Toyota's " Death Pedal " autopsy

[buickfunnycar.com]

Originally Posted by Bow Tie 67

Enlighten me, I can see the pedal being an issue, but what else can cause this?

I'd be willing to lay odds it's an electrical issue and not the pedal assembly,just like it wasn't the floormats like Toyota wanted you to believe.

Give it time,it'll all come out...

[Bow Tie 67]

Originally Posted by musclecarjohn

I'd be willing to lay odds it's an electrical issue and not the pedal assembly,just like it wasn't the floormats like Toyota wanted you to believe.

Give it time,it'll all come out...

This is true it will come out. But I doubt its electrical, there would be many more complaints. Electrical interference, maybe..........

[Vegas69]

I'd place my money on electrical. The throttle assembly tells the pcm it's at WOT and off to the races. Every part malfunctions. IMO where Toyota dropped the ball was having a back up plan. Most manufacturers have a safety net that won't allow throttle and brake at the same time. At least not above a certain speed. I read they are updating the PCM's to do exactly that, any brake input above say 30mph automatically cut's the throttle to idle.

[buickfunnycar.com]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

I'd place my money on electrical. The throttle assembly tells the pcm it's at WOT and off to the races. Every part malfunctions. IMO where Toyota dropped the ball was having a back up plan. Most manufacturers have a safety net that won't allow throttle and brake at the same time. At least not above a certain speed. I read they are updating the PCM's to do exactly that, any brake input above say 30mph automatically cut's the throttle to idle.

Ford's systems currently default to idle at any sign of a problem,not WOT like Toyota's seem to do.

[Matt@BOS]

Originally Posted by musclecarjohn

Ford's systems currently default to idle at any sign of a problem,not WOT like Toyota's seem to do.

John, do you know more about this? My dad has an '05 Mustang that has in intermittent engine revving problem. It is an auto and when stopped at a light in drive, it has revved up to 2500 rpms on its own, and wanted to go, despite having a foot on the brake. The Ford dealership refuses to look at the idle air control valve, or anything else for that matter, but just recently hooked up a data logging device to the OBDII port.

Matt

[buickfunnycar.com]

Originally Posted by 69MSA

John, do you know more about this? My dad has an '05 Mustang that has in intermittent engine revving problem. It is an auto and when stopped at a light in drive, it has revved up to 2500 rpms on its own, and wanted to go, despite having a foot on the brake. The Ford dealership refuses to look at the idle air control valve, or anything else for that matter, but just recently hooked up a data logging device to the OBDII port.

Matt

I don't know Matt,but I can ask service for ya.

I don't believe for a minute the pedal is the main issue here,same as I didn't believe the floormat cover up that preceeded it.

[69MyWay]

Originally Posted by musclecarjohn

I don't know Matt,but I can ask service for ya.

I don't believe for a minute the pedal is the main issue here,same as I didn't believe the floormat cover up that preceeded it.

I hear ya...but I have seen first hand how the All Weather mat can absolutely jam the pedal. The sad thing is, many of the complaints are coming from people with no mats in the car at all.

I did see one this week that was a fatality. The really sad thing, in a 2009 Camry the owner had the stock carpet and a aftermarket mat stacked on top.

[monza]

Originally Posted by musclecarjohn

I'd be willing to lay odds it's an electrical issue and not the pedal assembly,just like it wasn't the floormats like Toyota wanted you to believe.

Give it time,it'll all come out...

What kind of odds, I might take that bet.

The floormat excuse was weak, but this pedal flaw and explanation seems plausible? If not they are digging a pretty deep hole...


oh... looks like we may need a bookie for the betting

[James OLC]

The inherant flaw to all of these new cars that park themselves, check your blind spots for you and apply the brakes because you're obviously not paying attention is that they rely on a machine (ok - what should be a smart machine) and not good old fashioned driver input and output. The more computerized systems that are integrated into the design of new cars, the more frequent failures of those same systems will become. They aren't fool proof and never can be and unfortunately I think that this is just the tip of the iceburg - for Toyota and everyone else.

If this is, to some extent, a software issue (as I understand it may be with the new prius's) then is should not be a tough fix. If I understand correctly, the factory Ford drive by wire is triple redundant - something like that should be an easy to incorporate solution. If however, the answer is IF speed >30 AND brake = yes THEN throttle = idle then the issue in not software - it's a hardare bandage (and a big difference from John's Ford example of IF fault THEN idle - which seems like a logical path). I know that I for one wouldn't want to drive something that cut my throttle if I hit the brakes just because of my speed.

I don't know if the truth will ever come out on this one - it's become something else entirely in a lot of ways - but it does make you think a bit about how much control we give or are prepared to give to a computer...

[chr2002ca]

And if you're driving a 2010 Toyota Prius, then you might have problems stopping according to the latest new article today. Combine the WOT problem with this latest brake problem and you could be in for one hell of a ride on a bumpy road. Not that I mind seeing a Prius totaled, I just feel bad for the drivers.

Serves 'em right for using freakin' software to control the brakes.