When does a 69 Camaro cease to be a 69 camaro??

[nvr2fst]

Originally Posted by phillym5

I would say........ once the body is altered to the point it is unrecognizable...
But if the grill, head lights, fenders, and rear valance keep there original lines..(even if they are exaggerated) it still is a 69 camaro.

imo.

X2 although I dont have a problem with exaggerating certain body lines but from a close distance it still needs to look like a camaro. When Razor first came out you needed to really look at what they did (outside of the typical deck lid stuff and hood mods going on today) They widened the quarters, enhanced all the body line creases including adding a couple here and there and the way a car gets painted can also enhance the true camaro lines. Another example would be the G force Cuda, every piece was modified but in the end it still looked like a cuda representing its heritage. Over the next couple of years I feel that this is going to be the next phase of building custom cars. When you start getting into the body modifications that are typically "non removal" you need to take in consideration the cost. It becomes at times overwhelming and if your the guinea pig for that "new got to have it look" mod to go into production like CF fenders, quarters, etc. in the long run the following consumers will get it at a lower cost. The more custom parts parts go into production the more the custom builders need to go out of the box to the point the car IMO may become hideous. Ive been dealing with this on my car since its been at Ironworks from day one. I havent had any bad feedback on the mods yet..... but if there our opinions I would love to hear them.

Ty I returned your PM

[phillym5]

Originally Posted by nvr2fst

X2 although I dont have a problem with exaggerating certain body lines but from a close distance it still needs to look like a camaro. When Razor first came out you needed to really look at what they did (outside of the typical deck lid stuff and hood mods going on today) They widened the quarters, enhanced all the body line creases including adding a couple here and there and the way a car gets painted can also enhance the true camaro lines. Another example would be the G force Cuda, every piece was modified but in the end it still looked like a cuda representing its heritage. Over the next couple of years I feel that this is going to be the next phase of building custom cars. When you start getting into the body modifications that are typically "non removal" you need to take in consideration the cost. It becomes at times overwhelming and if your the guinea pig for that "new got to have it look" mod to go into production like CF fenders, quarters, etc. in the long run the following consumers will get it at a lower cost. The more custom parts parts go into production the more the custom builders need to go out of the box to the point the car IMO may become hideous. Ive been dealing with this on my car since its been at Ironworks from day one. I havent had any bad feedback on the mods yet..... but if there our opinions I would love to hear them.

Ty I returned your PM

I REALLY like the way yours is coming out. I did similar on my car (flaring the fender line).... but took a different route than yours. I CAN NOT WAIT to see yours done!!

[GregWeld]

Ty --

That is such a difficult question to respond to "in writing" -- because the question you're asking is visual... some changes might look great while what seems to be a simple (hood scoop?) change might suck.

The only way you really know before the build is to have one of the guys do a rendering - post that up and see what people think.

I was trying to figure out why you asked the question in the first place - so had to assume that you're toying with body mods on your project... so that's why I said maybe to have a rendering done with what you're thinking.

I agree with an above post - when Motion got hold of something - they went for UGLY in the first degree... I don't care how 'rare' they are... sometimes 'rare' is rare because nobody wanted them then either!

[nvr2fst]

Originally Posted by phillym5

I REALLY like the way yours is coming out. I did similar on my car (flaring the fender line).... but took a different route than yours. I CAN NOT WAIT to see yours done!!

There are certain things I like and there are certain things I dont like, hopefully when it all meshes together Ill be happy.

The stretching of the body lines is going to be a big hit IMO. Although Ive only come across a couple of builds with this starting from the Year one TA. I believe Rodger and Gonzo have something going on here and you knows what other car bodies it follows on. Cost is a major player for most consumers.
Weve been asked before if anybody would be interested in a Production Razor hood. Im not sure if that ever took off mostly because of cost. I feel Anvils costs on the CF parts they have are extremely reasonable. Most likely due to the fact that they know people will buy stock pieces in CF. Not speaking for Anvil, but IMO make a production piece that they feel only 5% of the market may buy would be tuff on profit margin. Trust me Ive asked Matt in the past, it not cheap.
Well all I can say is I see a poll starting on this.

[nvr2fst]

Greg, to all respect to what your asking I dont think Ty would want a rendering to be posted. There are some renderings out there with body mods. But as the saying goes... it looked good on paper. I think the more it gets done in "real time" the more opinions will come out. There has been only a few that have followed the look of there renderings on body mods. Most final cars Ive seen, one part or another changed from the original drawing or thought of modification that was intended including myself.

[deuce_454]

Im my oppinion it stops being a camaro when someone can say.. i built the frame for that thing.... i mean a schwartz full chassis camaro.. is a schwartz 2009 with a vintage camaro body on it...

so for me it looses its identity when major parts of the engineering gets replaced... things like the floor pan, subframe and bodylines need to be original...

widened fenders, minitubs etc is fine as ling as its modified camaro pieces, piecutting, sectioning, chopped roof or whatever kustomcar trick is played will IMHO change it from being a camaro.. to bearing the name of whoever built it...

[ironworks]

Originally Posted by deuce_454

Im my oppinion it stops being a camaro when someone can say.. i built the frame for that thing.... i mean a schwartz full chassis camaro.. is a schwartz 2009 with a vintage camaro body on it...

so for me it looses its identity when major parts of the engineering gets replaced... things like the floor pan, subframe and bodylines need to be original...

widened fenders, minitubs etc is fine as ling as its modified camaro pieces, piecutting, sectioning, chopped roof or whatever kustomcar trick is played will IMHO change it from being a camaro.. to bearing the name of whoever built it...

So its OK to cut up certain parts but not others. So was Smokie Yunicks Chevellle not a Chevelle. Or how about Big Red, is that a Camaro. Or was Bob Johnsons Cuda not really a Cuda.

This whole argument is like saying my truck is not a truck since it has no bed floor......

[deuce_454]

Originally Posted by ironworks

So its OK to cut up certain parts but not others. So was Smokie Yunicks Chevellle not a Chevelle. Or how about Big Red, is that a Camaro. Or was Bob Johnsons Cuda not really a Cuda.

This whole argument is like saying my truck is not a truck since it has no bed floor......

exactly my point...

im not saying it isnt a truck... im saying its YOUR truck, and not any repainted, new wheels.. pickup.. and if somone were to sell it it would say "ironworks pro touring truck" and not "68 chevy puckup" in the ads headline..... just as everyone knows the Bob Johnson cuda, or "Big Red" and yould put them up for sale as such... im not being negative, im just stating that the GM built, boby by fisher camaro, stops being body by fisher, and gm built, when somone like you puts it on their own chassis and changes the body... its an Ironworks car...

(i know it isnt a 68.. but I cant remember the year off my head, just the crazy cool chassis and stack injected engineengine)

[Vegas69]

Scar...end thread.

[Matt@BOS]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

Scar...end thread.

I'm going to play devil's advocate on this one. Since Scar isn't technically a '69 Camaro, I'm going to post something that isn't technically a '69 Camaro either



...end of thread.

Matt