Need help picking a V10 Viper engine for my project

[demon34071]

I am new here but after talking to several other folks on other boards (FABO, MOPARTS, VIPER ALLEY) they recommended me posting my question here as well. Hopefully I can get a strait answer once and for all, but I'm sure I'll get beat up some here as I've been beat up elsewhere.

My project -- I am putting a V10 Viper engine into a 71 Dodge Demon pro touring car. The project is already well underway and I am at the point in the body mods that I need to get my motor bought for the project:

Here is the plan ---

Viper V10 engine -- GEN 3 (Visually I like the intake and covers better) and I can't afford a GEN 4

Engine will be mated to a new TCI Six-Speed Automatic transmission -- YES an Automatic -- its built off of a GM 4L80 case, but it also comes with both auto and manual features and has Over Drive.

Engine and Trans will be mated via TCI's adapter plate for this trans case (4L80) to a viper engine. So bolting it up is not an issue. Neither is controlling it as this trans is a 100% stand alone unit from the engine.

Questions:
Which year engines do not have the rear flywheel crank trigger location?

Would it really matter if crank trigger was on the flywheel or not?

Do I really need to start with a V10 Ram engine that had an automatic in it or can I use any GEN 3 engine?

I'm sure the answers to these questions will launch a series of other questions. But these are biggest stumbling parts me and my team of builders have run into so far.

I already know that the pan on anything other than a truck version will not work with my clearance issues and will need to be changed to the truck style, and then cut down for road clearance. Among a whole slew of other this as well. But I can't begin to worry about those items until I get the crank trigger location question answered.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Derek

Moparts - Demon71
FABO - demon34071
Viper Alley - demon34071
Lateral-G - demon34071

[64pontiac]

I will probably be your most help right now, as we are doing the same thing for a customer currently, including using the same TCI 6x. Sorry if you wanted to be the first !

Most people that make parts for doing the swaps will tell you that gen 3 is the best, as the gen 4 will not only cost you more, but you are going to have to get in bed with someone that is extremely good at tuning those cars to even have a chance of running it standalone.

The Gen 3 does NOT work with TCI's adapter plate. Trust me.

You will need to talk to Coan Racing, they are the ones that make an adapter with a crank trigger.

As far as harness, talk to Hotwire Auto.

Truck or Viper, does not matter as far as putting an auto behind it, but you may end up trying to find a truck pan to modify depending on what you are doing for a front suspension crossmember.

Someone else may want to chime in, but the Gen 2 may be alot easier to do?

[demon34071]

64 pontiac

As for being the first, I figured I definitely was not going to be the first to swap a Viper engine with the TCI 6 speed into another car... but as for dumping one into a Dodge Demon maybe... but who knows. LOL..

I have heard that Gen 2's are easier to work with, but then I would be into an intake swap since I want the look of the Gen 3. So I figured I would start with a Gen 3 since it gives me the look I am going for and then work around everything from there.

Good to know that the TCI adapter does not work prior to spending the $1300 they want for you -- Thank you for the heads up.

I will have to reach out to both Coan Racing and Hotwire Auto...

Where is your shop located? I'm always looking for folks who have done what I want to do to talk to and work with on my project.

Thanks
Derek

[64pontiac]

We are a long way away in Manitoba Canada.......

I can help you out with some pics if you need. The hotwire harness is really nice, we use them alot for motor swap harnesses. They still require the crank sensor for the 04/05 ecu.

The Coan racing setup is more money than tci, but needed. It is about an 8 week wait though. The TCI setup, although they don't tell you, is designed for a gen 4.

They didnt know much about their adapter, the sales guys didnt even know they had it. I have a cad drawing of it, and the starter area is different too

[WSSix]

I can't even begin to help you. All I can say is no one here will even begin to beat you up about the choices you make for your car. So post pictures and hang around more. This sounds like a pretty wicked project.

You may also find project Snakebite fun to look at while you're here.

[wellis77]

I know I've mentioned it before, but the Gen 3 intake swap is super easy and and only a few hundred bucks, if that. I'll be doing a Gen 4 swap for the entire upper half... BAM, 600 HP.

[SuperB70]

We need pics.

To your questions:

Crank trigger is in the middle of the block from '05 and newer.

You dont need/want a Ram engine- if you mean iron 8.0.
SRT-10 8.3 is the same as Viper other than its an automatic trans. Different headers, oilpan and no flywheel.
Gen 3 is with wastespark coils on liftervalley when Gen 4 has 10 LS-style coils on the valve covers.

Try to buy engine with firing harness so you can run with Mopars off road race ecu box(if talking about gen 3 & 4)

Gen 3 (8.3) has a oiling problem that causes number 3 & 7 (if I remember numbers correct) rod bearings failure.
Gen 4 (8.4) has up datet swinging pick up.
Gen 2 (8.0) has forged rods so it can handle boost if added later date.

64Pontiac what body are you putting it in?
Wellis77 I have read that head and intake chance would cost more than couple hundred. Parts, gaskets, bolts and wiring chances.. You got better information?

[64pontiac]

I will tell you what its going in closer to its unveil this fall....... But its not what you think!

[demon34071]

Originally Posted by 64pontiac

We are a long way away in Manitoba Canada.......

I can help you out with some pics if you need. The hotwire harness is really nice, we use them alot for motor swap harnesses. They still require the crank sensor for the 04/05 ecu.

The Coan racing setup is more money than tci, but needed. It is about an 8 week wait though. The TCI setup, although they don't tell you, is designed for a gen 4.

They didnt know much about their adapter, the sales guys didnt even know they had it. I have a cad drawing of it, and the starter area is different too

Yes Manitoba is a long way away... I checked out your website. You guys do great work!

Your are right about TCI not knowing much about their adapter. When I called the salesman thought I was making stuff up. right up till he punched in the part# I gave him and he said "well look at that, we do make it"

At this point the long lead times are just part of the build.

[demon34071]

Originally Posted by wellis77

I know I've mentioned it before, but the Gen 3 intake swap is super easy and and only a few hundred bucks, if that. I'll be doing a Gen 4 swap for the entire upper half... BAM, 600 HP.

Will... we've talked a lot on FABO regarding your build and mine. I have considered the GEN 2 like you have stuffed in your Dart when you were back in the states last time, but I'm taking the earlier route (for me at least) and just starting with the GEN 3 and being happy with 500 HP.... Well at least till you start posting more pictures and my brain on beer gets away from me.

I love reading the boards but I seen way to many new ideas that my brain won't let go of. LOL