Tig 102
 

Who's the first one to tell me TWO things you see that's wrong with this TIG welding.... I'm not spilling the beans on what member this was (not me!) but in discussing it with her.... (HA HA!) I realized that maybe more than one or two of you new TIG "welders" aren't familiar with a couple of the "don't do's"





http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/a...os/file-20.jpg

Subscribed! :sieg:

Too much amperage and dirty tungsten?

<< BUZZER >> Wrong!



Sorry.... Keep trying! You get more than one guess....

First off, I thought you said magnets were baaad... Uhmmkay (SouthPark reference). Secondly, it looks like the same thing I'm doing wrong so I'm also subscribed...:headscratch:


Jeff-

Metal not clean

Well Jeff has HALF of it right! DING DING DING DING


NO TIG around Magnets!!! Makes the arc wander all over the place.....



I don't think anyone will guess the other problem ----- the welder ran out of Argon....Newbs -- remember to change out your bottles when you get down in that "less than" 500 psi and that won't happen.You know these are like propane BBQ's -- you'll run out in the middle of cooking on Sunday afternoon...



And since Tonnes mentioned CLEANING here's some pics of unclean and cleaned! I copied these off Miller website.


UNCLEAN Steel



http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/a...LDING/file.jpg





Same metal cleaned properly!





http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/a...ING/file-3.jpg




GEE!!! SEE ANY DIFFERENCE?? :D :D






UNCLEAN Chrome Moly







http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/a...ING/file-1.jpg








CLEAN Chrome Moly!!








http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/a...ING/file-2.jpg

Here's something else that I'm personally guilty of... the "if a little is good more must be better syndrome!"




Welders commonly—and incorrectly—assume that a higher gas flow/pressure provides greater protection. In fact, excessive gas flow creates turbulence and swirling currents that pull in unwanted airborne contaminants (and it can cause arc wandering). Generally, err on the lower side of recommended shielding gas rates to ensure proper shielding coverage without turbulence.

I'm laughing to myself at this comment... just to poke a sharp stick in an eye ---- but YEAH.... probably that too! :bang: :lol:

That's why I work IT and just "glue" stuff together at home :lol:

It is quite amazing the difference a little contamination makes. Growing up with a mig in hand it was a bit of a shock to pick up a tig the first time. They seem just a *bit* less tolerant.

I like that! Less tolerant!! Yep that just about sums it up.....

How about ZERO tolerance!

Of course you don't have to do all the prep.... as long as you're willing to have poopie looking welding. :lol:

Ya I checked in too late I knew the answer, some local philanthropist type told me about the magnet deal when he stopped by the shop on his way to some far away destination :G-Dub:

HAHAHAHAHA! Okay -- we'll give you an honorary 2nd place for good memory retention!:trophy-1302:

Thats strange, I use magnets to hold aluminum panels all the time and I never have problems.

Speaking of gas flow, I switched to a gas lense and my AL welds are much nicer and easier to weld now. I think it has to do with less gas flow and tungsten sticks farther out. Gas is turned way down= tanks last longer.

For any of you beginners,

Jason's (from theGmr) ebook is an awesome guide for $4

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00BFX...dir_mdp_mobile

Certainly helped me!

Silly wabbit! Everybody knows it's fine to use magnets when TIG welding aluminum, bronze, or brass.



I switched to a gas lens -- the difference is well worth the few bucks in cups etc.


In actual fact this photo is a GAS SAVER lens vs a standard cup -- but it still shows the difference in the gas flow.



http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/a...ING/file-4.jpg

Wow! I haven't switched my tig machine on in six months, but I'm gettin' me some of those lenses! That's pretty impressive.



Jeff-

Out of curiosity what is inducing the turbulence in flow when using the cup? Do lenses have an additional internal structure?

Nice thurredd GW, aka 'Good Welder'. http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k1...psdd81d3f2.jpg

Gas lens uses a very fine screen etc to smooth out the flow.... and then - of course - none of your current cups will fit it. Typically also the SHAPE of the cups are different.

A couple advantages are smoother gas flow -- and less flow so less wasted gas. Not very important for a home shop - but a shop that welds all day every day will save some money on gas.... as well as they just flat work better.

BUT --- always a big BUTT in there -- it's like golf... if ya can't hit the ball - new clubs aren't suddenly going to have you shooting par. :smiley_smack:

I was hoping that a few of the better guys would chime in here.... I'm certainly no expert!

Some very good info right here.....

Hi Guy's looking for some help. I haven't picked up a tig in years and haven't welded much stainless. Below are a couple of pictures. I have tried a few settings an I ended up at 30 amp and no filler rod, at that setting I don't have any real undercut, but I'm concerned about the lack of penetration. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
Greg

Attachment 38613

Attachment 38614

Give us some more information --- like the gauge of the metal...

Greg, It's about 13 gauge. Also I'm using a 1.6 mm tungsten and a gas lense.

Greg

13 gauge tube is about .095" which is 1/16th of an inch we'll call it....


Miller weld calc calls for 50 to 80 amps for TIG on Stainless butt weld.... using a 1.6mm tungsten and same size filler... Gas flow should be about 11 CFH


So you're close.... Personally I like to choose a bit on the high side of the range -- because I can back off the amperage with the foot pedal -- or hand control and just use whatever it takes to get the job done.

When I was at 45 amp, I was getting undercut, which isn't ideal either. :headscratch: :headscratch: :bang: :bang:

Greg

For optimum results on tubing isn't it advised to back-purge the tube with argon to reduce sugaring?

Yes -- on HEADERS etc.... but of course not if you're building a roll cage. So "it depends"....

On headers etc you want smooth flow which means keeping the inside of the tubes smooth. Sugaring also leads to cracking and corrosion. Purging also gives better penetration.

Notice the WIRELESS foot control??? That is why I bought one at SEMA a couple years ago...

We're working around various "stuff" --- we're not usually sitting at a bench welding all day. It's just one LESS cable to mess with. I love mine!

Since magnets are taboo........

I'd be very interested to see what your "must have" and frequent use clamps and positioning tools are.

ANYTHING THAT WORKS.... weights... clamps.... anything and everything that you can use to hold it long enough to get a couple tacks laid on.... and then you can reposition - or re-clamp the larger piece.

Sometimes I've welded on pieces so that I can clamp a larger "piece" -- then grind them off...

You really just need to be very flexible and very imaginative!


I also keep a nice piece of copper -- about a 1' long - 2" wide - 1/2" thick... it's not only good for a "weight" it also acts like a good ground conductor from the metal table to the piece.


WHAT DO THE REST OF YOU DO????

And a potential heat sink.

Alright, I searched for the TIG 101 thread and couldn't find it. So tell me what is best to clean metal with before welding. Thanks,

HEEP

My understanding of proper cleaning protocol is: Wipe down with a dry cloth, then BEFORE sanding with Scotchbrite, etc. clean with denatured alcohol or NON-CHLORINATED brake cleaner.

It's been my experience that you cannot get the metal too clean. This applies to the backside or inside of tubing also as it appears contaminates on the backside manage to get wicked into the puddle.

The OP will certainly :bitchslap: me if I'm wrong. :D

Acetone works well too... but the NON chlorinated brake clean is cheap and hand in a spray can... Just be certain it is NON chlorinated! There's a sticky in the welding thread about this.

When we say CLEAN --- it's means free of mill scale... so in other words if it's mild steel -- use a 3M disc etc to get down to bare metal. I used to do this on aluminum as well - but now just clean it with non chlorinated brake cleaner and with the A/C of the TIG it cleans the oxide off as you go. Doesn't hurt to hit it with the 3M disc or similar method. But if you're going to polish the piece then you don't want that deep scratch.

STAINLESS STEEL --- I hit with a Fine SS wire brush (like a toothbrush sized version) to clean the oxide off of it - all sides to be welded.... as well as degrease. If it's a bigger job - then I use a new 3M disc... because it's faster and easier. You just need to clean off the edge back even a half inch to an inch. Just don't forget to clean both sides of all pieces - and the edges too if they're not fresh cuts.

I don't know -- anyone else have anything to add????? Any particular methods??

Thanks, That makes alot of sense. I need to make sure that step does not get missed. I get in a hurry sometimes.

HEEP

I fought contamination issues quite a big learning how to TIG so now I'm pretty particular about cleaning.

I got a small squeeze bottle I keep with Acetone for cleaning anything I TIG. I buy a gallon can and refill the bottle as needed.
I've got separate SS toothbrush sized wire brushes for aluminum and steel. For aluminum I've got scotchbrite pads that I will douse in acetone and give the weld areas a quick scrub down- front and back.
For steel I will give the weld area a quick zip with a 50grit roloc pad to remove any rust, scale, paint, etc.
I bought a HTP Tungsten sharpener for under $250- and it is just a huge time saver. http://www.ebay.com/itm/TIG-Welder-T...-/140451757157
I started storing my TIG welder away from the workbench because this was where I would do dirty work and since I was still randomly fighting contamination I figured it couldn't hurt.

The final thing I figured out that has cured 99% of my contamination issues was switching to a smaller cone on the hand piece. The welder came with a 7 and I switched to a 6 that focused the sheilding gas more. I must have been leaving the tungsten out too far and was loosing the sheilding gas. I'm still not a rockstar but the results have markedly more consistent.

Good info! Thanks for sharing!

:ttiwop: