Thinking of jumping in but...

[Sieg]

^^^^ Sage advice.

[GregWeld]

Get somebody to go look at the white car on Craigs List.... because even if you had to pay full asking price -- that car is FAR cheaper than the one you're looking at -- by at least HALF.


If you want a snorkel hood --- then that's the kind of thing you can do as you have extra dough... because it can be bought - painted to match - and installed on a weekend in a couple hours with simple tools.

RE: BROWN CARPET

That can be turned brand new looking in a couple hours with carpet dye in a spray can -- which works really really well and is almost dumbass proof. Some paper to mask off things you don't want sprayed --- and then a couple cans of the dye - and boom! Black new looking carpet.

RE: Motor area

Looks great to me --- no hackiemotto'd wiring.... no asshat "add ons" -- just a nice clean engine bay.


RE: The '72 on FLEAbay


No need for a 455 Original motor car for a daily driver so why pay extra for that unless you can just afford to.

[FETorino]

Originally Posted by BBBluey

50Gs is out of the question. I'm not looking to make this car a Pro-touring type. I just want it clean, nice looking and running so I can drive it everywhere just as if I lived in the 70s.

$50k will get you Brian's shaker scoop on his 71 Seriously with you doing NONE of the work a ProTouring build will be $150k+

Originally Posted by BBBluey

All good points.
I fully intend to do my best at getting the cost down but I'm pretty sure he won't go that low. He'll put it on ebay before going that low and then I'm certain one of you will buy it. Lol.

I seriously doubt you can find a 71 Bird in similar condition for that money. I've searched craiglist like a madman. There are 72 & up, but not 71s.
Am I way out of the park in thinking $10K will get it looking and running nice?
My guesstimate is ~$5K in body work & ~$3K for interior and ~$2K in motor/misc expenses. Again, not show car or street racer but respectable and dependable.

I saw a 71 Formula for $3500 a couple months ago on OC CL. I see a clean white car on SD CL asking $19k which could likely be bought for less.

The fact that you think the engine and misc will be less than the interior shows you are walking into a wall.

the motor in that 71 is junk. It is topped with a crapy air cleaner full of dirt that has been sucking down the carb. The waterpump has been weeping on the front cover, I'm sure the valve seats are screaming for lead and need to be replaced and I'd bet the motor has a nice nylon timing gear just waiting to skip a tooth and eat some parts.

You can't pull and reinstall the motor and even the cheapest rebuild with a PAW kit or some other junk from a shop will be $3500+. That's low end for a pull/install and junk rebuild. Trust me it will cost you way more than that for a proper rebuild.

You aren't even taking into account the worn out rubber bushing in the suspension. Those are cheap until you pay someone to install them.

You trust the brakes in a car that has been sitting and looks like an abandoned soup can?

Try at least a grand for a shop to just go through the stock brakes that are on there to make them safe.

I posted the 455 car as an example of a desirable numbers matching non TA car because #s matching was a statement you made.

#s matching is a term that you worry about for something rare and collectible. A Formula 350 is a cool looking car but a Formula 400 with a manual would be collectable.

The white car looks like a decent start. Beg one of the local SD members to go with you and look at it. At least everything on it is well kept and they painted the motor the right color.

Replacing the carpet would be a great first project for someone with no skills.

Project managing a complete restoration with no real knowledge is a recipe for disaster. I see you trying to talk yourself and all of us into paying to much for that 71 but if you do you will regret it.

[Vince@Meanstreets]

Beware of clean white cars. Make sure you have it inspected by a pro. Spend a few bucks.

Carpet is cheap and easy to replace, also gives you a good opportunity to inspect for rust. I still like the Silver car better. But im a glutton for punishment.

[BBBluey]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

You're so far off it's not funny. I'm not trying to be mean or belittle your dream or desires. You asked for fair and honest opinions and that's what you're getting on here. Nobody is flaming you or the car... we're just "experienced" and know what the heck happens and what things cost and probably understand your expectations even better than you do.

Please just enjoy reading about the builds here and live vicariously. When you do have extra money --- Read "Investing 102" https://lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=34700 on Lateral-G and then when you're near retirement - you'll be a millionaire and can afford to do one of these dream cars for yourself.

BEFORE you buy the car ---- ask the seller if he'd be willing to go with you and drive it to a couple shops in your area and discuss what you are thinking about and your budget and time frame. PLEASE DO THIS BEFORE BUYING.... it will really open your eyes.

No offense taken whatsoever, I absolutely value your opinion and I'm all ears to your experience. Really thank you! You've broken the process down exceptionally well and scaring the crap out of me. In fact, I think what you've stated should be a sticky.
You mentioned investing 102, I'll be sure to read it.
I'm already looking into getting autobody/mechanical estimates from local shops. Found some that'll do it for free, but from your wise words I now find them all suspicious. I'll do the checks as you mentioned.

Originally Posted by FETorino

The fact that you think the engine and misc will be less than the interior shows you are walking into a wall.

Project managing a complete restoration with no real knowledge is a recipe for disaster. I see you trying to talk yourself and all of us into paying to much for that 71 but if you do you will regret it.

Yeah, I'm starting to feel that "wall" headache creeping in. Awesome list of items I can use to grind him down if I go that way. Thank you.
You're right, I do seem to be talking myself into it. But there's a long story attached to why I have such a strong desire for a 71 Bird, but I won't go there.

Originally Posted by Vince@MSperfab

Beware of clean white cars. Make sure you have it inspected by a pro. Spend a few bucks.
I still like the Silver car better. But im a glutton for punishment.

Can't put my finger on it but yes, the Silver one just appeals so much more to me.


Thank you all for your wise advice, please keep it coming. It's all incredibly logical and intelligent and I hope to take it vs...listening to the little head if you get my drift.

[Sieg]

Originally Posted by BBBluey

Thank you all for your wise advice, please keep it coming. It's all incredibly logical and intelligent and I hope to take it vs...listening to the little head if you get my drift.

All three of these guys are seasoned, experienced, realistic, honest, and just good all-around individuals. (Some more seasoned than others )

Bottom line - You can trust the advice and they aren't inflating or overstating reality considering the lack of information available to them.

[Vegas69]

Save your money until you can afford a nice, drivable car. That thing is a can of worms.

[BBBluey]

Originally Posted by Sieg

All three of these guys are seasoned, experienced, realistic, honest, and just good all-around individuals. (Some more seasoned than others )

Bottom line - You can trust the advice and they aren't inflating or overstating reality considering the lack of information available to them.

I do feel in good hands but... well, no excuses, sometimes we just do what we do. But I must say you all rock! There's no doubt about the incite and experience.

As far as more info goes, here's a link to pics he provided:
http://s692.photobucket.com/user/197...ula%20Firebird

[GregWeld]

The interior of the SD Formula is absolutely hammered....


Seat Covers -- which is DYI -- 289 per seat for the fronts

Seat FOAM -- DYI -- 132 per seat

So before you do ANYTHING else to the car -- you've got almost a grand in the two front seats.... that's 10% of your total budget... and we haven't replaced the door panels - or the rear seat or the carpet.... So 20% or so of your budget is getting the interior to fair condition. That's seats, front and rear - and door panels...

Now -- ALL the wubba (rubber) in that car is completely shot... so that's a must do item if you want to drive it. There's two pieces -- door seal -- and upper seal -- the door seals are 229 for a pair - but the uppers are 140 EACH - so you've got almost $600 for the door seals and misc crap plus shipping etc...

You haven't got the trunk done yet - and the seller was either afraid to take the crap out of the trunk - or he's just lazy -- or both -- which would explain the condition of the car that he's owned since '07..... but you need a trunk weatherstrip.... and that's another $180

Power window doesn't operate.... so it could be the switch or the motor - or the regulator ---- but it needs to go up and down and you've got the door panel off to replace it so might as well work on getting it running... figure worst case and you need a motor... new ones for both doors with motors $300

Mind you --- this is YOU doing all the work.... so you need to do upholstery and now do windows.... so you're going to need tools and some knowledge... or double the above prices for installation. So figure 40% of your 10,000 budget for interior and weatherstrip - and windows working. $4K ..... not a bad figure if you can find someone to do it for that.

Leaves you 6K for running and dependability.... Lets say the motor just needs a tune up and oil and filters --- and maybe a carburetor rebuild... so that's going to be $750

Change filter and oil in tranny --- $150

Change rear end grease -- $50

Bushings and ball joints to make it be able to go down the highway..... and alignment -- $1250

Shocks -- which have to be shot given the rest of the cars condition... just slap on some Monroe's -- $250

Brakes checked and operable - can't skip that part -- assume you'll need some parts or rotors turned - the fluid MUST be completely changed out etc -- $750

Tires are shot -- I don't give a damn about what the tread looks like -- this thing has ROTTED tires and they MUST be changed... $500

So roughly half your balance is spoken for.....


That leaves you maybe $2500 for stuff that nobody knew it needed.... like if the steering box is shot --- or the tie rods are toasted... or the tranny is puked or the motor is puking blue smoke after driving it 100 miles...

Doable.... yeah -- if you're lucky and find a good mechanic that is honest and is willing to work on the beater.

That's all stuff that MUST be done ----- and you haven't touched the exterior looks. Maaco might paint it silver again... so maybe you have enough for a quick spray job.

All in all said --- you have the cost of the car -- and 10K invested.... and you better pray to god it needs nothing else.

[cluxford]

Here's one done ready to go in the range you are talking of building a project (i.e. listed for $17,500, but could most likely get for a tad less)

no waiting, no working, get in and drive

http://www.haggleme.com/Vehicle/loca...ebird-400.aspx