cheap subframe?

[Dukeofsho]

Originally Posted by jcal87

From what i have gotten on here is dse is the way to go. Hiedts is the red headed step child thats no good. What about Art morrison, or "totalcost involved"? Because i would love to do the dse subframe but i just dont have 7 grand laying around to do it. Are there any cheaper subframes that are still good quality? I want the total package 12 or 13 in brakes a arms just about everything to put me on the road. Its for a 68 camaro.

heres the car

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6h1762YX7-E

I wouldn’t call an aftermarket suspension innovator that’s been in business for 25 years a red headed step child. I wonder where these other suspension guys will be in 25 years. If you take a look at Super Chevy Mag (issue 1/09) they ran a 43.75 in the autocross. That’s more than 4 seconds faster than the C5 vette they tested. That’s one mean stepchild . I know of a local dealer that was offering some real good deals on Hiedts packages. Not only that I have yet to wait longer than a couple days for their kits to be delivered.
PM sent

I have no clue why there is such negativity against Hiedts. When I was wet behind the ears (over a decade ago) their tech line spent over an hour with me explaining suspension geometry. To this day the Hiedts tech line has been very informative.

I should stop building cars and go into marketing!

[ironworks]

Heidt's, TCI and Fatman are all based off a suspension design from 30 years ago. The spindle is short, in most of the aftermarket mustang II kits there is no anti dive built into the suspension. The short length of the control arm also limits travel which mean you need a stiffer spring. Plus the camber gain is really fast due to short control arms. Plus they are just made withs maller tubing and therefore not as strong. There are alot of other popular suspensions that have gone by the ways side due what is currently avalible. The C4 corvette stuff, why would you ever run that stuff when the price of a replacement ball joint is more then a brand new control arm with ball joints and bushings and the A arm. The avaliblity of the brakes for the C6 out numbers the C4 10-1.

Technology has come a long ways in the past 10 years and you can see it in the products that are currently avalible on the market. The Mustang II design is like the Small Block chevy it still has its place but there are much better coices to made for the money.

Heidts may have some new products coming out that will set the world on it's ear, but they will ahve to be proven the days of having and old car that has updated suspension that drives like crap are over with, with as far as the bar has been raised in the past 10 years.

[Dukeofsho]

Originally Posted by ironworks

Technology has come a long ways in the past 10 years and you can see it in the products that are currently avalible on the market. The Mustang II design is like the Small Block chevy it still has its place but there are much better coices to made for the money.

The numbers speak for themself. If it works why change it? When pricing comes into play its the best system for the money! Why pay thousands more?
Were in a recession right?

[skatinjay27]

Originally Posted by Dukeofsho

The numbers speak for themself. If it works why change it? When pricing comes into play its the best system for the money! Why pay thousands more?
Were in a recession right?

what numbers??? the ONE shoot out test?
cause its sure not goemetry number... i have yet to see heidts provide and REAL information about their suspension products aside from "g-machine handling"
as far as the shoot out goes, obviously you dont really know mary, she's an extemly nice induvidual with a kind way with word.
im not say the car was probabaly a piece but Im sure deep down she feel that heidts car couldnt hold a candle to the dse 2nd gen!
remember she said it was a nice street car.

[Dukeofsho]

Originally Posted by skatinjay27

what numbers??? the ONE shoot out test?
cuase its sure not goemetry number... i have yet to see heidts provide and REAL information about their suspension products aside from "g-machine handling"
as far as the shoot out goes... obviously you dont really know mary P, she's an extemly nice induvidual with a kind way with word.
im not say the car was probabaly a piece but IM sure deep down she feel that heidts car couldnt hold a candle to the dse 2nd gen!
remember she said it was a nice street car.

OK, Please read SLOWLY>>>> When pricing comes into play its the best system for the money! Why pay thousands more?
Were in a recession right?

Which means: Its the best buy for the buck.

Plus, no where did I claim to know Mary P.

Come on... did you read the whole thread???

[skatinjay27]

Originally Posted by Dukeofsho

OK, Please read SLOWLY>>>> When pricing comes into play its the best system for the money! Why pay thousands more?
Were in a recession right?

Which means: Its the best buy for the buck.

Plus, no where did I claim to know Mary P.

Come on... did you read the whole thread???

no where did i indicate you know mary... i was refering to the fact that your using the shootout info for your argument in which the car was tested by mary...

NO... its not the best buy for the buck!
an aftermarket equiped factory sub frame will be the best bang for the buck...
as of right now the heidts is just a "hey i got an afermarket subframe!" type of deal... if you wanna settle for that, then i guess it works.



also to be noted just cause a company start building parts for "muscle car" doesnt mean thier all of a sudden all about performance!
i dont know about others but when i use the term "street rod" company i dont just mean 32 fords... i mean FORM OVER FUNCTION. be it a 69 camaro/70 nova/tri-five etc

also rodgers post was a great post and hit the nail on the head... take it or leave it.

[zbugger]

How's this Jay. I do know Mary. I've spoken with her at length about the Heidts Camaro. She definitely liked it. There were things about both the DSE car and the Heidts car that she didn't like, but were things that could be fixed, and probably have been already. Apparently the Heidts car is plenty capable of handling itself. She LOVED the DSE car, but I don't think that's the point here. I've also spoken with Mark, the owner of Heidts. He's dedicated to making his components perform. He's very into the performance side of things and is making the moves to get there. He did spend time at a track doing some tuning to get the car ready for the Super Chevy Shootout. He wants in bad and I think their stuff could very well be capable pretty soon.

[Steve1968LS2]

Originally Posted by ironworks

Heidt's, TCI and Fatman are all based off a suspension design from 30 years ago. The spindle is short, in most of the aftermarket mustang II kits there is no anti dive built into the suspension. The short length of the control arm also limits travel which mean you need a stiffer spring. Plus the camber gain is really fast due to short control arms. Plus they are just made withs maller tubing and therefore not as strong. There are alot of other popular suspensions that have gone by the ways side due what is currently avalible. The C4 corvette stuff, why would you ever run that stuff when the price of a replacement ball joint is more then a brand new control arm with ball joints and bushings and the A arm. The avaliblity of the brakes for the C6 out numbers the C4 10-1.

Technology has come a long ways in the past 10 years and you can see it in the products that are currently avalible on the market. The Mustang II design is like the Small Block chevy it still has its place but there are much better coices to made for the money.

Heidts may have some new products coming out that will set the world on it's ear, but they will ahve to be proven the days of having and old car that has updated suspension that drives like crap are over with, with as far as the bar has been raised in the past 10 years.

FAST FACTS:

1. Heidts second gen front subframe is NOT thier first gen subframe.. new design.

2. Gary Heidt, who owned Heidts for 25 years doesn't any more.. new people own the company.

3. The Heidts 2nd gen Camaro had the second fastest autocross time (not counting mine) that day. The DSE car was faster by a tad.. Mary really like both cars and Mary knows what the hell "good" is. If she had to pic one to take home I think she would have chose the DSE car, but she would have been happy to have the Heidts car.

4. 90% of the people on the internet who argue about this crap will never push there car to even 70% or its potential. lol

5. Don't worry about cost.. worry about VALUE.

Ok, off my soapbox

[66LS7]

Originally Posted by Steve1968LS2

FAST FACTS:

1. Heidts second gen front subframe is NOT thier first gen subframe.. new design.

2. Gary Heidt, who owned Heidts for 25 years doesn't any more.. new people own the company.

3. The Heidts 2nd gen Camaro had the second fastest autocross time (not counting mine) that day. The DSE car was faster by a tad.. Mary really like both cars and Mary knows what the hell "good" is. If she had to pic one to take home I think she would have chose the DSE car, but she would have been happy to have the Heidts car.

4. 90% of the people on the internet who argue about this crap will never push there car to even 70% or its potential. lol

5. Don't worry about cost.. worry about VALUE.

Ok, off my soapbox

I hope to be in the 10% that does. & I'm not argueing about who's better, I think everyone has a space to play in the big sand box.



Randy(D&Z Customs LLC.) 1-262-347-9741

[lil427z]

martz chassis.
rick k