Speed Tech or Art Morrison, DSE 69 Camaro Frame

[6spdcamaro]

Originally Posted by killer69

The Speedtech subframe is also a good choice for certain applications and their nova has seen quite a bit of track time recently. It's best (and worst) feature is that it allows you to use suspension components you may have already bought before you decided to go aftermarket. This feature comes at a big cost. The speedtech subframe, unlike the DSE and AME, has the same geometry as a modded stock subframe. They restricted themselves to utilizing stock spindles, stock pickup points and control arm lengths with exception to the "built in g-mod", which costs $18 on a stock sub. There is a lot of variables in an independent suspension, and these restrictions require that sacrifices be made somewhere. The Speedtech subframe is the "best" bang for your buck, but that is because it is based on a stock subframe, which really is the best for the money. I'm not trying to brainlessly bash speedtech, because they are a good company, with good products and service, it's just that too many people falsely think they are getting all the offerings of an aftermarket sub, for much less money.

Just wanted to add a couple things to this. Even tho the Speedtech sub uses stock pick up points . the main rails and arms have been redesigned to give clearance for up to 10" wide front rims and include Delrin bushings and stainless steel X Shafts. You have the option of using the stock spindle with or with out the G mod. and the ability to tune the camber curve anywhere in between the 2 points, also with the addition of the Tall AFX spindle you get a camber curve that is as good as any. you also get coil over shocks with a revised motion ratio. the sub is much more ridgid than the stock sub ever was as well as being lighter by about 15 lbs (not much but lighter all the same)
I don't understand what you mean when you say it's just that too many people falsely think they are getting all the offerings of an aftermarket sub, for much less money.

You mention that sacrifices must be made, be assured that DSE and AME also made sacrifices in their design.

Just as a compairson the DSE 2 gen was only 0.7 seconds quicker than the Speedtech Nova on the auto X at the Optima Ultimate Street Car Invitational and that was the FIRST time our car had actually been timed arround an auto X.

Another thing to consider is what is the potential customer doing with the car and what is the budget?

Thank you for the compliment by the way.

Hope this adds to the topic.

Blake,
Thanks for the response. Sorry, I guess that comment in blue was out of line and misleading, considering I don't actually know how the geometry compares. Hopefully you guys understand I wasn't trying to bash you, I just felt the stock pickup points were a big restriction (maybe more than in reality) in designing your subframe.

[Blake Foster]

No worries Ken
Just need to make sure people don't get the wrong or misleading information when it comes to comparing product.

[wrighton]

Why were on this subject. I have not bought my subframe yet. And been reading and studying for a very long time. I recently emailed speedtech and received a qoute and info the same day. I appreaciated the fast response. Also I am here in WA state so shipping will be less. Something to consider in the price factor.

Now if someone will steer me in how wide a front wheel I can run with correct backspacing and tire size. I want to run a 18x9 f and 18x11 R with stock sub and speed tech high clearance arms and tall spindles. ? Possible? 8.5 f?

[Blake Foster]

what year car?
let me get back to you with the EXACT fitment you need for that.

[Blake Foster]

Wheel size on a 68 that can be run is 18x9 6.375 BS this is on a stock sub with tall spindles and hight clearance upper arms.
but having said that this is ABSOLUTLY PUSHING THE LIMIT, and i will not be responsible for them rubbing if you go this route. the stock steering arm will be your buggest issue. the unisteer rack has a shorter steering arm and slightly smaller outer tie rod end, for what thats worth.

[youthpastor]

Originally Posted by killer69

Wheel size on a 68 that can be run is 18x9 6.375 BS this is on a stock sub with tall spindles and hight clearance upper arms.
but having said that this is ABSOLUTLY PUSHING THE LIMIT, and i will not be responsible for them rubbing if you go this route. the stock steering arm will be your buggest issue. the unisteer rack has a shorter steering arm and slightly smaller outer tie rod end, for what thats worth.

here is a Speedtech set-up- tall spindle- Unisteer with an 18x9 and 6in BS with a 275- I bolted the wheel on last night and was amazed at the turning radius- I would say the first thing that would contact is the upper A-Arm at the ball-joint with a tall spindle- If you are interested I can get some pics tonight from above showing lock to lock- Chris

[Blake Foster]

And there is the differance between the 2 tall spindles, the ATS is 7/8" drop which helps in the upper ball joint area, i run 18 x9.5 with 6.5 bs and have NO issues with contact once the steering stops are adjusted.

Chris it looks like the car is comming together.

[awr68]

Looking good Chris!

Blake, I have an 18x9 with IIRC a 5.625" BS...hope it all works out! Pete hasn't said anything about clearance issues...but it isn't aligned either. I was working off the trusty 8" with 5" BS when I ordered the wheels...as long as the new track width is the same as stock I should be golden! Your thoughs?

[Blake Foster]

Track width is the same as stock, you should be close??? but that is what Negative camber is for

[Musclerodz]

Originally Posted by youthpastor

here is a Speedtech set-up- tall spindle- Unisteer with an 18x9 and 6in BS with a 275- I bolted the wheel on last night and was amazed at the turning radius- I would say the first thing that would contact is the upper A-Arm at the ball-joint with a tall spindle- If you are interested I can get some pics tonight from above showing lock to lock- Chris

it does not look like you have the rack and steering arms installed. With those installed, you will clear everything on the insde. I just rehooped a set of Boze wheels to 6.5 bs that we originally spec'd for a stock sub, then changed to Speedtech sub and was able to suck the wheels in further to give us more clearance