what rear setup to run?
 

So I have started my 69 Camaro project finding out it needed pretty much a back half installed. My DSE mini tubs are on the way. I have looked at several rear end set ups from DSE, TCI ,rear truck arms ,Heidts. I may be even more confused now than when I started. The plan for the car is a daily commute slash canyon runner that will never be raced but the leaf springs have to go! I like the the DSE setup but with dollars going out faster than coming in what are my options? Engine specs are 550 hp with a 4 speed and 10 bolt posi. I am using the stock sub frame with tubular control arms and C-5 brakes any input would be greatly appreciated thanks.
Johnhttps://lateral-g.net/forums/images/smilies/willy_nilly.gif

What's wrong with leaf springs?

Ride quality.

I am looking for ride hieght adjustabilty and also don`t want to modify my fuel tank. Other than that nothing!

The official i'm blowing my own horn reply
what about this option? speedtech torque arm. Ride is excellent, install is a breeze.
all the adjustability you could want

5th over all in the Optima Challenge with a 510hp ls2

X2 on the torque arm. Very simple install, and no real faults.

What's the difference between the bmr torque ARM and speedtech? Maybe some one can do a comparo.

The Speedtech is proven with a couple of suspension challenges to back it up!

No one has more suspension options or experience then we do. We have 5 rear suspension solutions NOT including leaf springs. 5 brands, 5 approaches, feel free to call and discuss

Can't comment on the BMR set up but ours. Ease of install, Room for exhaust 3" is not an issue. ride height (on our torque arm the first thing to even come close to contacting would be the drive shaft on the tunnel, but you wouldn't run that low anyway) Articulink trailing arms for NO bind.

and 5th place in the Optima challenge.

I vote for Speedtech torque arm suspension. installation is so easy everything fits like a champ with a wide variety of adjustments. the good thing about was i did it myself in my garage did not have any help from nobody except technical support from speedtech, Roger and Blake. Thanks guys.

also i manage to fit 345"x18" wheels on a 70 nova with a dse tubs (street use only auto cross i used 325" tires). I cut the frame a little more than i supposed to and then i stretch out the tubs since the shock/spring upper crossmember will stenghten the frame.

I am currently trying to decide between these two kits, and currently i am leaning more towards Bmr they have a watts link instead of a panhard bar. They are the same price but i haven't seen any proven track attempts from them? maybe they don't have the budget? Any one running the Bmr Kit out there that would be willing to chime in? My car will probably only see the track but i may take it out on the street every once and a while. dsster have you driven your car yet with the speedtech torque arm yet if so can you review it?
sorry for the thread hijack.

I'm also looking at the same suspension setups for my car, and both of these are at the top of my list. The BMR torque arm kit does not include coilover shocks or springs in their price so it is a bit more expensive, but the system does have a watts link and ??perhaps?? an easier installation (I would like to see what the Speedtech 12 bolt installation involves). I've also only seen 2.5" exhaust on the BMR setup; wish someone would try to snake 3" through there to see if it is possible.

I am pretty sure the bmr kit includes the springs and shocks as it states the shocks are adjustable in the description on their website. I Will give them a call tomorrow and if they do I'm going to order the kit.

I have street driven two of the Speed Tech cars and I give the stance, ride, and handling two thumbs up! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Combine that with excelant quality, design, ease of install including 3" pipes, price, availability and track tested...I don't see how you can go wrong!

Also, they have great customer service! :thumbsup:

The BMR kit does NOT include coilovers for $1999. you will need to purchase those seperately. I would recommend either AFCO or the new RideTech coilovers. The SpeedTech torque arm is a great setup and better value for your money

Here's another proven performance for Speed Tech's torque arm. 1st place this time https://lateral-g.net/forums/showthre...027#post318027 Their kit has adjustable shocks. I'd be ordering the Speed Tech kit if I was in your shoes.

I also have the torque arm suspension and been driving the car for about 3 months and I love it! It was easy to install, I did it in my garage.:thumbsup:

FYI a Watts link has NO advantage over a Panhard bar, untill you get to the point of needing to have the finite adjustment for roll center in both directions, and the elimination of any side movement during travel, in 2" of travel it would be negligible and you will never get there.

Something else to keep in mind is that for a watts link to be MOST effective the pivot needs to be on the Chassis not on the rear end. More like the old lateral dynamics unit as well the connecting links should be level and parallel.


just so you know

Can anyone post pictures of the speedtech torque ARM installed on there car. Killer69 what rear setup are you running. Where does the front of the torque ARM attach to the trans crossmember or the sub frame. Do you know the weight of the kit? How's the clearance to the ground. Thanks

Honestly if more dollars are going out than coming in I would do nothing. Wait till that changes. These cars cost alot of money and it adds up fast.

Don't skimp on quality to save a few bucks, IMO.

Well since the Nova is our new test car i have the complete "Track Time package including the ATS Spindles. the "Shipping weight is 120lb the actual weight of the product is 83lb that includes the shocks and springs.
there is no issue with ground clearance nothing is lower than the subframe rails. and the torque arm fits up in the drave shaft tunnel (depending on ride height of course)

The torque arm attaches to its own front X member that fits between the floor and the subframe. you can see the bare torque arm as well as it installed with 3" exhaust
also you can see the final ride height, this is not on airride this it the ride height and there are no issues.

Nice car.

this is the rear suspension in action on a road course. thougth you might like to see it.

After reading this tread I seem to have more questions on rear suspension set up's then before. I am at the stage in my current project (68 Camaro) were I need to figure my suspension options as well. The rear is my main focus, but maybe some of you might be able to help me as well. I'm looking into a mini tub opp, but cutting into a already weak rear sub frame seems to me a poor option. I leaning to the Art Morrison rear frame kit and tri 4 set up, but not 100%. I'm using the stk frt sub frame that has been fully welded and some support added and looking at GW or speed tech for the frt.

My main goal is to take as much flex out of the body so the suspension does more of the wrk with out spending my life savings. The fab end of this is not an issue for me, more trying to keep the price reasonable. Any suggestions of feed back would be helpful..

I LOVED IT!!! And kinda odd how a guy could enjoy that much vid of just a car's rearend travel going through the motions. But I did.

Was it a counter clockwise track? Looked like the right side was taking alot of loads or is a lil soft on that side. Looked like it was in compression more on the right side for most of the parts that I watched (only got through half of the vid)..

Loved the sound of the engine!! JR

Sweet video Blake. Thanks for posting that.

Blake have you done any drag race type R&D? I was considering a four link Bar type suspension. I like what the torque arm offers but was planning on doing some weekend drag racing once and awhile.

Does this suspension work with subframe connectors? Specifically the hotchkis ones?

Any issues with NVH at all? I have heard that some of the TA suspensions tend to transfer alot to the cabin...

Thanks,..!

Blake,

Perhaps I missed it somewhere, I went to your web site, and still can't figure out how the torque arm brackets attaches to a 12 bolt housing. I have a 54 inch flange to flange moser 12 bolt with dse leaf perches. Will housings(custom lengths)with all brackets welded on be available through speed tech? How are you setting this up? Any issues with the upper bracket fitting in the area of the mini tub frame cut? can my housing be converted?

Thanks Rich

Cutting into the rear fram has now been done thousands and thousands of times and i have never seen any ill effects , remember that if you are then also moving the load point from the extreme rear of the frame (even tho it is actually only 1/2 the load) to the center of the car there is less stress on the rear. in the past we have done a "Mini" roll bar that triangulates the upper shock mount to the upper corner of the 1/4 and rear seat,package tray??
The best option is obviously a roll cage if your worried about flex.

yes CC track

we have not Drag tested it yet this comming spring i will take it out and try it, but from the brake stop challenges we have done it works well at both ends of the test

Funny i have asked John Hotchkis to send us a set of frame connectors but have not seen them yet :lol: there is no reason the Torque arm would not work with any subframe connector.

The 12 bolt has a rear mount that sandwhiches between the rear cover and the housing, on the front there is a billet aluminum clamp that mounts arroiund the pinion casting. Currently we are only able to offer 9" housing that are built by Strange Engineering that include the brackets welded on prior to finishing the housing width. the problem is that strange only had a 12 bolt with the 3rd gen camaro center section so it won't work with our mount. But a 9" is actually a better choice in that the pinion is shorter and lower to allow more clearance between the driveshaft and tunnel as well as the safer housing retained bearings. we ALWAYS use 9" ends on all the rears we build for the safety factor.

I know this isn't my post, but great info killer69. Not the Hijack, but for an all around setup (street, road course, and drag) would I be better off with a torque arm setup or a 3 link setup for my 2nd gen? We will be building whatever setup we do in house, so fab and ease of install is of no worry to us. Just looking for the best possible all around setup.

I talked with Larry at Prodigy the other day, VERY helpful. He felt that I can't go wrong with a torque arm, but I welcome other insight.

Currently we are working on a Second Gen torque arm set up, the biggest issue is that the second gen is so tight in everydirection compared to the first that it is just a mater of us deciding how "BoltIn" the kit will be, we are looking at different options and way of packaging the system the big issue is ride height, and you have seen the ride height we like and we will be keeping that so stay tuned.

Thanks for the info that help explain a ton. Cage on this car is not an option so I have to try to stiffen it up as much w/ out the help of a full cage. I saw the the speed tech set up helps transfer more of the stress through out and the shock support bar should help to add back sum of the support lost. One other question how does the a narrow rear end effect the set up. I have the option of stk width or 2" narrowed rear from stk.

I would suggest a 3-link. its more adjustable than a torque arm and can have more antisquat if designed correctly. But it will be going through the stock sheetmetal.

I have a few questions. First how easy is it to access the drive shaft? Can you just unbolt the TQ arm or do you have to remove the TQ arm and the front X member?. I remember on my 99 SS Camaro every time you would remove the TQ arm the pinion would shift up. Will this kit do the same? Also is there room to run an X or H pipe in the exhaust?

Thanks
Troy

3 link is awesome if you dont want a back seat.
how much anti squat do you want?

just did some quick calculations the anti squat on the Torque arm is 71% 87% 102% in the 3 available mounting locations. if that helps anyone.

all i do is remove the rear shocks and let the suspension droop (on the hoist i use a screw jack stand) and you can undo the ubolts and slide the driveshaft out without removing the exhaust even. (depending on your configuration)
i run a X pipe on my Nova you could also configure a H pipe if you wanted

Blake,

In a camaro a back seat is not possible with a 3-link or maybe two bucket seats on either side. In my falcon I am building a 3-link to stay in the trunk and not enter the passenger compartment. my A/S range in 50-100% while keeping the LCA horizontal at ride and a minimum IC of 50". For drag racing I can have up to a 150% A/S.

Torque arms are great if you want to keep all the suspension under the car and make it a bolt in.