WELD/SUTTON DIRT MISSILE build

[Build-It-Break-it]

What material for your driveline are you guys running? What type of U joint? I've seen the solid non greaseable 1350 joint but was curious of it's reliability for a duel purpose car.

You just can't beat the value of what you get for what you paid for this car. The time it took from start to finish is just amazing. If I could afford to do my car again I'd be money ahead to just buy a rolling chassis all set up from Ron and throw my steel body on it and enjoy. I'd still want license plates tho so I could drive it on the street when I know I shouldn't.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Build-It-Break-it

That material for your driveline are you guys running? What type of U joint? I've seen the solid non greaseable 1350 joint but was curious of it's reliability for a duel purpose car.

You just can't beat the value of what you get forwhat you paid for this car. The time it took from start to finish is just amazing. If I could afford to do my car again I'd be money ahead to just buy a rolling chassis all set up from Ron and throw my steel body on it and enjoy. I'd still want license plates tho so I could drive it on the street when I know I shouldn't.

FACT.......


Or you can just buy all the pieces as you can afford them (no different than any other build) but you'll end up with something that works and is superior in so many ways.

For me --- the speeds these guys are running in their "street cars"..... yeah -- they're insane. Only time before that doesn't work out so well.

I have street cars -- I have a Porsche Turbo S - I've driven lots of "fast" cars.... to me - they're so boring..... compared to when something like this is born and you crawl behind the wheel. For me personally -- it's just a natural progression.

[Vegas69]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

AND IT'S BAD ASS !!! And and a "missile"......


And you "Corvette racers"...... well yeah -- about that..... LOL


I'll take a real race car with race tires - and all the safety - and all the coolness that goes with all that. Not baggin' on Pro showing -- but some guys have moved beyond that.

GONE RACIN'

I'm with you my friend. After my car I came to the conclusion that I'd have a nice street car or a nice race car. In between just doesn't work out that well.

[mfain]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

I'm with you my friend. After my car I came to the conclusion that I'd have a nice street car or a nice race car. In between just doesn't work out that well.

Todd,

I totally agree - and starting with a street(able) car that evolves into a race car isn't much better. I've probably got $30K worth of old "new" parts laying in the corner of my garage - parts that were on the car for some time but gave way to "a better idea" before they were ever used. Anybody need a set of never-driven 18" HRE's with 7 year-old sticker MPSC1s that were relegated to garage roll-arounds? LOL Yeah, Todd I know - my grandkid's grandkids will love it. But Greg and I have an eventual track date I can't miss.

Pappy

[Ron Sutton]

Originally Posted by Build-It-Break-it

What material for your driveline are you guys running? What type of U joint? I've seen the solid non greaseable 1350 joint but was curious of it's reliability for a duel purpose car.

You just can't beat the value of what you get for what you paid for this car. The time it took from start to finish is just amazing. If I could afford to do my car again I'd be money ahead to just buy a rolling chassis all set up from Ron and throw my steel body on it and enjoy. I'd still want license plates tho so I could drive it on the street when I know I shouldn't.

Good question!

We run both 1026 DOM & 4130 Chromoly driveshafts. With the sequential "no-lift" shift transmission the DOM absorbs the shock better. We run special Dana Spicer 1350 chromoly U-joints. No zerk to grease, so no weak spots.

We have a LOT of clients building Track-Warriors for street & track. The way most clients do it is buy the "Build-Your-Own" kits that start at $12,899 HERE.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

I'm with you my friend. After my car I came to the conclusion that I'd have a nice street car or a nice race car. In between just doesn't work out that well.

I will "qualify" my comments about street cars and purpose built track cars....


We all know full well there are compromises in ride quality - ride height - power to weight - tire sizes and type - seating - fire safety - cage quality.

I'm not the type to bag on other peoples choices and I know full well that most can't afford to have purpose built cars. But if you can -- get a track only car -- you'll thank yourself!! Make the PT car the one your wife will ride in and not complain....

We all know a race car is far different than a street car, and that street cars are "CAPABLE" of turning very respectable lap times. You throw enough power - and skills.... and set up - and these cars are awesome! But they're not RACE CARS and nobody would want to drive a race car on the street.

Even the shocks that are built to race --- aren't built to run on the street.... (without a lot of extra maintenance). Personally I'd take a modern automatic over trying to drive a sequential on the street....

Now - lets just get in to the aero...... this new car is completely closed out and flat and flush underneath..... I know how much the frontend of Old Yeller is lifting down in to T1 at Thunderhill..... I have to gently touch up the brakes to get her to settle a bit before turn-in.... And while I haven't driven TM (The Missile) yet --- but my guess is, she's glued to the ground at the big end of the straight and you probably just need to lift a little to conquer T1....... The difference should be HUGE.... and it's AVERAGE SPEED that creates the lower lap times we need for this car to be competitive. I'd spend $40 or 50 grand plus trying to turn OY in to half the car the new one is..... and it still wouldn't come close!

If I didn't have the resources to build something like this ---- then I'd just keep/buy Old Yeller again.... and I'd certainly never complain about having to drive HellFire or JackAss 2.0 etc and track them. But I'd sure hate to repair either of them and keep them looking like the award winning cars they are. That would make racing TM look CHEAP! LOL

[Vegas69]

You can buy used race cars pretty cheap. Go through it and make some upgrades and let it rip! Undoubtedly, that's what I'd do if I get the itch. Beat the snot out of it and not give a damn.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

You can buy used race cars pretty cheap. Go through it and make some upgrades and let it rip! Undoubtedly, that's what I'd do if I get the itch. Beat the snot out of it and not give a damn.

I do NOT want my '40 Ford to ride or act anywhere near what these track cars do!!!

One is for street driving nirvana...... the other is for TRACK only nirvana. The two are mutually exclusive.

I'm no suspension guy --- don't need to be --- Ron Sutton handles all of that --- but danged if I can figure out how STIELOW gets his cars to handle so well -- and yet they're so drivable. They just wouldn't be competitive in NASA TTU which is what this was conceived for.

Readers --- remember what I'm attempting to clarify here -------- a pure track only car vs a street car that is more than capable of great times/driving both on track and on the street. I'm just saying that pure track cars are rather evil...... and cars like HellFire - Jackass 2.0 and other well sorted and built "pro touring cars" shouldn't be. The new subframe from SpeedTech or the sub from DSE, The Roadster Shop, etc -- are just sensational for handling and tuning capabilities and if I was building a new car today these parts would be mandatory they're just so good.

[glassman]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

--- but danged if I can figure out how STIELOW gets his cars to handle so well -- and yet they're so drivable. They just wouldn't be competitive in NASA TTU which is what this was conceived for.

And i believe his cars to be the ULTIMATE Street Cars. Fast, friedly, fun and show worthy.....

And yes, i've learned (the hardway lol) that my camaro had to "choose" a path, racing or touring....now i'm saving up for your yellow one, maybe.

[Ron Sutton]

Some of you may not have realized on our shake down day the car wasn't ready to race or run many laps because the interior tin wasn't sealed & the exhaust wasn't thermal barrier coated.

The cockpit needs to be fully sealed from the engine bay & fuel cell area. We use a 3M Fire Retardant Sealer good up to 2000°. The exhaust runs so close to the transmission, the gear oil would overheat in it if the exhaust was uncoated. So we Jet-Hot coat the inside & outside of the header tubes & exhaust. (Mufflers only on the outside) This knocks down the radiant heat around the transmission & driver by 40-45°.

The Mustang comes apart late this week to go to powder coat. In our Track-Warrior cars like Greg's ... the steel floor, firewall & bulkhead/rear deck sheet metal are welded to the chassis ... and get powder coated along with the chassis & cage assembly. When it goes back together for final assembly, Randy Chastain will utilize the 3M Fire Retardant Sealer on every seam under the car, at the firewall & at the rear bulkhead & decklid sheet metal. This prevents C0², smoke, oil, fire, etc from entering into the cockpit.

I'm outlining this important step, because many of you already have, or will, modify the sheet metal in your builds & NEED TO KNOW it's critical to seal it & what to use. It's NOT OK to leave any seam unsealed. It's unsafe.

The car will go back together later this month & get ready to go run the NASA event at Thunderhill Raceway in Willows California on Aug 4-5. Since the car wasn't built to fit a class, we will run it in the "Unlimited" class of NASA's Time Attack, known as TTU. Since it is an unlimited class, often there are Prototype race cars that run in TTU.



We won't stand a chance against any Prototype race cars, with our Trans Am style 70 Mustang. But if there are no Prototype race cars, we'll have a good shot at running up front. Our driver Benny Moon is super talented, but hasn't been in a real race car is many years, so he'll need to shake off the rust as we work up to speed.

I don't know how fast we'll get this first weekend. I plan to do only basic tuning for balance. But it would be fun to have a pool of folks betting on Benny's best lap of the weekend.

We have a betting pool ... similar to a football pool.
* 100 times between 1:50.0 & 1:59.9 lap time, a tenth of a second apart
* Pick one time or as many as your wallet can handle
* Closest time wins all the pool money & bragging rights
* Only 1 time, Best time of the weekend, counts

Pick your time(s) HERE.