Thanks guys.

Daniel

Nice job on the gauge install. They came out great.

Thanks Wayne.

I had the windshield and back glass installed today. I finished making the driver's seat bracket. Been installing grounds, plumbing the fuel system, installing ignition box and coil, installing the parking brake setup, etc.

I've received some parts I'd been waiting on, so that should move things along. Ordered a TMI 1 piece headliner today from MCB. TMI is running 10-12 weeks out...looks like the first few drives will be without.

Daniel

Installed the wiper motor. I went with a New Port wiper motor to gain some space...and I think they look better than the original.

Made a coil bracket and got that installed.

Also got the fuel lines run, fuel rail installed, Lokar parking brake cables installed/adjusted, AC lines crimped/installed, pedal covers installed, throttle bracket and cable installed. Oh, and had the windshield and back glass installed as well.

And not it's time for some wiring fun...

Wiring is not a strength of mine. Hopefully, I can stumble through it without too many hiccups.

Daniel

Wiring isn't in my area of expertise either. You're doing great...then again I obviously have no idea what I'm talking about. :knock::whistling:

Ignition wiring help needed
 

I've been working on the wiring and I'm stumped on getting the engine started. Tried to start for the first time a couple of weeks ago. The engine turns over nice- have oil pressure, fuel pressure, strong starter turnover- engine won't fire. Probed a few wires and called MSD. MSD had me check for 12v at the MSD green and violet wires that plug into my distributor- nothing. They said send it back to them. Sent it back, they tested the ignition box and coil- both tested good.

Reinstalled everything this morning, still no luck.

Here's what I'm working with:
MSD StreetFire ignition box (very similar to 6AL)
MSD Blaster SS coil
New Rebel Wiring harness
New ignition switch
New Ford solenoid mounted in trunk next to new AGM battery

The ignition switch pictured is currently setup like this:
BAT terminal- wired to red 12V IGN SW PWR wire
ACC terminal- wired to brown IGN SW ACC wire
SOL terminal- wired to purple IGN SW START & pink COIL wire (pink COIL wire runs to red MSD 12v switched source wire)
IGN terminal- wired to orange IGN SW IGN wire
KEY-, KEY+, and GRD terminals not used

**I have also tried the pink COIL wire piggybacked to the IGN terminal with the orange IGN SW IGN wire- no luck**

The "heavy" red MSD ignition box power lead is wired to the "I" post of the Ford solenoid and I verified 12v when cranking engine.

Sorry for the long post, but so far I have failed to get voltage to the Blaster coil while cranking.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Daniel

It sounds like the MSD trigger wire (small red I believe) is not hooked to the ignition switch wire (12 volts when cranking). I would also think the BAT terminal on the switch should go to battery voltage off the fuse box (BAT fuse) or other 12 volts at all times source.

I would connect the red 12V IGN SW PWR wire to the trigger wire from the MSD box, and run a new 12 volt power from the bat fuse or battery to the ignition switch.

I've been out all day and just now getting back to work on the car.

The red IGN SW PWR wire is currently connected to the BAT terminal on the ignition switch and I've verified it's constant 12v.

The pink COIL wire that's attached to the IGN terminal does get 12v when cranking. That pink COIL wire is what's connected to the MSD red trigger wire.

I just verified the pink COIL wire is sending 12v to the MSD box...**ACTUALLY- I've been using a test light to verify voltage, but I just put my meter on the pink COIL wire and I have 12v when I switch to ACC, but when cranking it drops to 11v. Could that be the issue??

I've occasionally been putting the battery on a Battery Tender after these cranking sessions. The current battery voltage is 12.54v.

Thought- do I need a ground wire connected to the GRD terminal on the ignition switch? The switch has not been installed in the metal dash, it's just loose on the floorboard and in my hand when cranking. I haven't connected the GRD terminal up to this point because the diagrams I've seen didn't have it connected.

Wiring sucks....

Daniel

I’d be willing to bet it’s the voltage drop during cranking. I’d try a more substantial charging system than a trickle charger if you have access to one. My .02, I demon go a couple days before I figured out it was dude to lack of voltage under cranking.

Fired up!
 

Finally, got the engine to fire yesterday. Not sure which of the two adjustments made a difference to the MSD box that got it working. I had the battery (in the trunk) grounded with 1/0 cable to the trunk pan with a through bolt. I added another run of 1/0 cable from the underside of the through bolt to the frame rail. I already had grounds from each head to the frame rails, frame rail to firewall, frame to core support, all with 1/0 cable. The second adjustment was leaving the battery on the battery tender overnight to get a full charge.

After these, I had spark...great. I tried starting the engine, it cranked strong a few times, but no start. Tried again, it "puffed" out of the carb. Tried again, it backfired out of the carb...it's 180 out. So, rotated the balancer to 0, pulled the distributor cap and, yep, 180 out. Fixed that, then she fired!

I can only run it for a few seconds because the AC compressor pulley isn't spinning for some reason. I don't have the Vintage Air controls hooked up yet, maybe that's the cause. I'll troubleshoot that next, then set the timing once I can let the engine run.

Thanks for everyone's help with the ignition troubleshooting.

Daniel

PS- I have a short startup video, but can't seem to get the wmv file to attach.

Dash console
 

I've been working on a dash console to house some gauges, vents and HVAC controls. Still need to bodywork the seams, then paint it. It will attach over the OEM piece, then to the dash.

Daniel

Dash console continued
 

I got the dash console finished.

Daniel

That turned out really nice! Well done! :thumbsup::thumbsup:

Thanks Curtis.

Daniel

Grill
 

Got the grill installed.

Daniel

Awesome!! Congrats, great job!!

Can I ask what color that is?
I've been looking for the right shade of blue for my 69 Firebird and I really like that

It's Grotto Blue. I haven't seen too many Grotto Blue cars in person, but mine seems a bit lighter than others. It could be because we used a white urethane sealer under the color versus a gray. Not totally sure though.

Daniel

The dash console and gauge cluster is installed. I got the exhaust installed as well. I'm chasing some electrical gremlins- turn signals, brake lights, hazards aren't working. Think the tail light housings aren't grounded well due to the new paint.

Need to set the timing and adjust the carb because it's idling about 1500 rpms.

Daniel

I'd been fighting issues with the turn signals, hazards, brake lights and horn. I found the turn signal switch was old, brittle, and not working properly. Along with that the upper steering column bearing was worn out. It was the original, non-tilt, column, which I was planning to replace in the future. So, I went ahead and picked up a universal tilt column. I had to weld 4 nuts on shaft to be able to mount the stock column mounting bracket and adapt the rag joint to the bottom of the column shaft. But, overall it went pretty smooth and all the lights are now working properly.

I added a reverse switch to the Muncie, finished the wiring and secured the wires under dash, chased down some coolant leaks at the upper radiator hose, installed an MSD diode to remedy my engine run on, installed side mirrors, door locks and handles, etc.

I'm close to a test drive. Next up is finishing the interior. My *goal* is to have the car completed enough to make the next Cars and Coffee in town on 7/27. We'll see...

Daniel

I have been fighting an ignition no/intermittent spark issue. Turns out it was the Chinese Pro Comp distributor that came with the engine when I bought it. It was an MSD Pro Billet distributor knock-off and I knew it was used. It *looked* fine, no excessive wear, wires looked good, but it obviously has some issue.

I installed a new MSD Pro Billet distributor and now everything is happy. Still have some carb tuning and timing adjustments to do.

The TMI headliner, sail panels, and A pillar covers are installed. The A pillar covers weren't the best fit, but I massaged them in. The sail panels have a "tab" attached on the backside that slides up and under the outer edge of the headliner to hold it in place. Only problem is TMI made them about an inch short of what they need to be. :confused: So, I epoxied some aluminum strap to the existing tab to extend them and it fit well.

The roof rail weatherstripping is installed. The door glass is installed and adjusted. The driver side went smooth, the passenger side was a PIA and I'm still not completely happy with it.

Just need to get the quarter window glass installed and then I can hang the interior door and quarter panels.

Daniel

What gauge metal did you use, and size of the vents. Thanks

I used 18ga metal and the vents have a 2.5" diameter HOLE. Bezel is about 2 5/8".

Daniel

Steering gear box question
 

The steering gear box that's currently on the car is leaking at the input shaft. I ordered a rebuilt Cardone 276550 from Amazon on Friday. It showed up today and it's a 14.4 ratio box, not 12.7 that I wanted. I'd heard it was a crap shoot as to what ratio you actually receive with these rebuilt boxes.

Is 12.7 going to make that much difference over a 14.4 box? I will autocross the car and I'd like to kill two birds with one stone if I swap boxes- fix the leak and quicken the steering. But, if it's not that much different I may settle.

Thoughts?

Daniel

I feel it is significant and for autox you want the faster ratio for sure. Some people even like 10:1 for autox although personally I think that's overkill.

Thanks c4racer2. That's what I thought, just needed some confirmation before I continued the hunt for the right box.

Daniel

Interior progress
 

The past few days I've been working on the interior. I've installed the package tray, door panels, door sills, kick panels, shifter and boot, carpet, seat belts and driver's seat. TMI sent the incorrect seat sliders for the passenger seat, so I'm waiting on the correct ones.

Getting dangerously close to a first drive...

Daniel

First drive
 

After receiving two rebuilt Cardone boxes with the wrong steering ratios (first was 14.4:1, second was 15.5:1), I ordered a new Borgeson 12.7:1 box from Summit on Thursday and it arrived on Friday. Got it installed Saturday morning. It was a tight fit that required some grinding on the box and some BFH on #3 header tube, but it finally wrestled in.

Yesterday, I took it around the block a few times for the first time. :cool: First drives are always exciting. I have a few issues to address- PS pump fitting leak, belt pulley alignment, finalize timing, and a driveline vibration. Once I get those sorted I can take it for a proper alignment and AC charge.

Daniel

I just read the entire thread, congrats! After too many years in body/paint jail, my 69 finally has color. Hoping to get it back in my garage by end of summer so I can start assembly. Your build turned out beautiful!

Fantastic!

Thanks guys, I appreciate it.

Daniel

Need help- Engine imbalance??
 

Alright, I should be tearing up the streets at this point, but I haven't even made it out of the neighborhood.

My engine feels as though it is out of balance. I've tried a number of things to solve the issue, but I'm at a loss at this point. I'm all ears for suggestions, next steps, whatever. This post may be a bit long, but I want to include all the details in hopes someone can pick up on something I'm missing.

Here are the details-
383 stroker engine I purchased in person and we ran it on an engine stand to verify it ran good and all looked/sounded fine
Aluminum 64cc heads
Lunati hydraulic flat tappet cam- https://www.summitracing.com/parts/lun-60105
Hyper pistons
5.7" rods
Aluminum roller rockers
Edlebrock Performer 2701 intake manifold (new)
Windage tray
7 qt oil pan
Full length headers
Summit Racing external balanced harmonic balancer (called Summit to verify this)
Energy Suspension poly motor and trans mounts (new)
93 octane fuel

Other pertinent parts-
MSD Street Fire ignition box (new)
MSD Billet distributor (new)
NGK BKR7E spark plugs- gapped to .040 (new)
Taylor 8mm plug wires (new)
Holley 4779 double pumper 750cfm carb (new)
McLeod 75224 clutch (new)
PRW external balance, 168 tooth flywheel (new)
New pilot bushing, new throwout bearing, new clutch fork
Muncie M21 4 speed transmission

Above is the current engine setup. When I bought the engine, I removed and replaced the following parts:
Single plane intake
Holley 9381 830cfm carb
Valve covers
SFI external balance flexplate
Electric water pump

When I initially got the engine home, I removed the oil pan to check out the bottom end, etc. Everything looked good. I could still see hone marks on the cylinder walls, windage tray was secure, oil pump looked good, etc. I put a new Fel Pro gasket on and reinstalled the oil pan.

Engine has always had strong oil pressure- about 65psi. It ran rich with the 830cfm carb and was carbon fouling plugs extremely fast. It had big jets, and some other mods done to it, so I replaced it with the 750cfm. The engine starts fine and seems ok at idle. Once you rev over 1000 rpms, you can begin to feel the excessive vibration and it sounds almost like the timing is out of order. I don't hear any weird valvetrain or other engine noise and have no exhaust smoke. I checked the plug wire routing a billion times. I also have a Bluetooth bore camera that I've used to look in all the cylinders and all looks fine.

The static compression ratio is about 11.5:1, but with the ABDC of my cam and our altitude, it calculates to 9.5:1 dynamic compression ratio.

I never removed the Summit harmonic balancer that was on the engine when I bought it. I thought I may have oriented the flywheel incorrectly. But today, I looked up through the bottom opening of the bellhousing and where the crankshaft dowel hole is in relation to the weight I can see on the flywheel, it seems that the flywheel is correctly oriented. I went back and looked at a photo of the flexplate that was on the engine when I bought it and before I removed it and the counterweight on the flexplate looks to be in the same orientation that is now on my flywheel. I've called Summit to verify the harmonic balancer is for an externally balanced engine and I can see/feel the counterweight on the backside.

Any help is greatly appreciated, I'm beyond frustrated at this point.

Daniel

Did you have the new flywheel balanced matched to the old one? You can't just replaced an external balanced flywheel with another external balanced unit. They aren't necessarily counter weighted the same.

If you didn't do this, you need to take the old flywheel and clutch pressure plate along with the new flywheel and clutch pressure plate to a machine shop and tell them what you're trying to do. Don't ever assume a clutch pressure plate is zero balanced out of the box. Always include it when doing any balancing work.

Trey- Unfortunately, I did not do that because I was unaware it needed to be done. The engine had an SFI external balance flexplate on it when I bought it (he ran an auto trans). I called PRW, told them my setup, verified their flywheel would work with the McCleod clutch I was getting and ordered the flywheel. They did not mention any balancing was required.

Here is the flywheel I ordered.

https://www.jegs.com/i/PRW/228/1640081/10002/-1

Since the specs matched what I needed, I thought it was good to go out of the box. I sold the flexplate the engine came with. I guess I can try to get in touch with the buyer and see if I can get it back.

Thanks for the input,

Daniel

Are you convinced it is a balance issue and not a misfire? Maybe get it running where it is shaking at it's worse and put a infared heat gun on each header tube to verify they are all firing.

I have found that a long stroke SBC feels differently than just about any other engine, at times I've felt like mine was out of balance as well. I can tell you though now that I have EFI controlling both the timing and fuel delivery...it is buttery smooth everywhere and I didn't change any hard parts pertaining to balance.

Just a thought...

Lance- it's funny you mention that. When I was trying to tune the 830cfm carb and adjust timing, I used an infrared gun to check the header tubes. But, I did it quickly and didn't pay much attention because our attention was drawn to another issue that day.

I will check the tubes today now that the new carb is installed. Honestly, I was hoping it was a carb tune/timing issue that was causing the vibration, but the new carb didn't seem to have any effect on the vibration.

Thanks for the input,

Daniel

I the engine is truly out of balance this may sound low tech but if you don't want to re-balance the whole engine you could remove the trans and clutch. Then run the car with just the flywheel. this would take the clutch out of the equation. Then using the bolt holes for the clutch you can add weight to different areas to see if it helps you balance. If you find a combo that works you can take your flywheel and have weights added or removed.

I spoke with a PRW tech this morning and he had me verify my flywheel counterweight was bolted on in the correct position and had the correct part number stamping. Apparently, there are 2 positions. I verified my weight IS in the correct position and I have the correct part stamp. He advised me to remove the weight and verify it weighs 156.1 grams, which I'll do this evening. He says if it's a few grams or more off, it could cause vibration.

nicks67ca- Thanks for the tip. I really hope I don't have to pull the engine and tear it down.

Daniel

Interesting thing I discovered this evening. I brought home a cheap infrared temp gun from work to shoot the header tubes. Cylinders 1, 2, and 6 seem to heat up much quicker than the rest of the cylinders. Those cylinders are reaching 300* really quick, and the other cylinders are still in the mid 100's. I'm only letting it idle for less than a minute. I don't want to run it anymore than I have to until I figure out what's going on. I'm ASSuming if I were to let it get up to full temp, the cylinder temps would still be inconsistent.

Thoughts?

Daniel

1968 camero
 

Last time I saw that much heat difference
was when my dizzy was 180 out in my Pantera
I would double check. Yes it ran but not good

Bob