I assume you are talking about the Mast Motorsports ls3 here. I haven't seen the graphs's supporting their 615 hp claims while retaining the VVT, I am not saying they are not true, but I haven't seen any evidence supporting the claims.

FWIW, the ultimate N/A power potential of a ls7 427 is much higher than a ls3 based 427.

=============================================
Scoggin Dickey Seem to think things are on the up and up.

http://www.sdparts.com/product/MMS11...rnKeyWECM.aspx

As far as I know they are a pretty reliable outfit.

The link above goes to the 550 hp Turn Key for $10,109.00. Put a Water cooled Magna Charger on it and at a 40% increase in power your at 770 hp!

Many of them can get higher than that.

If you can beat that with a new LS-7 for the Money, as the saying goes, "I'll take what She's Having!" (Gender meant only in reference to the quote!)

Ty

So you are going to boost a 10.7:1 motor that hard?? Better have a good supply of race gas on hand. And it will cost you about $16-$17k in the end.

FWIW, lets look at this.

high compression ls7 short block (multiple sources) ~$6200
Stock LS7 heads with GOOD springs ~$3K
Stock LS7 intake $300
Custom cam ~$400
Other parts (covers, lifters, misc bolts, etc) $1500

$11500 and you have an easy 620-640 NA hp.


Different strokes for different folks.

Good debate, and just shows how great the LS motors are. You can't go wrong with either choice, IMO.

I drove my friends Z06 this weekend and it's amazing the pull this stock motor has all the way to 6500 rpm. It's 500hp that feels like more. My vote still for the LS7, until the LS9 :lol: , but it's great we have more than one great choice.

Damn it, I missed the poll.

502 Ram Jet
:thumbsup:

That is right, the worst(or is it best??) is the choices. Given a decent budget I could build any number of different combos, all would have advantages over each other. Just depends on what you want and like.