[ArisESQ]

Originally Posted by hp2

Which highlights exactly what I was trying to imply. As hobbiests, we build what moves us, what fuels our passion. If you try to build cars that can be resold you have to step back from that passion and look at what moves the market in broader strokes if you truly want to make a living selling modified cars.

How many guys on here have that passion, understand the mechanics of getting there, and are well heeled enough to drop $100k on a 1st gen? I'd guess that is a very narrow market segment. However, there is a very large group who perceive the nostalgia of the 1st gen, have a passion for it, like the pro-touring look, and want to be able to drive that same car anywhere like they would a late model. they do not require nth degree handling, nor are highly concerned with the mathematics to get there. To that segment, they will compare the features and capability of that classic against a late model. These are not the died in the wool, hard core hobbiest like u son here and they won't give a flying flip through a rolling donut hole how big the disc rotors are or how the geometry is corrected on the a-arms . These are the guys willing to go out and get a loan on a car for a toy and pay someone for it. Like someone who wants to build modified old cars for a living.

I look at it this way, take car enthusiasts as a whole. That's a large market. Now split it domestic and import, that reduces the number in each category. Then split the domestics between classic and late model, another reduced number. Now slice that among the various manufacturers, smaller numbers. If you continue to slice it down to the point that you only build high end, highly modified, pro touring, 1st gen Camaros for $100k, then you have narrowed the market very significantly. Granted, pro touring 1st gen Camaros are probably the most popular car in that segment, but that's still, compared to the balance of the hobby, a narrow segment you are tring to attract and retain. How much saturation will it support, I couldn't begin to guess.

I don't think anyone here suggested that the plan was to sell pro-touring cars at a high volume...
The question was: what the actual resale value of a pro-touring car with modifications is; if that resale can be determined based on the sum of the specific modifications; and what the "sweet spot" in terms of cost to modify to return on invest is.

That being said - I think there most definitely IS a market for these cars, and I think there definitely are people out there who will pay top dollar for a heavily modified pro-touring car, as long as the car is actually built well.

Coach builders like Singer have proven that people are willing to pay over $200,000 for nostalgia, as long as that nostalgia actually runs and drives reliably. I think many of Stielow's builds could fit this segment - particularly Hellfire and Jackass.