crate camaro's?
 

I heard that there is a company that is building GM repoduction 69 camaro's. What have you all heard about them?

Hello and welcome.

Are you talking about a "new" and "turn key" complete reproduction 69 Camaro (new VIN, etc)? I have not heard of any complete cars only individual reproduction GM licensed parts or complete restorations of an existing original car.


John

Welcome to the site. If you are talking about the new repro bodies...there are some recent topics about this if you look back a bit. I think the over response was that the new bodies are not worth the money, really not in good shape, not to mention the problems with certain states and VINS.

If you are talking about complete cars, I dont know...but Im interested to know.

Welcome
Tim

crate camaros
 

I am talking about the completly welded bodies by the guys in NC. And what is the story about the VIN's

The body's are made by Dynacorn.

http://www.dynacorn.com/site/04home/home.html

The June Super Chevy has an article on one that was built by CARS.

BTW-I heard they could not get GM licensing which is evident by their disclaimer on the web site. It also looks like they aren't selling a complete body like originally planned.

I was at Carlisle last and I heard that they are GM licensed and they are building complete car all the way to a turn key. The thing about the VIN is, if you have a donor car in your name you can change tags and they put a serial number on the body so you can title it as a kit car.

Swapping tags is considered by most a no-no. This topic has been beat to death on every camaro forum since it came up. Last I heard GM still had not liscensed the bodies, but had agreed to. No one is building turn key cars yet. Rumor mill is that Unique Performance, they build the "Elanor" Shelby's, has been buying up 69 Camaros to offer a turn key car. There is a brief mention of it on their website in association with Chip Foose, but none have been built yet.

Mike

I enjoy all the rumours about the camaro's. I know that you can swap the tag as long as you are the titled owner. It is on the books from the House of Repersentives. Also GM has licinsed the bodies and they are building them and you can order a body all the way to a turn key if you want. ANd as far as Unique rumour. I also know that they guys in NC are going to be building camaro coupes and 67 mustang too. About Sept. They have about 40 cars to build and have shipped out 6. SO far.

Who is the guys in NC?

Mike

The place is called C.A.R.S. (Classic Automotive Restoration Specialists)
The website is "www.classicautomotiverestoration.com" check it out. You can call 336-595-3900. You will be surpised what they are doing. :thumbsup:

Unless they fixed all the body panel fitment problems that the Green car had, I would rather start with an old one. I don't think I heard one positive remark on the forums about the quality of fitment on that car from the guys that looked at it.

Mike

If you notice on their website, they state the engine will be an exclusive GMPP ZL1. How can they do it if there were only 200 made and serialized?

I don't think that many were ever sold due to the incredible asking price for them.

Mike

The Hot Rod car was the first one they built. It was the prototype fro the rest of the bodies. The motor was only offered in the Hot Rod car. You can order any motor you want.

Is it just me, cuz you sound like a sales manager for C.A.R.S. in hiding speaking in third person. Your screen name isn't helping either. If so, we don't bite or shun businesses like some sites do. We prefer to get info straight from the source. :yes:

Mike

You found me out. I want to get some feed back from every body. And I wanted me being the sales manager not to be a factor with the answers. Was not trying to hide, why else would I have a screen name like "salescamaros". Feel free to to Q & A if you want about the repo camaros.

I had the feeling all along that you were feeling the out the market. :yes: Now that we have that established, welcome to the site.

How about a few questions...

What exactly is the scoop with what you have going? Are you taking orders, building turn-key cars? How about the VIN?

What does a shell cost and what does/doesn't it come with?

Yeah, what he said. :D

Yes we are taking orders and have been building them too. We started to build the bodies in Feb. We will build you a body all the way to a turn key and anything in between. The VIN has a couple of ways. The first one is if you own a car you can switch the VIN, its called a rebody and restoration law. The second is we put a serial number on the car and you can title it with that , as a 69 its called a replica law. and third is if we build you a turn key car we are a world manfacturer we put a 17 digit vin on the car for you.

Salescamaros - Can you post some pics of some projects? :yes:

Is there somewhere that one can read more details on this "replica law" and "rebody and restoration law"?

In order for a manufacturer to build and sell an entirely new turnkey car with a unique VIN that clearly does not meet today's federal safety standard, Wouldn't that car have to be considered a "Kit Car", like a Cobra replica, for example?

Also, I'd like to hear what GM has had to say about this (information traceable to a specific GM source) as opposed to people saying "what GM says".

I was high on the waiting list at 2 locations that said they were going to sell the Vert Bodies (#2 in one place and #7 in another-Both companies you would be VERY familiar with) and both finally said "It ain't happening". I drove to Oklahoma and got my satisfaction. Are you saying that it is on again? As 69 put it, Lets see some pictures :yes:

Good old internet. I got the info from the house of representatives at http://uscode.house.gov.. You may have to look around for it but they are there. It is like a kit car. As far as the saftey laws, with it being a replica it falls under the year in which it looks like "69". As far as GM they will be next week and I can give you the final word on that. I'm working on pics for you all.

Are you guys still planning on reproducing the coupe bodies? If so when would they be available?

Salescameros,
Do you know the us code number for the "rebody and restoration law"? I tried to search but there were literally 7000+ items that came up under my serach. Can you narrow it down?

Are you positive of that? Being as I've built two kit cars in California they do NOT fall under the year they look like. They fall under the drivetrain year and since I had a 71 big block in one they wanted EGR, closed air cleaner system, smog pump, etc. on a Cobra replica. Don't have to tell you what that would look like. I'd guess people at least in my state or any that follow Californias lead would need to have all the smog installed for the engine they use, even though it may not have to be run through the smog system again after it's registered. Unless they use a 65-earlier block.

Also, as you haven't addressed it on this or the other board I saw you on, what is the fit and finish like? It looked very bad at SEMA. I would have not shown the car together as it would have embarrassed me. I'm wondering if they've come up with a fix for that or not.

Jody

you need to point the reg out if you are going to cite it for justification of swapping vins. Should be in Title 49 and after searching for an hour, I found nothing.

The info you need for the VIN tag is "cite" 18 USC Sec.511. You have to read it over more to understand the way the law is written. Go figure. I will dig out the other law first chance I get. Also there is a replica law that states if it a "kit car" it does not follow the same emission requirements. I will give you that "cite" too.

I've built two kit cars and at least in California they go by the year of the engine, not the car it replicates. Anything 66-later here will require some amount of smog equipment.

Jody

That helped, thank you. But there is still unanswered questions. That law mainly covers salvage operations but does mention repair and restorations. But it also reverts back to state law which will take precedence, as in Jody's point on smog equipment requirements for CA. This is taken right from the reg, " a person who repairs such vehicle or part, if the removal, obliteration, tampering, or alteration is reasonably necessary for the repair". What is reasonable?

Mike

I may be wrong Jody, but I heard that there were some changes coming to that law regarding "kit cars". For the life of me, I don't remember what it was though. I just know I heard something about it. Stupid memory...... This I forget, but what I want to won't leave my mind for years. :willy:

Are hardtop bodies in production? Any pricing?

Hello? :_paranoid

I think I scared him off. Oh well. :rolleyes:

Mike

I don't think so. :P Was getting ready to go to the Carlisile show this week.
We are getting ready to build coupes in late summer or early fall. Do not have the price on them yet. You did not read far enough on the law. The next line said Paragraph (C) "a person who restores or replaces an identification number for such vehicle or part in accordance with applicable state law" And paragraph (D) says " If that person is the owner of the motor vehicle or is authorized to remove."

You should not regulations out of context, because they can be misleading.

(B) a person who repairs such vehicle or part, if the removal,

obliteration, tampering, or alteration is reasonably necessary

for the repair;

(C) a person who restores or replaces an identification number

for such vehicle or part in accordance with applicable State law;

(D) a person who removes, obliterates, tampers with, or alters

a decal or device affixed to a motor vehicle pursuant to the

Motor Vehicle Theft Prevention Act, if that person is the owner

of the motor vehicle, or is authorized to remove, obliterate,

tamper with or alter the decal or device by -

(i) the owner or his authorized agent;

(ii) applicable State or local law; or

(iii) regulations promulgated by the Attorney General to

implement the Motor Vehicle Theft Prevention Act.

First part states that it may be removed to necessitate repair of part which should actualy limit it to the the upper cowl and dash. What it does not say is how much of the rest of the car can be replaced at the same time.

Second, and part C & D which you brought up out of context, says I can remove it as the owner or agent of the owner, but State laws still apply. So what might work in your state, may not work in another.

Where this will get hairy is if someone buys one of these bodies to fix there car, then they sell the car without telling the purchaser that the body had been replaced, then the seller could be held liable for criminal fraud because he tampered with the vin tag and cowl tag.

If it were me, I would buy one in a heatbeat for a race car. I would rather cut one of these up than an original. BTW, we still don't have pics. :(

Mike

excuse me! it's ok for you, but not me to quote out of context . I gave you the reg to read and where to find it so that you could for yourself. you all wanted question but you pick the answers apart. and you wonder why I wanted to conceal my idenity.

see ya

Interpretation
 

It sounds as if it is not cut and dry and is a little confusing on the interpretation of the law. I suppose time will tell.

I wonder if there is an attorney that’s a member that could explain the law in laymen terms.

Although, a 69 camaro in a box does sound appealing….. :)

Isn't this the kind of stuff that keeps getting Boyd Cottington into trouble with the law?

The way you started the thread here and on other boards got people suspicious. I think what others and I are wondering is exactly if you're going to be able to easily register these cars. As I've said before I have built a couple of replica kit cars and in California it is not a simple process to get them registered. The least it has taken me is 5 trips to the DMV. The other concern is if they're considered a kit car they will be shoved into the smog program, requiring inspection every two years. Even though a 69 Camaro is not currently tested these will be. And they will be required to have all the smog in place for the year of the engine so anything 66-later will need a closed air cleaner, possible smog pump, EGR, hot air tube, etc. I would say the vast majority of the real 69 Camaro's wouldn't pass the visual check in my state, but since they are not tested it's not real critical. However these will be tested which GREATLY affects the powerplants you'd be able to use, unless you're prepared for adding all the smog along with the donor motor.

The other concern is I've seen these cars at SEMA last year, and the build quality was terrible. I've fought trying to get some reproduction parts to fit, and now you have an entire car made of reproduction parts. Are they doing anything about the fit and finish of these cars?

Jody