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Old 05-29-2012, 02:38 PM
Roberts68 Roberts68 is offline
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Post Someday, My 68 Camaro will be...

My 68 Camaro, “Someday”.







Forgive the long first post, I felt the need to spill it and get this started. A word of warning though, I have more to say.

I have been a member here since 2008 after meeting site owner Scott at CarCraft in St. Paul. Lately I have been inspired by several ongoing threads to get my story out there.

I have been a bit hung up as I thought on several occasions about a project or build name... or rather a name for my Camaro. While I realize that the name is not what is important, it is an identity and worth considering. Lots of them here are pretty cool. Most really tell you something about the builders intent or give some insight into either the person or the sentiment behind the build.

I considered several variations that have to do with Fire since my car was painted with subdued flames in ‘96 and has ironically survived two garage fires in ‘99 and ‘07.

I thought for awhile that something synonymous with resilience, Tenacity(taken already), or perseverance would be fitting to the point that I found myself searching an online thesaurus to come up with a cool buzzword to sum it all up. Pro-crastination has been used, but I do it often enough I didn't want the moniker attached to me as well as it fits.

Mostly, I thought of my 23 year history with the car, 15 or so of which it has been parked for one reason or another. Time, Money and know-how never seemed to align. Like many here life takes presidence whether it is relationships, kids, mortgage, other hobbies etc... So our cars wait.

As it is though, my project is pretty mundane by most "build" standards. Rather than Pro-Touring Someday and I are more likely to be viewed in the Resto-mod / Joe-Touring / Pro-Jackstand classification.

It can certainly be seen as backwards as I am trying to work within the confines of existing appearance and condition until time, money or a whole heap of know-how converge. In fact, I feel a little silly calling it a project amongst the company that frequents these boards. I am just a guy who's had his car a long time with a vision of how it would be Someday.

I looked around and in all my searches did not find another with the name and that I think it fits. It does not sound overly serious or intense, which is appropriate. It represents waiting and hoping for something that will happen... and believing in it until that Someday comes along... no matter how long it takes.

For all the times I have said, “Someday, my Camaro will be...”

By now you get the idea behind the name.

Drive-ability and seat time are immediate priorities... it has quite simply been too long. There can always be more revisions or phases “Someday” down the road. The main purpose of my thread is to share what I am doing with like-minded individuals for support and encouragement. There is more knowledge here than I will have in a lifetime and since I have had my Camaro for more than half my life I should be smart enough to take advantage of advice... (Notice he said “should be”)

I have enjoyed the camaraderie shared in other project threads and feedback so I hope Someday will inspire that on some level.


The Plan- the all important plan:
As important as a project plan is how does one know when to stop changing the plan? Change is expensive, that is how.

Powerplant:

Engine will due for now. The rest of the drivetrain, brakes and suspension come first as those were the components that annoyed me the most back in the day.

Original numbers matching 327 block, rebuilt in the early 1990’s...030” over, Crane Fireball II 302h cam, 241 Camelbacks with 2.02 SS valves, hardened seats and stamped roller rockers. 10:1 pistons, I’m not sure where that compression ratio may have gone with these heads’ chambers. Currently topped with an early non-airgap Edelbrock Performer RPM intake.

Fuel System:
Currently Edelbrock 600cfm Performer carb.
Also have a Barry Grant Speed Demon 650 Vacuum Secondary, thanks Swain.
Ricks Tank, EFI tank with low pressure (12psi) in tank pump, clipped corners.

Exhaust:
Hooker Competition Headers, 3-2 collectors, mid 90’s turbo mufflers in front of the axle and turndowns between fender and leaf spring.
Jonesing for maybe Dynatech’s and 2.5” Magnaflow system.

Cooling: 9/8/12 Edit: PRC dual fan, dual pass LS style assembly like Payback has. Purchased via PT.com from PSV. Thank you Paul.
Formerly OE style radiator and fixed blade flexalyte. It is hard to make that sound adequate or impressive any way you state it. That said, it didn't let me down even in a '97 parade at 100*+
I've been looking at / talked to PRC(Musclerodz and Prodigy), Ryan @ Universal and Sparky @ R&D Fab.
B&M polished Aluminum water pump
Milodon high flow ‘stat drilled for bypass ala Huntimer

Transmission: I'll be tossing the third th350 that I have had built in this car since I’ve owned it in favor of a full T56 Magnum close ratio conversion with American Powertrain. As Sieg recently told me, the Trans makes the Car.

Rear Differential:
Swapping my original 8.2”10 bolt 3.08 one wheel wonder for another with Richmond 3.73, Eaton Posi, Strange Axles and disc brakes. Not all the kids can be cool enough to have a 12 bolt or a 9” even if we’d like to. Maybe “Someday” I can get one.

Front Suspension and Steering:
AGR 12:1 steering gear with firm valving with a little Lat-G history belonging to Xcyz’s ‘69 at one time.
AGR OE style pump in OE reservoir.
All new steering linkage, I/O tie rods, idler and pitman arm.
“Air Ride Technologies” tie rod adjusters. (Now Ridetech, LOL)
Hellwig 1 1/8" Tubular front swaybar
soon, ATS tall spindles (will go on with Wilwood 13’s)
Hotchkis 2” drop front coils for SBC
Hotchkis/Bilstein HKS 2000 shock absorbers
SPC tubular lower control arms, with ride height tuning kit. Need adjustable jounce bumpers
Speedtech High Clearance upper arm? Just can’t get past that multi-piece SPC upper arm and don’t need that on my mind entering a corner. Pro-Forged looks to have another cool high clearance upper arm coming out but it is a ways off yet as I write this.

Chassis:
OE subframe... “sigh”. Pending frame shop diagnosis, currently seeking an alternate stock sub to give some TLC and swap in.
Competition Engineering bolt-in subframe connectors. (Hey, there weren’t many choices in ‘92!)

Rear suspension:

currently OEM monoleaf
soon, Global West L2-R2 2” drop reverse eye leaf springs, 103sh delrin shackles, 1038 mono-multi conversion
Hotchkis/Bilstein HKS 2000 rear shock absorbers

Brakes:
Depending on the length of time I am running the SSBC kit complete clamping the binders will either be:
1. SSBC A123 kit with 1 ⅛” master cylinder/booster and inline proportioning valve
or
2. Wilwood ⅞”(manual) bore master cylinder and combination proportioning valve/distribution block

Front =
currently, SSBC A123 11” rotors and single piston calipers
soon, 13” Wilwood radial mount, 6 piston 140-8921 d/s
http://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/Bra...mno=140-8921-D

Rear = currently OEM manual drum
Have rear disk setup also, but it lacks parking brake feature so I am reluctant to use it.

Wheels and Tires:
Front =American Racing Torque Thrust II's 17x8, 4.5" Backspace with Fuzion 235/40r17's
I feel this front tire is too small, especially in sidewall appearance. A little rubber rake is okay, but not this much.

Rear = American Racing Torque Thrust II's 17x9.5, 5.5" Backspace with Fuzion 275/40/r17's

Gauges:
currently stock speedo and fuel, vdo tach on column, Auto meter mechanical water temperature and oil pressure reside near a B&M trans temp gauge in a 4 pod forward console. The empty hole is covered by a '92 Back to the 50's participant button. Yeah, ...really.
Looking at NewVintageUSA, Speedhut and Dakota Digital VHX and similar versions that would combine 6 guages into the factory speedo/fuel two place pod. Other suggestions welcome.

Interior and Seats:
OEM Black Deluxe interior with console.

Originally gold, front seat covers and dash pad replaced in ‘89 with black. Rear seat dyed. kick panels etc... painted or dyed.
Full Eastwood Thermocoustic Barrier to go in beginning with the floor and firewall. Roof may get done if the headliner has to come out for any reason. As it is though it looks nice and I do not want to mess with it.
Want: Morris Classic Concepts 3 point belts which I’d like to do for user friendly safety enhancement.
I’d also like to do TMI sport seats or possibly a sportier front seat that maintains the OE deluxe appearance when custom upholstered. I sat in another club members car with ProCar Ralley’s and liked them. Josh69 had Arizens upholstered in an OE parchment theme and those were nice too, but bolsters were a bit intrusive on entry.
Steering wheel = Grant 13” 3 spoke “GT” wheel for now.
also still have sewn black leather wrapped OE n90 Deluxe wheel (needs resto)

Electrical:
Mad Electrical “New System” with trunk mounted battery relocation kit and a few relay kits.
Want: Digitails, tail/brake and front marker/TS
Sooner or later this Kenwood cassette “pullout” reciever is going away in favor of something that looks OE but talks to an MP3... and goes thump at least a bit.

Last edited by Roberts68; 10-04-2012 at 09:42 AM. Reason: added fuel system
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Old 05-30-2012, 07:11 AM
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Sonar Chief Sonar Chief is offline
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Very nice ... Someday probably fits most car's timeline, including mine!
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Old 05-30-2012, 07:20 AM
Roberts68 Roberts68 is offline
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Default Thanks Chief!

Hopefully Someday hits the road sooner than later. I have more parts than time right now.

It is threads like yours that have been the biggest inspirations to me.

Compared to the resurrections some of you guys are undertaking mine looks like a weekend parts swap...that has taken me years?

My flywheel and clutch/brake pedals showed up yesterday.

Some other minor items for the T56 Magnum trans swap are coming on the 31st, like instructions and clutch alignment tool that didn't make the initial big shipment as it was drop shipped.

Last edited by Roberts68; 05-30-2012 at 08:12 AM. Reason: Parts update.
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Old 05-30-2012, 09:14 AM
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looks like a great project to me.
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Old 05-30-2012, 09:15 AM
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Accelerating is optional...........stopping is mandatory. Your car WILL stop one way or another.
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Old 05-30-2012, 09:44 AM
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Good stuff Robert.

Regarding the SPC's - While I was measuring my spare subframe last night and realizing the upper left control arm mount appears to be pulled outward the value of SPC's adjustability crossed my mind.

Regarding brakes - Give Tobin at Kore3.com a chance to bid a system for you. His knowledge and customer service is equivalent to a 30% discount and his components will perform at least on par.

Good seats and a steering wheel are your connections points to the car. Don't save money there and make sure they fit like a good glove.
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Old 05-30-2012, 12:46 PM
Roberts68 Roberts68 is offline
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Thanks everyone

Good Advice Sieg,

I have been in contact with Tobin, in fact I referred to Norwood in conversation. I will recommend him as often as possible.

The SSBC kit I have listed is among the parts I bought last summer. I consider it temporary as I do have the Wilwood stuff I listed already, but have not sourced a rear setup yet. Somebody told me I could run drums and not feel inferior though.

As for seats and what I have for steering wheels I am making a few compromises in order to arrive at seat time sooner, and will be applying double the elbow grease in those locations as a penalty which I accept.

I like to think of it as having a blurry line between stages 1 and 2... or am I on a different number already as it has been 23 years? Wait, Was that stage 1?
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Old 05-30-2012, 01:32 PM
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Robert, your perseverance is impressive.

23 years is a long time and glad you've held onto it... you've got a good plan and keep pluggin away.
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Old 05-31-2012, 07:42 PM
Roberts68 Roberts68 is offline
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Default Not much in the way of progress, call it "Character development"

I know you guys like to be fed with pictures, so to make up for my longwinded first post I will just throw a few pics out tonight with captions. I am not so good at brief explanations but I will try.

After this and a pizza I am going to head back to the garage... the Girlfriend had an outta town softball game for her daughter and tomorrow night is her sons Graduation ceremony.

Not that everybody here cares about odometers since most cars are heavily modded and thoroughly gone through... but Someday has 121,531 actual. Motor was done around 117k as I recall but I have it written down somewhere.


If you read the intro you might have caught the comment about Someday being something of a draw for fires... more on that later. Here is evidence of another close call I had almost forgotten. No fuse blew, the repro cig lighter I had just bought melted so I tossed it out the window. It was not a good test but I learned why the original was probably nonfunctioning..

I bet your eye went to that rockin' downtown Kenwood pullout!!
Did you even notice the factory AC? That little bit you see below the off and de-ice is a special limited edition vibration dampening anti-annoyance device made entirely of compressed wood fiber. It originally came with a small collection of incendiaries from an adult drinking establishment back in the day.


Here is another sign of Somedays history with fire. That is a heap of buffing compound sitting on smoke residue that has not been cleaned off the hinges yet. It has been 5 years and I still find that crap lurking in places.
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Old 05-31-2012, 09:12 PM
Roberts68 Roberts68 is offline
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Default Parts, Parts, Parts!!!

UPS delivered the last of my kit from American Powertrain today.

I was also greeted by a small box from Global West, PN# 1038 mono to multi-leaf conversion kit~Aluminum.
Lower shock plates should be in from DSE on the 5th and the rear end swap will be a go as part of the TH350 to T56 Magnum conversion.

Tonight I removed the carpet and console. I have to say I am pleased with my floor. I had seen the passenger side last year when I was wiring and ran cables to the trunk. The drivers side was equally rewarding. The silver lining to having a mechanical oil pressure gauge leak inside the cab? The passenger floor boards are rust proofed! That is all oil stain, there is no rust to be found... unless you look at the trunk pan that is.
Somebody has some cleaning to do on Someday before Thermocoustic barrier goes in.



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