[Steve1968LS2]

Originally Posted by Bowtieracing

I love facts as well... And simple fact is ; more guns you have , more shootings you have. It has nothing to do how many people live in california. I guess there little bit more people in Europe.. and no problems with guns at all. That is a fact.

Uh, not really... do you actually think criminals care about gun laws? All you end up doing is disarming the law abiding people.

Let me go find how the incidents of "hot burglaries" goes way up once the populace is told they can't have guns (ie, London). After all, a crook doesn't care if he breaks in while the people are home if he knows they are unarmed.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/p...s-dungeon.html

But the trouble is that this kind of burglary - the kind most likely to go "wrong" - is now the norm in Britain. In America, it's called a "hot" burglary - a burglary that takes place when the homeowners are present - or a "home invasion", which is a much more accurate term. Just over 10 per cent of US burglaries are "hot" burglaries, and in my part of the world it's statistically insignificant: there is virtually zero chance of a New Hampshire home being broken into while the family are present. But in England and Wales it's more than 50 per cent and climbing. Which is hardly surprising given the police's petty, well-publicised pursuit of those citizens who have the impertinence to resist criminals.

More...

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdgbur.html

By comparing criminal victimization surveys from Britain and the Netherlands (countries having low levels of gun ownership) with the U.S., Florida State University criminologist Gary Kleck determined that if the U.S. were to have similar rates of "hot" burglaries as these other nations, there would be more than 450,000 additional burglaries per year where the victim was threatened or assaulted. (Britain and the Netherlands have a "hot" burglary rate near 45% versus just under 13% for the U.S., and in the U.S. a victim is threatened or attacked 30% of the time during a "hot" burglary.)

So, in the "gun free" utopia I guess you have a lesser chance of being shot and a way greater chance of just being robbed, beaten, raped or otherwise assaulted in your own home? Gotta love the facts

Crime in US going down.. in Europe going up?

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Conten...1/266umtwb.asp

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/1760781.stm

Take away the guns.. and just get stapped... (do people actually think there was less violence before the invention of the gun?)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7508418.stm

There's lots more.. but you get the idea. For some humans violence is in thier nation and having a gun just makes them more effieciant but no more dangerous. Having good law-abiding people armed has shown to reduce overall crime, it's a fact. Again, gun laws only effect those that want to obey the law and those are the people (generally) that you don't need to worry about.