Composite leaf springs om 69 Camaro

[T-T]

Hello there.
A couple of years where I just have followed the various posts, this is my first post on this forum.
I hope that it will give me a lot of response to my humble questions, as I will do anything to help out where I can make a difference.
I've separated my 69 Camaro and seek knowledge and new parts to make it a scary street machine, -ready to give all the "exotic" buy-cars like Ferrari and Porsche opportunities to look at my rear taillights and smoking rear tires

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I plan to buy myself a set of composite leaf springs from VBP to my 69 Camaro.
- Those of you who have the fiberglass leaf springs already installed and running for a while, maybe you can tell me what it gives and takes. -Good and bad.
- In my Camaro, i´m planing approx 500 hp,5 speed manual and I will use the car for street and “semi-serious” weekend autocross.
- Is it possible to order the composite leaf springs 2 inch lowering rear of the car. -or do I have to do it with lowering Blocks.? .. don´t like!
- I've seen people talk about 150 to 210 pounds of pressure/strength ??? ... what can be recommended - please tell from your experiences.
-Can they break ...!!! .. -- is after all just two rods of fiberglass ... or is it??

Leaf spring link: http://www.vbandp.com/Camaro/1st-Gen-1967-69.html

Thanks for all help before I order ....??
Tom –Denmark-

[Roberts68]

Welcome to the forum.

I looked into VBP composite springs again recently, I had their catalog and considered that route back in the early 90's. I was mostly curious whether they were still being made or if VBP was still around.

I have no firsthand experience with their product.

I have seen very few folks here running a composite spring.

CarlC ran them on his 68 Camaro but they were Flex-a-form and he had custom spherical bushings in the front eye. I do believe that he has gone back to a metal spring and that may coincide with the additional power from a Magnuson supercharger.

flex-a-form link

Deaver spherical bushing link

From what I have read here there is somewhat of a hp threshhold indicated at around 500hp. Some say that a leafspring is being asked a bit much to work with that load. You may want to look into alternative suspension setups for the goals you mentioned. I am sure others will be along to mention the vast number of options available for a build like that, and I can think of at least one vendor with ongoing experience shipping parts across the big pond to your neighbors.

[Sieg]

Welcome Tom!


I have not seen any of the "top" Camaro parts vendors promoting fiberglass springs and I haven't seen any project cars using them. The trend is coil over 4-link or torque arm rear suspension, which would be my recommendation if you want to take on the big boys.

I considered them 10 years ago, but ended up with Global West steel leaf @ 175 lb. I went 2" lower and added 1" blocks and it's still a little high for my liking. These cars vary a little so don't rely on my numbers. FWIW - My future plans include SpeedTech's torque arm rear suspension.

[T-T]

Originally Posted by Sieg

The trend is coil over 4-link or torque arm rear suspension, which would be my recommendation if you want to take on the big boys.

Thanks for response.
I know, -it's certainly not easy to play with the big guys (or girl).... but why not - I know that the road is long and most of the road is uphill, but the big guys also began their dreams as little boys .....
-- Okay - You're probably right, that it would be more up to date with a 4-link system from one of the major vendors, - but there is just this huge problem here in Denmark. - It will still be a legal streetcar with license plates on, - and if (read when) I get tackled by police (the state), they will look at my "old" 1969 Camaro like a brand new car and therefore collect a huge amount of tax as if it were a brand new car - we're talking about plus 8-9000 dollars. -Yes!
Therefore we have to rebuild cautiously, with only small improvements in our old cars.
...and therefore a set of leaf springs of composite is very interesting -if I can reduce weight by 30-35 pounds per leafspring (60-65 pounds waauuw!!), it can not be all wrong.
I´m looking forward to here some more response - Thanks

[Sieg]

Check this rear system: https://lateral-g.net/forums/show...&postcount=161
Dollar for dollar it's one of the better options and appears to be a relatively simple install. Certainly not a cheap as a simple leaf spring change though, but if you want to play with the big boys I don't think leaf springs are the answer. Don't know how the state regs would apply to this kit.

[JKnight]

I run 220 lb/sq in. Hyperco composite leafs on my car with a Fays2 Watt's link. I can tell you that the ride is great due to the lower unsprung weight and it handles really well. I haven't done any competitions so I have no numbers or rankings in events to back it up, but for less than $1,500 I feel I have a very competent rear suspension. I believe I will need to add a sway bar or more front tire to improve balance at some point, but for an 90% street car it's not really necessary. I would have preferred the adjustability of a 4-link, but given my budget it just wasn't in the cards.

I would think one of the limitations, downsides, for any fiberglass spring is going to be with axle wrap/wheel hop. This has not been an issue for me thus far, but I'm only running 425-450 hp and have a heavy 9" rear end in the back.

[Hotchkis]

Originally Posted by T-T

Hello there.
A couple of years where I just have followed the various posts, this is my first post on this forum.
I hope that it will give me a lot of response to my humble questions, as I will do anything to help out where I can make a difference.
I've separated my 69 Camaro and seek knowledge and new parts to make it a scary street machine, -ready to give all the "exotic" buy-cars like Ferrari and Porsche opportunities to look at my rear taillights and smoking rear tires

-----------------------
I plan to buy myself a set of composite leaf springs from VBP to my 69 Camaro.
- Those of you who have the fiberglass leaf springs already installed and running for a while, maybe you can tell me what it gives and takes. -Good and bad.
- In my Camaro, i´m planing approx 500 hp,5 speed manual and I will use the car for street and “semi-serious” weekend autocross.
- Is it possible to order the composite leaf springs 2 inch lowering rear of the car. -or do I have to do it with lowering Blocks.? .. don´t like!
- I've seen people talk about 150 to 210 pounds of pressure/strength ??? ... what can be recommended - please tell from your experiences.
-Can they break ...!!! .. -- is after all just two rods of fiberglass ... or is it??

Leaf spring link: http://www.vbandp.com/Camaro/1st-Gen-1967-69.html

Thanks for all help before I order ....??
Tom –Denmark-

Tom,
Composite leaf springs are great for Corvette front suspensions (where it’s transverse mounted) since they only need to spring up and down. As a rear leaf spring in a car like your Camaro, the spring is subjected to lateral forces where it is not as strong. The worst possible force for a composite leaf spring is to twist it into an S-shape, which is what would happen if you have a high-output engine and moderate traction. Adding a lowering block to any rear leaf spring moves the centerline of the drive axle away from the leaf spring, which greatly increases the leverage of forces that attempt to turn the spring into the shape of an S. Adding a lowering block to a composite leaf spring is not suggested.
Leaf springs like the ones we offer are extremely effective for handling. Mary Pozzi and Carl Casanova have been wiping up the competition with Hotchkis leaf springs on their Camaros.
Carl Casanova

Mary Pozzi

They have proved that you don’t have to spend a ton of time and money to have a good handling vehicle.

[Mkelcy]

Originally Posted by Hotchkis

Tom,
Composite leaf springs are great for Corvette front suspensions (where it’s transverse mounted) since they only need to spring up and down. As a rear leaf spring in a car like your Camaro, the spring is subjected to lateral forces where it is not as strong. The worst possible force for a composite leaf spring is to twist it into an S-shape, which is what would happen if you have a high-output engine and moderate traction. Adding a lowering block to any rear leaf spring moves the centerline of the drive axle away from the leaf spring, which greatly increases the leverage of forces that attempt to turn the spring into the shape of an S. Adding a lowering block to a composite leaf spring is not suggested.

Leaf springs like the ones we offer are extremely effective for handling. Mary Pozzi and Carl Casanova have been wiping up the competition with Hotchkis leaf springs on their Camaros.

With respect, Carl ran Flex-a-Form composite leaf springs with swivel bushings for (I think) at least five years before he recently swapped over to the Hotchkis springs and was pretty sucessful with that setup as well.

Most of us who run composite leafs have found that we can run higher springs rates with less relative degradation of ride when compared to steel springs.

[Hotchkis]

Originally Posted by Mkelcy

With respect, Carl ran Flex-a-Form composite leaf springs with swivel bushings for (I think) at least five years before he recently swapped over to the Hotchkis springs and was pretty sucessful with that setup as well.

Most of us who run composite leafs have found that we can run higher springs rates with less relative degradation of ride when compared to steel springs.

MKelcy,
You’re absolutely correct, he was very successful with the composite springs, but he was willing to swap to a complete Hotchkis TVS for our R&D needs. With his new combination his Camaro took first place in the Autocross portion of the Super Chevy Magazine Suspension and Handling Challenge, getting great points for both ride comfort and handling.

[69MyWay]

VB&P is out of business. And...I have their composite springs on my 69 Camaro. The bushings on front and rear of the leaf springs are shot.

Any idea the size and or replacements?

I can tear it down and measure. But once I do the car is not moveable.