I have this conversation all day everyday. We sell more subframes then anyone (All brands combined), selling Art Morrison, Chris Alston, DSE, Speedtech. We also sell a lot of different products to modify a stock subframe.
There are a 100 comments but I will hit on some bullet points on a couple things mentioned so far.
The numbers say the AME and DSE are the class of the field and the performance proves that. Neither came to the shootout so there is no comparison against the cars that did show. Yes they are the most money, yes, for a all out (I'm gonna push it 100%, I have to win!) project they are the choice. Both of these are equally fantastic, both handle fantastic and ride awesome to, but they are not required for a cool Pro Touring ride.
Yes the TCI did well in the autocross. But there is much more to ultimate handling then just autocross times. Ride is extremely important. Ever ride a go kart? Go Karts handle...........they don't ride very good. I understand the TCI car did not do very well in the ride category. And ride is what you do 99% of the time. So is ultimate handling so important we throw ride away? We can do that with a stock subframe.
The OP did not ask about Speedtech but the name was thrown in. According to the numbers, the Speedtech frame should not be able to compete with the AME and DSE frame, but somehow they were able to win the autocross....................... on 19s and 20s to boot! I installed the very first Speedtech frame in EmptyNest and I can tell you the Speedtech subframe is a no joke piece.
I do not sell any of cheapo subframe solutions. Change for the sake of change subframes as I call them. No one mentioned a modded factory subframe, but if it were me, and if I was on a budget, and could not fund a $4800 to $6700 Subframe. I would rather mod a stock subframe with killer parts. Right at $2500 to $3000 will put some really good parts on the stock subframe, in conjunction with some very minor mods that are free, and will make the competitive with the big boys.
Don't think so? Here is a interesting tid bit. RTTHs 2009, Top 5 cars. Not in order. Badd Penny, possibly the second most sorted Camaro on the planet with C6 front and 3 link rear should be the world beater and is one serious toy. DSE 2nd gen Camaro, probably the most sorted Camaro on the planet, Brian Finchs 2nd gen DSE clone car, Air Ride Velocity, Running stock subframe and Air Ride lead most of the day, and ready for this.........Jason Hubers stock subframe leaf spring car! The difference in times on a 35 second track was less then 1 second, the Air Ride car, Stock subframe and Air Ride, was within 100ths of the winner in the Top 5 shootout!
Driver, no sir, every one of these guys are awesome drivers. So I believe the cars all got into the top 5 based on the cars merits, not drivers merit.
We build a ton of cars in our shop. On any given day there will be cars getting mild Hotchkis TVS kits and 12.2" brakes, 17" wheels, 383 SBC, and right beside it a no expense all DSE, 14" Stoptech braked, Forge wheeled, built LS7, or a Full AME suspended, 14" Wilwood, Forgeline 18s, 540 700HP monster!! All at the same time. So I get to test drive, shake down, beat on, everything from mild to wild. I get to use what I sell, and get real feedback right in the seat of my pants!
So what am I saying? You do not have a AME / DSE budget, you don't need it! Unless you need that last 1/2 to 3/4 of a second! And then you have to be willing to push the car hard enough and be capable of pushing the car hard enough to take advantage of all that awesomeness.
I have a friend with a 2200HP Pro Street car...............the car is to pretty, he is nowhere near capable, and unwilling to use all the power. But he had the money to build it so he did.
You don't have the money? You don't need it. Don't blow your budget this early in the project, there are plenty of little things that are going to sneak up and break your budget for you.
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Frank Serafine
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