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69 Z/28 with Max-G Chassis
Hello All,
My car is a true 1969 Camaro Z/28. Since i didnt have the original engine, tranny, or rear end and since I bought it i decided to go the pro-touring route instead of original. This is round two of my project. Round one involves a sappy story about some "professional" I took my car to for some sheetmetal removal/replacement. This is how it looked before I picked it up from the "professional shop." http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...o/P6180028.jpg I decided to attempt to put the car back together myself and at that time the plan was to put an Art Morrison back half and seperate AME front subframe in place then weld in the connectors. After a brief hiatus of doing nothing to the car and primarily visiting this site to read the Investing 102 thread, I have since sold the backhalf and got a full Art Morrison Max-G chassis from a shop down the road from me called Pyramid Street Rods. These guys are dealers for Art Morrison and some of the most honest people you will ever meet. So i put the frame on a jig, got it all leveled and centered, BRACED the car and cut the floor out. I also realized i screwed up the wheel wells so those will be going bye bye pretty soon here. Here are some pics of the progress so far: http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011099.jpg |
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http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011103.jpg
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011102.jpg I think using this jig and having everything level is going to work out a LOT better than my first attempt where i had everything on jackstands with a shim here, a shim there, a shim everywhere... And some pics of the bracing and floor removal... http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011093.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011094.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011092.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011095.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011091.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011090.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011096.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...8/P1011097.jpg |
Since my plan is to work on the car myself and my time doesnt cost any money, i would like to try and make the frame removable from the body instead of welding the two together when i make my floor panels. I am not quite sure the best way of doing this yet, but i have studied some photo's of the the shop RK Collections that did accomplish this. Here's there site if youre interested... http://www.rkmotorscharlotte.com/pc/...-Camaro/132163
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...o/P8130198.jpg P.S. I realize I have bit off more than i can chew and took on a project that requires way more experience than i have, but nothing like learning by diving in head first right!! That and having a whole lot of this :cheers: Thanks in advance to all who help contribute to this build. Hopefully Round 2 turns out better than Round 1:lateral: |
Theres a couple of Max-g threads on here. Our shop completed this one this year, you may want to look through it....
https://lateral-g.net/forums/show...light=tenacity |
Steve, thanks for the link. That Camaro is Amazing!! I checked out your website as well and there are a lot more pics on there. I may be contacting you from time to time to get some pointers if thats okay with you:thumbsup:
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Here's another one completed: https://lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=24328
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Good for you Aman for being willing to tackle this! It's a lot of work - but if you take your time and do every step CORRECTLY and with loving care... it'll turn out great!
:cheers: |
just keep measuring all the time, and make sure your reference points are square and unchanging. Every shim, twist, and move you make will affect something else so always be thinking 3 dimensionally, and every 30 minutes stand back as far as you can and take a look at the "squareness", and don't forget to choose new "angles" to look at the car from not just the same place every time. Have several long straight edges and definitely buy a digital level, I use that thing all the time.
I've dropped my body in various states on top of 2 or 3 chassis now and I'm just a dude with a carport. My first time I had the body with no floor and no real bracing stood up on 6-8 cinder blocks while I rolled the completed chassis, roll cage and all, underneath it on furniture dollies. The last one I started with just a roof and a-pillars, so less structure and form than you have. Again I'm just a one man amateur show out in a carport. Give that garage space you have you are a luxurious shop. You can do it ! http://www.carter-engineering.com/pr...ming%20Off.jpg |
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Thanks for the comments everyone. I hope to get some more work done between now and the new year. I will post pics as i make progress!
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Nice project good for you on doing it yourself.
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Nice project Aman, I only live about 45 mins from you (depending on boarder wait times) your more than welcome to swing by anytime.
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canrc, thanks for the offer i may take you up on that in the new year when all the holiday rush across the border dies down. I checked out your build, Rybar posted it and that is a sweet camaro! Rybar's is pretty nice too! My original colors were garnet red with black stripes which is what i was thinking of going back with on my car. But i dont know if the car gods will allow two pro-touring cars within 100 miles of each other to have the same paint scheme!! |
Been about a year and haven't had a chance to touch the car much until recently. One of my goals was to keep the body removable from the frame. I had a hard time trying to figure out how i was going to do that so basically I was too scared to touch the car until I did. I have to give a lot of credit to Gary Betsy on my final solution. He build the Voracious Cuda on this site. Anways, once i had my game plan, it was pretty easy to execute the plan...like two weekends!
Basically i took the art morrison frame and started created a sub structure on top of the frame using 3/16" flat bar. I will then take that sub structure and weld it to the body of the car. That substructure will then bolt up to the AME frame and have polyurethane pads in between. You can see the pilot holes drilled into the frame. Eventually the threaded bungs will be welded in these spots. It was next to impossible to bring myself to drilling/welding to this frame...once i did though i was happy with the results. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psbde9dae7.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psb8bf0777.jpg Here are the final holes for the threaded bungs. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps1300701a.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps9be2f564.jpg Welding the bung into place. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps160cdc8e.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps9880f70c.jpg Bungs all welded into place!! http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pse8747544.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psdd6705f3.jpg |
Here is the substructure i built. It will eventually be welded to the body of the car.
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psijxlwskg.jpg And here it is after all bungs welded, grinded smooth, and then bolted into place with the polyurethane pads. I used 1/4" pads, think that is enough space between the AME frame and the substructure? I am thinking i will be okay since i used 3/16" flatbar for the substructure and then the floor pans will be welded to that. shouldnt flex too much, but im open to suggestions if others think i should go with 1/2" polyurethane pad. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psacefd1d1.jpg Oh, the flatbar spanning the width was just there for mockup so i dont tweak the substructure. It will eventually go away. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps1f6dfae2.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps2ab20fa1.jpg |
Next step was to cut away the inner rockers to allow for the body to slip over the substructure. Following are some pictures, and thats about where the car currently stands. May not look like a lot of work, but its the most I've done in a few years so i am pretty happy! It takes a lot longer to fabricate this stuff when all you are using is an angle grinder and multiple cutting/grinding discs, but its the end results that make this an enjoyable hobby.
Cutline along bottom of outer rocker panel http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps06503181.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps46a0de81.jpg You can see the inner rocker cut away. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps0e26dd6a.jpg body set on frame. I made it so the substructure and the top of the inner rocker panel will sit flush. Ill bridge the gap with some steel and then start on the rest of the inside/outside sheetmetal. Might be a while till i make some more progress, but moving forward slowly is better than not moving forward at all!! (PS, ill buy a new camera as well, I do realize how much the picture quality sucks!) http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psc3348e8d.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps3561436b.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pseed51d83.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps1922846f.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psc454c56f.jpg Here is what the substructure looks like on the bottom of the rocker. The outer rocker is in pretty rough shape so i plan to modify it and extend down to the bottom of the substructure, thus covering up the AME frame. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps28ee7c79.jpg |
thats some good fab work,glad to see you are back to work on it,good luck with it:thumbsup:
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Happy to see you making progress.
I'm confused though, I thought these bodies were already bolted on to the chassis and that the AM chassis included OEM style body mounts, although of course I don't see them on your chassis. |
Hey thanks guys, its not a lot of progress but at least its moving forward. Preston, the camaros were unibody construction. AME makes a front clip that bolts on and then you can buy a rear clip that welds to the stock floor. If you go with the Max-G chassis though, the entire floor pan needs to be removed and then replaced with custom floor boards. Hopefully ill have some time this weekend to make some more progress. Ill post updates if i do!
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Nice!
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A year later, and I'm still chipping away at the project. I ripped off the old sheet metal that I initially installed because I didnt know what I was doing and well...I did it wrong. Went with AMD sheet metal the second time around and I was extremely impressed with the quality of the panels. I highly recommend them to anyone looking to purchase new sheet metal.
Here are some photos of me widening the tubs: http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps4c7181b6.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psaf19d9be.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psacd00728.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psa31329a9.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psf4b8dc0f.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pscbf9ea07.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps9b7d67dd.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psed6034f8.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psae8e0b5a.jpg |
As stated earlier, I am building the car so that the body is removable from the frame, because of that, i kept about 1/4" to 5/16" gap between the wheel tubs and the frame so that i can remove the body without damaging the paint. Here is how it turned out...
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps38c9c639.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psc7364060.jpg I then replaced the package tray as mine was all bent up from the previous shop that had done work on the car. I probably could have straightened it out, but I honestly think it was easier, quicker and cheaper to buy a new panel and replace it. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps341262bb.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps98d53587.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps8fb8fe10.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps67953d87.jpg |
Last piece of the puzzle was fitting the tail panel. This was tough because there are no trim pieces or anything to cover up the seams where the tailpanel and quarters line up. I had to do a lot of cutting and bending and welding and so on. I was too engrossed to take photos during the process, but finally after years and years of anticipation, I completed that part and got the car of the jig. It is finally sitting on all 4 wheels. I have a few weeks off in December and I hope to finish the floors and the firewall so that i will have a complete roller.
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psb4b5d1b4.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psd90fcccb.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psee3d0d0f.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pse0f6769a.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps6f47a744.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps76a40bdb.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps4ad1f273.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps5850eb78.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psefaaf357.jpg |
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psf5f44fb0.jpg
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psb1769a1a.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pseb101302.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psefc72fea.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psc01729e7.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pscaf6e5a2.jpg I just threw the front sheet metal on there to make it look like a car. Nothing has been fit or "cured to fit" on any of that stuff yet... http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psb9f8450d.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps4a40abcd.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psf1eb7d76.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...ps19690999.jpg |
Very nice metal work,really like that frame.I bet you are relieved to have all the metal work finished and have it rolling again:thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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I am glad to see your still working on the car and it's looking great.
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So you used just a small part of the body sub structure to build this car. Wouldn't you have been better off to buy a dynacorn body instead of ruin a z/28? Sad
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Alot of work, great progress. I'd recommend wider tires in the rear though LOL |
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Congrats Aman. You've got a fantastic view outside your shop too. Beautiful country. Good luck moving forward!
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Great job on this car! |
congrats on a huge hurdle. Down hill from here right? I was noticing all the trees in the background and clouds and thought you must be living in Washington.
Good luck with the project. - Chris |
Thanks for all the positive comments guys, it really feels good to have the car on the ground. The light at the end of the tunnel is still very far away and very dim, but it's there! This sheet metal stuff is something you can only get good at by doing...The second time around fitting the quarters and wheel tubs and all that went way smoother than the first time. The way the car was left off by the previous shop i took it to left me with little to no reference points of the original body so I was "guessing" a lot about how to put it all back together.
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You are doing an excellent job and making great progress. Keep plugging away.
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Nice job! That's a lot of work.. And you did yourself real proud.
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Ya it probably is better then the body I'm starting with. My car took a pole in the drivers door, roof and rocker.
Not worried because that is what I do for a living. My current project at work is a 1931 Invicta coupe I'm restoring for Pebble Beach Concourse De Elegance next year. I'm use to re working original junk. This Invicta was the only coupe ever built and the front fenders are unique to this car hand built out of aluminum in sections and welded together. Being over 80 years old they were absolute garbage from previous owners not having cracks properly repaired and just riveting patches of aluminum over it and covering it up with bondo. Took me a couple months to repair and now they are concours quality inside and out. Sorry that it bothers me to see these cars get cut up. |
Almost a year later and finally some progress photos. I consistently work on the car as time allows, but I'm just bad about taking photos and even worse about taking the time to post them. Nevertheless, the floor has now been completely fabricated and finish welded from the trunk to the firewall. These photos don't show the completed firewall, but I will take some more pictures of that this weekend and post them. Although the black firewall in the previous photos looks good, a closer inspection would reveal a 1/4" thick layer of bondo applied by the previous shop.
http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pseciokycn.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pszbuxvhcp.jpg You can see in this photo how the inner wheel well tapers out as you go down. Something I just didn't know to account for when originally widening them so i had to cut them apart and make them parallel with the frame. Took some extra time, but totally worth it in the end. http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pss0w9c3oa.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...pslfwrtshj.jpg http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/...psswokdjnc.jpg |
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