Brendon's '67 Firebird thread
 

OK, I'm gonna start one thread here to cover the build up of my car where I can keep adding to as I make progress. I recently posted another thread which covered just one step, but, it doesn't have an accurately descriptive title for this kind of ongoing thread.

My '67 Firebird. I bought this a little over a year ago up in San Jose. It was an unrestored car, which I liked, but it was obviously rusty. I bought it because it was an original verdoro green '67 bird with manual trans and was well equipped. It appeared to be a 400 car, but as I later learned, I misread the body tag and it's a 326HO car. A '67 Verdoro green 400 4 speed car is my holy grail of first gen firebirds. It is what I ideally wanted to work with. This car is close enough.

I drove it locally for a year or so until I was able to sell my previous project and generate the necessary $$ and space to start this build. I've since been collecting parts and have disassembled the car. The car body is currently at the strippers (hence my other thread "went to the strippers")

Today after work I started chopping the subframe for the DSE Stage 3 front end kit mod.

I'll add some pics with description below:

The car as I bought it
 

This is what the car looked like when I bought it. Not too bad from 10 feet, but that 1969 camaro spoiler had to go.

disassembly
 

Some pics of the teardown. I took a lot, hoping to use them for reference when it's time for reassembly.

DSE Front End part 1
 

I posted pics of the chemical stripping in another thread ("went to the strippers") so I wont repost those pics here. However, today I started the DSE subframe mod by chopping off the old suspension mounts and widening the holes for the shocks. I don't have a real shop to do this work- just my neighborhood garage. As we're new to the neighborhood, I'm sure my neighbors will quickly grow to dislike me and my Firebird for all the noise I'm going to make as I build this car.

Looks good Brendon.
Keep us posted.:thumbsup:

progress on the DSE front end
 

I was able to cut the holes in the subframe for the new suspension components. It's now ready for welding- which my neighbor will be helping me with later this week.

Its looking good. Are you going to have him weld up the eams on the sub frame?

Hi Wayne:

Yes, those will eventually be addressed. My neighbor tack welded the brackets on tonight. (in turn I'll be designing a logo for him) The plan is to get the subframe on the body, measure and locate where the wheels will be, then we can measure and confirm everything is where it should be, and modify/ adjust as needed. Once we know it's all square, then final tig welding.

He built his own '67 camaro, and this is how he said he did it, so I'll trust him.

Looks great man

Thank you, Frank.

This Friday I brought the car body back home from the strippers. I was a bit disappointed that I could still see rust on the car despite 2 dippings. I was expecting the body to be void of all rust- like all the sheet metal seemed to be. Apparently, my car was really, really rusty. They did offer me to bring the car back for one more dipping after removing some of the rusted panels.

Attached are some pics from the weekend. We tested out my neighbor's new plasma cutter by chopping out the rear wheel wells. I spent Saturday cleaning up those cuts/ drilling out the factory spot welds. I also had time to remove the top dash panel. I still have to cut out the inner cowl panel.

I also installed the subframe. I need to align it so we can start measuring and create the subframe connectors, as well as the inner tubs.

a few more pics...

I personally would not bother with dipping my car.
If i were you I would just have is blasted (media, or sand) just don't hit the sheet metal that you plan on using.
Also sandblast as you take your car apart (when you take a quarter panel off)
just my .02

Looking good; in the pictures, it looks like you're just dealing with surface rust. Have you tried a wire wheel? (At least on the underside).

Thank you. The dipping process removed most of the rust, but it's still in the cracks and heard to reach areas. This is why I was disappointed with the dipping process. Being submersed in liquid, I'd think that it should reach to just about every area (except for metal that is pinched/ welded together)

However, I'll be replacing and modifying a lot of panels, so I should be able to get to any remaining areas not cleaned already.

I'll use a combination of methods to remove any remaining rust.

Tonight we measured my car, and tightened down the subframe based on the best frame/ body alignment we could calculate. This is so we can work on calculating the suspension and axle size. Of course, it'll come off again, and have to be re measured again....

I'll have to take a few days off as I need to prepare (clean) the house for guests coming later this week. I should get back on this Sat. I'll work on preliminary assembly of the front suspension, as well as building a mock up tire in cardboard (cheaper than buying the real tires at this time as I have extra cardboard and hot melt glue). Then I can work on calculating the max width for the axle that will fit in my car.

I'll be re-attaching my sub-frame this week. Any pointers on where to measure so that I know everything is square?

Thanks

We used a long bar in place of the rear axle (since my axle is out) and set that perpendicular to the car as a place holder. we also used string and ran it parallel along side the car, and used another bar across the front. from this we measured diagonally from corner to corner to get the axle lines square to one another.

I didn't want to assume the car , or the subframe was perfectly square from the factory. After all, they were hand assembled parts that are 40+ years old.

We also ran one of those pointer lasers (the kind with a wide fan beam) down the middle to establish the true center line of the car.
There are alignment holes for the subframe/ body, but again, I'm not entirely trusting it.

I'll try to post a pic tonight.

Cool, thanks; pictures always help :cheers:

strung up
 

Not sure how well you can see this- but there are 2 bars going across the car. one in place of the rear axle. the other is pressed up against the DSE upper control arm mounts.

There are strings and plumb bobs and sharpie marks all over the car and bars.

Thanks, I can work with that :thumbsup:

Tired
 

This weekend I had limited time to work on this, but I think I made some progress. I don't have the tires I want yet, but I do know the size and overall dimensions, so I mocked up a set in cardboard as place holders. I had plenty of cardboard leftover from my goodmark panel shipment, and this is light to move around.

I also started to install the front suspension for mocking up purposes. I understand that with the DSE suspension/ stock frame there is a wheel width limitation of 7". Although I mocked it up. I'm not exactly sure yet what the limiter is as I don't have my hubs or brakes yet (I can only guesstimate where the wheels will truly sit. ) If anyone has had any experience with this please chime in where the issues are so I can address them.

I also placed the back wheels in, and was happy to see it start to look like a paddle boat- I mean car again. Since I need to replace my quarters and mini tub the car- my neighbor had a good suggestion of widening the back body a bit. This will help maximize track width while keeping the tires inside the body. We mocked up a qtr panel and it looked good, but I apparently didn't get a pic of it, nor the car with the front body panels on.

This weekend I bought more sheet metal at Classic Industries and chopped up more of the rear inner wheel wells to make the replacement metal fit (roughly). I was then able to locate and measure the rear wheels for axle ordering- which I did today from Frank @ Prodigy Customs. Since I'm going to widen the body a little it allowed me to order a wider axle. Hopefully this will help keep the "wide track" look that Pontiacs are known for.

The car will not sit this low at ride height. This is where we're estimating the full compression of the suspension so we know there will not be any bottoming out issues contacting the body.

patching the window frames
 

This past weekend and the weekend before I spent what available time I had patching the rust holes around my window frames. I had 17 different holes (I squared them off) to patch, created the patch panels from my old quarter panel pieces and welded them in place. It was a great welding practice lesson for me, as welding is one thing I haven't had much experience with yet.

passenger door skin
 

I didn't get much done this weekend, I had company in from out of town. I did have a few hours today after work so I removed the passenger door skin and started to make patch panels for the door structure itself. Then I will re skin the door.

I have 2 of the 3 panels pretty much made, the third is only rough cut out. I used the leftover original door skin for the patch material. A new door skin awaits assembly. I also have a pic of some of the pass side rocker panel area that I had to cut out and will need to create a patch.

While the door is apart I'll also spray some Eastwood rust encapsulator to stop any remaining rust I haven't been able to sand out. Unfortunately, the chemical stripping I paid so much for didn't get all this. Such a waste of $$.

more on the door
 

Still alive, still making rust repairs when possible. Just chipping away at it. I got the pass door fixed, painted with Eastwood rust encapsulator paint and skinned.

I've also repaired the trunk weatherstripping channel and am now onto the pass rocker panel. The panel is requiring half a dozen or so patches. Even as I patch a section, I later learn I should have replaced more metal as I keep blowing through the original thinned metal.

Looking good, man. I know rust is a battle, but keep at it. You'll be happy when it's all gone. I've got two or three small spots to address on mine before I declare a victory........it'll get there:thumbsup:

Thank you. Yeah, I'm keeping a positive outlook on it as it's welding experience for me. I'm getting A LOT of experience with this one :)

I'm taking the next few days off. I should get more rust repair done this long weekend. Will update with pics next week.

Looking good!! Pics look great!!

Nice job on the repairs they look nice. Keep banging them out.

more patching and finally, some frame ties
 

Thank you both.

This week's installment is a little more patching and finally a "fun" project (actually, it's all been fun so far)- building some frame ties.

I had a few extra days off this past week so I was able to get a little more done. I patched the rust spot on my pass fender and I smoothed out the cowl panel to rid the wiper arm protrusions in the metal. Instead of just chopping and patching, I did my best to shrink what metal was there and make smaller patches. It was good metal forming practice, imo. I also built some frame ties out of some 2x3 stock. This evening I rolled the car over to my neighbor's house who will do the heavy welding.

more pics of the frame ties.

friendly neighborhood weldor man
 

Everyone deserves an awesome neighbor. I'm lucky to have one myself- Brett. The pics below are the results of him welding up my subframe. Unfortunately for me and my car, while welding the subframe connectors we discovered the rear frame rails are rusted enough that a good weld was not able to be achieved, so I'll be needing either new frame rails, or, at the least reinforcing them with more material. I'll probably go for the latter, as this way I can build exactly what I need and use any thickness gauge of material I choose.

The pics attached are mostly of the underside of the subframe, including a reinforcement gusset added to the DSE frame bracket. This should help provide more stability for this part (instead of just relying on welding it to the sheet metal) One pic you can see the side profile of it, but it is only tack welded in that view. DSE provides a triangular bracket to act as a gusset for the top side, but that has not been added yet.

My next post will show pics of the subframe connectors in place.

The project keeps going....

Floored
 

Today I worked on chopping my old floor pans out getting the car ready to accept the replacement floor pans. MY subframe connectors are tacked in on the rear rails, but there isn't enough metal left in them to accept a continuos weld. They will need reinforcing, but I'll deal with that when my rear axle/ suspension shows up.

I removed the seat braces and was able to clean up the sides of the rocker panels. looks like my passenger panel may need more patches. I have also rough trimmed the floor pans to fit. They are close enough that I can start welding them in and final trim as needed.

I'll have the tops of the subframe connectors welded before install, as well as painting the bare metal with rust encapsulator.

Very ccool project

I love the creativity of the wheel mock ups

I am still on the fence weather i should buy a compleated car or do a full on project like this

Some times the fun is in the creation

thanks for sharing

Thank you. There are, of course, advantages and disadvantages to both routes, I guess it depends on what's more important to you. Time, money, being able to say you built it, space and tools handy, etc..

In my case, I don't have a lot of money, so it's easier for me to cough up the time. Plus, I like being able to say I built it.

floored
 

OK, it's been a few weeks since I posted. Usual summer stuff. Weddings to go to, friends to get together with, next thing you know, it's August, and there are more weddings to go to. I have slowly but surely been working on the floor pans. Below are pics of some gussets made for the subframe connectors to have them attach to the car body better, as well as some plates for the underside of the subframe itself (something cleaner than the hacked up mess it had become). I've installed the replacement pans and worked on the seat braces, too. Almost done with that, but I need to do a little more hammering and welding for the passenger side. I located them slightly rearward to provide more foot room for me. This helps to offset the anticipated firewall relocation I plan on having to make, plus I will not be installing a back seat. All is good. It's nice to see the car heading toward a direction of assembly for once.

more pics
 

more pics from this weekend

Nice Work it looks great.

Thanks for the pics. Keep up the good work. :thumbsup:

Got a few small things done this weekend. Not much extra time lately, so I'm doing what I can when I can. I got my new welder up and running- I went with the Eastwood 135 mig. The price was right and so far so good. I finished up the passenger side seat brace and have it ground down, just needs to be painted. I also built the plugs for the floor pans and have those welded in. Now that I'm a little more comfortable and confident with welding, I went back and added more metal to the rear window frame, and replaced a strip of metal on the driver's side. I only have pics of it in process. I must have forgot to shoot one after I trimmed the metal. I intentionally left the large piece of metal on there to start for 3 reasons. 1- more metal to soak up the heat (less warpage). 2- I can trim after it's welded and worry less about cutting too much metal off beforehand. 3- larger handle to hold while tacking. I also started to prepare my cowl panel. I welded in the brackets for the fenders, as well as filled in some extra holes. I used some washers to help fill in the larger holes. It worked quite well. Enjoy.

inner cowl installation
 

Quick progress update- Today I was able to start welding on my inner cowl panel. I only had a few hours so it's not finished yet. Below are pics of the progress I made.