Question for our metal fabricators!!! - Lateral-g Forums

**DOOM** · #1 01-08-2011, 02:51 PM

I would like to know the ''KEY'' to this type of weld. Is it metal thickness,welder settings, technique,mig ,tig ?????? I have really been struggling with this and I'm at wits end. I have to do some work to my outter wheel wells and I'm not at all happy with the final result. I need to get this dialed in so any pointers would really help. I used Jasons car (WAR) as an example of the type weld I'm struggling with..... My welders are Miller 210 mig Lincoln 110 mig I do have a new Hobart Tig but I have no Idea how to use it yet......

NsaneHotrodz · #2 01-08-2011, 03:09 PM

Fit up is the start, get it lined up perfect! Sheetmetal clamps help alot too. Mig works for me. If you have any questions feel free to call. DeWayne

bdahlg68 · #3 01-08-2011, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOOM

I would like to know the ''KEY'' to this type of weld. Is it metal thickness,welder settings, technique,mig ,tig ?????? I have really been struggling with this and I'm at wits end. I have to do some work to my outter wheel wells and I'm not at all happy with the final result. I need to get this dialed in so any pointers would really help. I used Jasons car (WAR) as an example of the type weld I'm struggling with..... My welders are Miller 210 mig Lincoln 110 mig I do have a new Hobart Tig but I have no Idea how to use it yet......

This type of welding is driving me nuts too. I have a flux core mig and it just seems to blast through the metal even on a low setting. I gave up for the day and will probably end up replacing the part I was trying to salvage. I figure by the end of the project I'll be a novice sheet metal welder.

One thing that did help a little is making sure I try to keep a shallow angle between the MIG tip and the metal to be welded. If that angle gets too steep, it seems to just blast through the metal. Just an observation on my side but I'm a beginner.

elitecustombody · #4 01-08-2011, 04:15 PM

Once you have the gas/wire speed/heat setting dialed in and butted panels have small gap,it should come out like you want ,has worked for me. Obviously you will need correct size wire for thick/thin steel

Though there is a noticable difference between machines,you still should be able to manage to get a good weld. I've had a Miller for about 13-15 years of dependable service,it finally gave up and needed some sort of switch ,so I retired it and replaced it with my back up Lincoln welder ,which had better penetration,overall cleaner,smoother welds,but after couple months of use I decided to get Hobart because Lincoln kept acting up,wire kept slipping,getting stuck,I called independent repair shop and the tech told me to buy Miller or Hobart,because they very rarely come in for service,but always fix Lincolns, so I will never buy another Lincoln.

NsaneHotrodz · #5 01-08-2011, 07:09 PM

I use a Miller 210 for almost everything with .030" wire.

MoparCar · #6 01-08-2011, 07:59 PM

I also use a Miller 210. I use .023 wire for sheet metal and .030 for heavier items. Gas for everything. Adjust your gas flow and play around with the heat and wire speeds. The chart on the machine isn't alway nuts on. For plug welds I usually adjust the machine up to the next thicker gauge of metal, so if it's really 20g I'll go 18g etc. I little hotter.

Make sure the area is ground bare and clean it if you need nice welds.

If the gap is too big it is easy to burn through. Like others have said take your time to "fit" the metal and gaps.

Wes

The WidowMaker · #7 01-08-2011, 08:55 PM

Quote:

I also use a Miller 210. I use .023 wire for sheet metal and .030 for heavier items. Gas for everything. Adjust your gas flow and play around with the heat and wire speeds. The chart on the machine isn't alway nuts on. For plug welds I usually adjust the machine up to the next thicker gauge of metal, so if it's really 20g I'll go 18g etc. I little hotter.

same here, except i get lazy and hate changing wire so small sheet metal projects get .030. if i know im doing a lot, i usually change to the .023.

i love my 210, but now wish i would have spent the extra for the 251. there are projects where i need the 2.5 tap which doesnt exist.

Musclerodz · #8 01-08-2011, 09:12 PM

What you are looking at is a mig or tig tack then ground. I mig tack in place, and then tig if sheetmetal as in the pic.

**GregWeld** · #9 01-08-2011, 11:43 PM

Mario --

Welding has very little to do with the "machine" and very much to do with the operator... It's like a golf swing -- if you suck -- no amount of money spent on clubs will help. If you're good - you can hit any club. Having said that there are a few things that you can do to help.

CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN not only the side you can see - but the back side too! CLEAN!

Fit up is critical! Poor fitting pieces are a nightmare and the increase in skill required to weld them increases exponentially!

When tacking - I snip the wire at an angle - like 45* This make a good initial contact and actually takes less voltage to get the weld started. It also makes the tack with pure clean fill metal. I snip - tack - snip - tack.... Wire is CHEAP. Watch your "stick out" - tacking is best done (for me) with a little shorter stick out than if I'm running a bead...

I like to tack CORNERS first. Heat runs to the corners... and by the time you get there - they're already way hotter and tend to just blow.... So I go all the corners - then the middle of the piece centered between the corners so the metal doesn't start to bow or warp.... cooling as I go -- then in between each of those tacks until I'm down to an inch between tacks or less....

TACKING is one of those things where you really really need to be able to SEE!! If you can't see your work and see exactly where your tack is going and what is happening to the metal then it's hard to do. Once you're really good at welding - then you don't even need to look - but until then you need to be able to really see your weld! Play with the darkness of your helmet. Too dark and you can't see and too light and you're seeing spots all day! LOL.
Practice these settings on scrap at the wire feed and settings you're going to use to do your work.

I usually angle my MIG wire at the BIG PIECE of the work -- rather than trying to aim for the gap... the big piece is more "solid" and usually your GROUND is connected to the big work... so your tack will get off quicker -- and the puddle will gap over to the edge of the filler piece... if that makes sense...

I MIG Tack and TIG to fill the gaps -- because grinding TIG fill rod is far easier! But TIG takes far more skill so just figure you'll have to be careful grinding...

TIG can also be hammer and dollied to flatten and control the warpage and the amount of grinding required.... and MIG wire is just too hard to do that with.

Tacking is all about heat control and most "newbs" I've tried to teach are just on the weld too long so they burn thru.... It's kind of a timing issue... and just takes a bit to master but it's not hard that's for sure. If I can do it - you sure as heck can!

**GregWeld** · #10 01-08-2011, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdahlg68

This type of welding is driving me nuts too. I have a flux core mig and it just seems to blast through the metal even on a low setting. I gave up for the day and will probably end up replacing the part I was trying to salvage. I figure by the end of the project I'll be a novice sheet metal welder.

One thing that did help a little is making sure I try to keep a shallow angle between the MIG tip and the metal to be welded. If that angle gets too steep, it seems to just blast through the metal. Just an observation on my side but I'm a beginner.

Dude! There is only one thing to say here - and it's not meant to hurt your feelings -- but FLUX CORE is for farmers repairing tractors in a field where carting gas out there is too much of a chore. Stop using FLUX CORE to do car repair welding unless you're just welding up a jalopy frame.