Lateral-g Project To Olds or not to Olds

[3kidsnotime]

There has been alot of input on engine ideas, In our budget we also need to do an engine build I dont think an LS series fits the bill it will just kill the budget by the time we build one so The idea of a challenge build the olds? The oiling system is very under par for any kind of rpm duty, Will it be able to withstand track day? Or we do we build a small block chevy, parts are cheap and a savings on weight, And we might be able to set it back a couple inches. Last do we build a big block chevy parts are still cheap we can build alot of torque and HP quite easy, but with the added weight on the front will hurt on the track? So vote yes if you want us to keep the Olds Vote No if you dont want The Olds engine.

[Derek69SS]

Tough call, I voted to keep olds power, but if you want fuel injection and O/D, there's no cheaper way to get it than a used LT1/4L60e.

With the olds engine, the best low-cost O/D option would probably be the 2004R, as I believe those are common with the BOP bellhousing (correct me if I'm wrong)

Small-Block chevy engines obviously offer the most for the least, but it may hurt the value of the car if you decide to sell down the road.

[3kidsnotime]

Derek, Thanks for your input this is what makes this project fun, I got a feeling these guys are going to make me build an olds..... It should be a blast that is a real task.

Jeff

[G-Body]

I love the idea of an olds motoro finally in somethng but have to tell you from one that owned one building an olds motor is not a Cheap thing to pull off parts are scarse and if you go through mondello and other specialized builders way expensive But all in all id say GOOOO for it even a stock olds motor makes good power cant wait t see this....

[Hdesign]

I think it's a nice thought to keep it olds. I'm sure the die-hard Olds fans will think it's a sacrilage to transplant a bowtie in there. Though, considering what the ultimate goal of this project is (best real-world bang for the buck under $15K) anyone would be hard pressed to find a better value than an SBC. However, if a comparable Olds engine can be miraculously found and built to match an SBC for price, go with that.

[3kidsnotime]

Originally Posted by Hdesign

I think it's a nice thought to keep it olds. I'm sure the die-hard Olds fans will think it's a sacrilage to transplant a bowtie in there. Though, considering what the ultimate goal of this project is (best real-world bang for the buck under $15K) anyone would be hard pressed to find a better value than an SBC. However, if a comparable Olds engine can be miraculously found and built to match an SBC for price, go with that.

Ben, Thanks for a logical point of view, I am going to keep my personal point of view out of this, The performing future of our car is in the hands of our members so lets do a logical vote on this. Remember we are going to take this to the track and beat it, In the end you will find that alot more people are going to be interested in the out come than all might think. All engines will be fun and one will be a challenge. The out come of this vote IS what will be built for the project. Thank You Jeff

[tyoneal]

To All:

FWIW: As I said before a 455 Olds is cheap and make big torque up front with no bells and whistles. Plus thay have been gone long enough that most people can't tell the difference between a 350 and a 455.

It will run like a hot 350.

Yes, it won't be light in the front, but this is a budget build. I keep hearing it won't be good on track day.

What does that mean??

If you have a track that has more straight-a-ways than it does curves, this Cutless will kick some Ass.

Drag Racing, piece of cake.

Please give us some expectations as far as Track Worthyness, that you would like to strive for?

$15,000 only allows for, "X" amount of performance.

Oldsmobiles are cool and classic torque monsters, Why not take full advantage of that??

That would allow for extra buget on the suspension. If weight is the big issue, adjust it with good springs, (Cheap) , Shocks and sway bar.

Even the late 70's Trans Am's used the Oldmobile Engine (403 ci) I had heard they were destroked 455's. If that's the case, a good High Rise Manifold is only a junk yard away.

Those car's also handled well, Despite the weight. (4200 pounds if I remember right)

I am real interested in your thoughts on these issues.

Thanks for reading.

tyoneal

[3kidsnotime]

Originally Posted by tyoneal

To All:

FWIW: As I said before a 455 Olds is cheap and make big torque up front with no bells and whistles. Plus thay have been gone long enough that most people can't tell the difference between a 350 and a 455.

It will run like a hot 350.

Yes, it won't be light in the front, but this is a budget build. I keep hearing it won't be good on track day.

What does that mean??

If you have a track that has more straight-a-ways than it does curves, this Cutless will kick some Ass.

Drag Racing, piece of cake.

Please give us some expectations as far as Track Worthyness, that you would like to strive for?

$15,000 only allows for, "X" amount of performance.

Oldsmobiles are cool and classic torque monsters, Why not take full advantage of that??

That would allow for extra buget on the suspension. If weight is the big issue, adjust it with good springs, (Cheap) , Shocks and sway bar.

Even the late 70's Trans Am's used the Oldmobile Engine (403 ci) I had heard they were destroked 455's. If that's the case, a good High Rise Manifold is only a junk yard away.

Those car's also handled well, Despite the weight. (4200 pounds if I remember right)

I am real interested in your thoughts on these issues.

Thanks for reading.

tyoneal

Thank you for your input, This car is going to have a track day, a Road race course, The engine will run at 70% of the time at 100% duty cycle, Not drag racing wich is 100% at 100% but short cycle, suspended heat oil and friction time are at about 20% for drag racing, versus a road race car at 85% some other forms or racing are even much higher, Take in thought when you drive to work tomorrow put your car in second gear hold it wide open as you drive dont ever let off how long will it last that way. A car on a track in one race day will run 100 1/4 mile drag races in one day. Just a fast engine is only a part it has to take a load and what we are doing to it is going to be a tough one.

[T Bell]

I'd go the Olds route. Like tyoneal said you could get a used 455 easily and not do much to it to make power. The prices for parts are outrageous but you may be able to find deals. Nothing like the deals on the SBC, though. Dick Miller is a racer and has a wealth of knowledge on the sites. www.dickmillerracing.com
And around these parts a 200r4 is a mere pullapart and $50 away. That's right, $50.

[ProTouring442]

A 350 Olds should be capable of winding out pretty well, it only has a 3.39" stroke. It's top end breathing that hurts an Olds motor, but Edelbrock has that covered now with their aluminum heads. As for oiling problems, never heard that. It'll only have 2 bolt mains, but a nice set of studs should fix that. What the hey, go with the Olds. This does come from a guy with a big block Chevy in his 442 though!

Oh, the 403 wasn't a destroked 455.

455: 4.13 X 4.25
403: 4.35 X 3.39

On paper it should be one hell of a high winding, big inch engine. Unfortunately, all 403s has large chunks of their main webbing missing to make them light weight. Now, I have never heard of a 403 loosing it's guts because of this, but I haven't seen too many used in real anger either!

The best 350 blocks are from the diesel. Strong as hell, but it takes a bit of work to convert them to gas. They really weren't that bad as diesels either, once they put the roller cams in them, they just needed VERY frequent oil changes. Too bad GM screwed Olds on this one, it could have been a good motor.

We might want to get in touch with Dave Smith, Dave Smith Engineering. He's a real Olds guru. Maybe a little sponsor money (read cheaper parts) might be in order?

Shiny Side Up!
Bill
'72 442 "Inamorata"