Thank you Greg Weld ! Venting time.
 

I'm just putting this out there to vent because I can't understand what goes on in peoples business minds. Let me explain. After reading and talking to Greg about what has happen to him . I now sit in front of my attorney wondering how in the heck has it come to this . I now have a similar situation that Greg has . So the short version goes like this . My car has been a complete disappointment since being ''DONE'' . I plan to list the whole order of events and problems on my thread soon. What I can't understand is how do you take a friggen awesome customer, a guy who personally pays every invoice on time in person within days of receiving it . Never questioning a bill . Never questioning what your doing and why . Giving you complete artistic reign for what ever you want to do to your automobile. Never making you change something because you don't like it .No budget just make sure everything is the best .. I have a very small collision shop that I own . I've been in business 28 years . I do the very best to make sure our repairs get done right but there's times this doesn't always happen . But when the sh!t hits the fan and a customer comes back with a problem I personally make sure the problem is corrected, fixing the issue and standing behind it . I never question a customer about something that we repaired if it failed. We repaired it in the first place and its not fixed so why would I even question it!!!!!! IT'S CALLED CUSTOMER SERVICE !!!!!!!!!!!!!! And it works great!!!! So back to my issue I sent my car back my builder last December with a list of things to be ''FIXED'' . Picked up my car May this year . We went for a ride to check out one of my issues a brake problem and put the car right in the trailer. As the next couple months went by I'm realizing a lot of the issues were not fixed properly so me being who I am I just let it go . That's until last week my 1000 mile engine that he had built by is engine builder started to use 3 quarts of oil in 400 miles . So more money to fix something that has been fixed. Sent a text to my builder telling him what happen and while I was at it letting him know that all but two things that I sent the car for to get repaired are still not right. So my answer from my builder is ''Everything was
fixed you signed a paper saying so !!!! '' So that's how you treat your customer that has been nothing but good to you. I'm floored at that response . After everything that has happen with this car since I've had it. Knowing all the BS I've been through with this car . That's what I get for a answer. So I'm taking a page out of Greg's book and speaking up . Being the nice cool guy doesn't work you just get sh!t on over and over again. Never in a million years did I think it would ever come to this .

Sorry to hear. I hope you can get some progress. It is going to be very tough. :(

Goodfellas
 

Why does this crap keep happening to the "Goodfellas?" :EmoteClueless:

You and Greg are both amazing people and great car guys who have given far more than your share to this community!

I hate to see this kindof crap happening to you too Mario!

Seems like there are more shops doing bad work than good...?

I'm guessing you've decided not to "out" the shop the way GW did?


Jeff-

People suck....


People that create problems and don’t know how to fix em suck worse.


People that choose their bottom line over quality customer service. They don’t have to worry about their bottom line for very long. Because the list of customers is going to dry up pronto.







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Venting
 

Not sure where quality and service have gone over the years
We are a small contractor celebrating 50 years in business
There are many times someone wants something done below
standards and I tell them we are going to do it right or not at all
I often tell my guys to take care of it so it is done right so the
issue goes away

Recently I and others have had some car things done or parts
bought that are just junk or done wrong... we recently outed
a so called Cleveland engine builder for his bad work practices
He used to be good but now it does not seem to matter

Been learning how to do more things myself because I am afraid
to have the so called experts do it

Don't get me wrong there are plenty of vendors here that I can
see do it right but why can they all be that way

Bob

Fire the attorney and find someone that has the skills to fix it. These cars are a real trick to get right and your builder must be over his head. You have to be good at everything to build these right and work out the wrinkles and most aren't capable. That's my perspective after seeing all the cluster **** stories around here.

Good luck!

I can't fire him Todd he's my friend and neighbor ! Plus I take care of his firm it cost me nothing. He won't be touching the car anymore that's for sure . It will go to the proper people to get these problems taken care of and they won't be at my expense !.

I hope it all works out for you. These cars aren't worth the trouble.

I’m very sorry to hear that Mario...

This stuff kills me. Shops, business, people, etc are very quick and ever so happy to take your money. They talk a good game and are the most reassuring service provider in the whole wide world. Ohh, but no!! Once they've gotten your money and provide the service and it isn't right, they act as if you're a bother to them, a hassle and it's getting on their nerves to fix their f#@k up. Furthermore, it pains me when they start blaming you like, "You must've done this or that!" No idiot!! I paid you several thousands of dollars and it isn't right!! One company I love that has great customer service is Jegs. Not an engine builder, but they sell parts for our hobby and they're great. At least in my experience. Matt's Classic Bowtie's is another. These people still know the values of a customer.

Dang, sorry to hear about these issues. I see a lot of high dollar builds here and the skills needed to make your dreams happen and you pay someone to do it right. When stuff breaks, you expect the builder to fix the problems no questions asked.
Oh and I personally want to thank Greg for helping me out with my (easy for him) fixes. I'm new at all this and the wealth of info on this board is appreciated. :thumbsup:

Hey Mario,

A-he's probably burnt out
B-can't fix some issues, doesn't want to deal with it rather than learning, which takes time, but can't give more time due to being burnt out.
C-you always hurt the ones you love

BUT,
There are NO excuses for the lack of customer service(specially for a great customer). I do 4,000 something invoices a year, some as small as 20$ and into 6 figures.
Wish i could get 1/2 my customers to pay on time, but noooo, i have to pay somebody to chase the money which should have been done when the job was done. this ain't Macy's
We have to treat ALL problems the same. The customer is our boss, just the way it is....
I just wish i was smart enough to see the bad ones before i do business with them in the first place.

Sux. Hope it works out for y'all

Lessons Learned
 

Good guys with good intentions don't always make good car builders.

As someone on this site once said:

"A complete build can either make you famous or infamous..."

Even if I had Lillards money, I wouldn’t commission a shop to build me anything. I trust about 5 people in this whole world, and only one of them likes cars. Too many stories like this. Gives our hobby a bad name, and just makes me sick to my stomach.

There is no guarantee that a talented builder is a talented businessman. Probably the opposite in most cases. Most builders don’t set aside any reserves to cover warranty work. They have to keep billing to cover their overhead etc and as such aren’t willing or able to do warranty work that generates zero cash flow. Of course that is small consolation to the dissatisfied customer who spent six figures and didn’t get what he expected.

Don

Pretty much sums it up right here...

Don I couldn't of said it better myself.

Thanx guys I'm still processing this whole thing . Just having a hard time with the whole deal. But I'm not going to sit back that's for sure.

There's a very well know builder that's a sponsor on here that I've heard about an issue with from a member on another forum I belong to. In short the builder built a frame for a customer. The customer sat on the frame for about a year and his project went south, so he had to sell it. The frame was never installed, modified in anyway or painted/powder coated, etc. the new buyer then tries to put the chassis under the car and the tolerances are off in certain areas by about .25"-.5" in those places. New buyer calls up builder and builder is basically gives him the, "What do you want me to do about it...!!" type of attitude. Although not the original buyer, I still think it is a bunch of crap to not honor your work after selling a $20k chassis. The new buyer had to do lots more work to get it to fit. I read his posts and of course I had to know which builder it was...it floored me when he told me. I was shocked. He even sent me pics. It's not so much the fact that the spec's were off...i get it, it happens. But, the refusal to fix it was the wrong in my eyes. The new buyer had the original receipt, all paperwork and everything and said builder wasn't trying to hear it.

Trying to get warranty coverage on a second hand anything is a pipe dream imho. That is the chance you take buying used parts at a discount. And yes, it was a used part imho....

Don

None of that surprises me Marcus. Just venting my frustration . I really don't want to turn this into a bash fest it's just not worth it .

I can understand the vendor's stance as well. How does he know if the frame was compromised in some way. Same with an engine and almost everything else on a car. It could've been abused, started with no oil, bent, etc..

been my personal opinion that 2nd Hand parts are Used and therefore no warranty should be expected.

I thought about the 2nd hand stuff too...

I would agree to some extent. we have had customers buy product from Craigslist or where ever and be missing hardware or have questions we will gladly help them out. back in the day when before purchased Speedtech there were a bunch of control arm that got manufactured incorrectly and we replaced those damn things for 5 years!! as they continued to trickle in i think we replaced 30 sets of control arms we didn't even make them! WE ARE DONE NOW!! lol If the parts are "second hand" but still in the box say we would not do a return of the item, but would help out if need be. The frame thing...... that is a little tougher call but i think at the very least one would want to try and provide a solution?? either way it still has your name on it

Well spoken from someone who provides exceptional customer experience. That's all I was trying to say or get at. At least TRY and provide some sort of solution or amicable agreement. Just don't be like beat it...scram. That's my opinion.

Ego gets in the way of most these situations. Builder thinks he can do it because his ego sais yes. Instead of providing a proper assessment of what can be done and costs involved, it gets short sided to get the gig, and then gets in a hornets nest when reality shows up. 45 shirt and 1 hat syndrome. IMO.

I'm hoping you get things resolved.

Yep, and many times they know the trap they are setting, but aren't forthright as they feel the job may never procure. Construction is no different.

It's straight up lying the way is see it, I don't own a shop, have worked in one and managed one, If I can't do something I either say I can't fkn do it! or find advice like the guys on here that may be able to. What is up with all the half ass shops, How the hell can they charge for **** that isn't fixed,, I am amazed.

I'm with ya, but you take it as it is, not how you wish it to be.

When I built mine, I ended up tweaking or fixing the work of many. I can't imagine how the build would've went if I didn't have the skills to do it myself. The truth of the matter is the sorting out process is a major chunk of a sorted build that you can enjoy. Shops should really build in 50 hours to use and sort the car. It's a catalog of bastard parts in many cases that don't tango so nice.

Me, as a consumer would not expect any sort of warranty on something I bought second hand. Even if it was "new" still...

Case in point, I bought a bunch of AirRide stuff from a fellow member. All new never used. He had it for years and then I've had it for years, you know how projects go... once I got everything installed and running I ran into a minor glitch. I needed a way to eliminate the brain as the culprit. I called up RideTech and asked George if there was any way they could run diagnostics on the ECU. He said "No problem..." and gave me a RA#. I made it 100% clear the parts were new but second hand. Told him I would gladly pay diag fees and shipping....
(There was nothing wrong with the ECU and I happily paid shipping, no other charges)


Jeff-

I agree and I try my best @ BMR with Old Stuff, but what I said before was a personal reply saying that there should be no expectation of a Warranty

My thoughts on this exactly... We have neighbors here that are at complete odds with the home builder because things didn't work out exactly as they had "envisioned" with their new house. They are very much at fault for not only how they made changes in the original plans, but also how they handled the issues after the fact with the builder. They currently hate their new house because of all of the issues they've had to deal with. We are perfectly happy with how ours turned out...the issues have been almost non-existent. Same exact builder...




It falls into the "unrealistic expectations" folder if you ask me... Someone with a vested interested in making sure that everything plays nice with one another needs to be the one tweaking and tuning once the build is finished. They are never "finished" until they do the things they were designed and built to do with no issues...and there are ALWAYS issues...

I can relate to this. I bought my Mast electronics second hand, but brand new in the box, never opened. Guy didn’t want it with the Mast crate engine he bought. Well...I’ve had issues with the electronics from day one. I have mailed the ECM back to Mast twice now (just got it back last week actually), and Damon has spent a lot of time working on it. He had built me 2 different tunes from scratch, which takes a lot of time. He had to flow my current injectors in order to get the fueling right on my current tune, which takes a lot of time...and he might just be the busiest guy in the business. I’ve offered twice now to send money and he won’t have it. They stand behind their products, irregardless of who bought it. It has their name on it, and reputation is everything in this business. It’s still not right, and we agreed that I’d send it back this winter, when I can’t drive the car.

Marcus, I think I know what chassis your referring to. Guy had to cut it all up to make it work? I was shocked as well to hear the story.

Yep, that's him Scott. Are you a member on Chevelles.com?

I am not. I don’t even remember where I read about it. It was a recent read for me, and I thought of you bro.

agree 100%

Words of Wisdom
 

Someone on here once said:

"What do you want for free (or at a discount)? Your money back?"

I'm beginning to wonder - after 3 pro built cars and one amateurish built disaster..... how many guys own super expensive pro built cars that are disasters and they just don't have the balls to say so.