With more PT cars being tracked is it changing PT vendors product offerings?

[70rs]

Originally Posted by Stuart Adams

The thing I've noticed in the last couple years are the large increases in hp in the cars now, while keeping the weight ratio low. IMO 600hp is the low end and 700-800 will be the norm, if you want to compete. Especially at places like Pahrump.

The LS motors have been a big improvement.

Not to argue against your comment, but how much power can really be used in a PT car that is done right. (good suspension, tires, brakes...)
What is the limit of useful power? The limits come into play with traction of course. And there is a big difference between the auto x course and open track too. I assume an open track event might be able to use more power and help, but that at the auto x too much power might be tough to manage unless you want to go drifting. ??

I ask because I am shooting for about 500-550 hp and my car will be 90% street driven. But it will have a very good suspension system, brakes and tires too. I figured the HP goals I have in mind would be more than enough and too much more might just be wasted.

Your thoughts? Any ones thoughts?

Thanks for any input on this. Just something I had been thinking about.

[Ron in SoCal]

Originally Posted by 70rs

Not to argue against your comment, but how much power can really be used in a PT car that is done right. (good suspension, tires, brakes...)
What is the limit of useful power? The limits come into play with traction of course. And there is a big difference between the auto x course and open track too. I assume an open track event might be able to use more power and help, but that at the auto x too much power might be tough to manage unless you want to go drifting. ??

I ask because I am shooting for about 500-550 hp and my car will be 90% street driven. But it will have a very good suspension system, brakes and tires too. I figured the HP goals I have in mind would be more than enough and too much more might just be wasted.

Your thoughts? Any ones thoughts?

Thanks for any input on this. Just something I had been thinking about.

Hey Eric...I agree somewhat. IMHO, today's designs support about 650 to the rear wheels in most track events on first gens. This goes to Skip's early supposition that PT cars are getting more track serious as R&D cycles progress. I took one look at Todd's spinout at Spring Mtn (I think), and made that call. Further, I'm just a hobbiest. I don't have a race team nor a budget to support full time racing (but wouldn't that be fun), so I'm building a street use car that is track capable. If I had unlimited resources I'd build a car like Jackass, but I don't so I'll get my car done with around 500 RWHP and do a motor upgrade as phase two to try and get to 600+...

Ron

[70rs]

Originally Posted by flash911

Hey Eric...I agree somewhat. IMHO, today's designs support about 650 to the rear wheels in most track events on first gens. This goes to Skip's early supposition that PT cars are getting more track serious as R&D cycles progress. I took one look at Todd's spinout at Spring Mtn (I think), and made that call. Further, I'm just a hobbiest. I don't have a race team nor a budget to support full time racing (but wouldn't that be fun), so I'm building a street use car that is track capable. If I had unlimited resources I'd build a car like Jackass, but I don't so I'll get my car done with around 500 RWHP and do a motor upgrade as phase two to try and get to 600+...

Ron

Hi Ron,
I agree on the R&D comment too. And I see more products all the time that APPEAR to be geared more on the performance side of the fence. Like you I am just a hobbiest and have to make the best of what I have and even though the car will be really nice and very capable it will still be full of compromise compared to a track only car. I need it to perform everywhere and over a very wide spectrum. A full tilt track car would suck on the street IMO. But then again that is the cool thing about these cars, getting the max level of performance we can and still be able to live with them on the road.
That is where I see the parts manufacturers heading within this portion of the car hobby. More and more people want performance but still do not want to give up comfort and style.

[rogue]

Originally Posted by 70rs

Not to argue against your comment, but how much power can really be used in a PT car that is done right. (good suspension, tires, brakes...)
What is the limit of useful power? The limits come into play with traction of course. And there is a big difference between the auto x course and open track too. I assume an open track event might be able to use more power and help, but that at the auto x too much power might be tough to manage unless you want to go drifting. ??

I ask because I am shooting for about 500-550 hp and my car will be 90% street driven. But it will have a very good suspension system, brakes and tires too. I figured the HP goals I have in mind would be more than enough and too much more might just be wasted.

Your thoughts? Any ones thoughts?

Thanks for any input on this. Just something I had been thinking about.

HP has nothing to do with being fast. You realize this when you're passed by a spec miata or boxster. Its all driver.

A key fact most pro-touring folks forget. Hence many cars being driven by other drivers and not the owners.

In the track community you'll hear stories about stock looking subarus and occasionally oddball cars like mazda speeds showing up to track events and dominating the entire field. Why? not power, its the driver, and the driver knows the car.

[Ron in SoCal]

Originally Posted by rogue

HP has nothing to do with being fast. You realize this when you're passed by a spec miata or boxster. Its all driver.

A key fact most pro-touring folks forget. Hence many cars being driven by other drivers and not the owners.

In the track community you'll hear stories about stock looking subarus and occasionally oddball cars like mazda speeds showing up to track events and dominating the entire field. Why? not power, its the driver, and the driver knows the car.

Now you see Dane, why I offered to drive you down to RTTC? I was gonna pick your brain on track set up for an hour each way...

[rogue]

Originally Posted by flash911

Now you see Dane, why I offered to drive you down to RTTC? I was gonna pick your brain on track set up for an hour each way...

I have yet to receive a refund, so technically I'm not out yet. Even though I can barely stand up to pee

I may pull a Steve Rupp and bring a ringer to drive my car.

[Stuart Adams]

Of course with all the supension upgrades we have now, more hp can be used to push them upgrades harder and have more fun.

[tones2SS]

Originally Posted by Stuart Adams

Of course with all the supension upgrades we have now, more hp can be used to push them upgrades harder and have more fun.

I agree Stuart. It's like having a ton of power WITH the ability to control that power a lot more because of the killer upgrades to suspension, front and rear.

[fleet]

With the recent popularity of pro-touring events like the Motor State Challenge and The Optima shootout, to name just a few, do you think the focus of many in progress builds have changed with the success of these events?

[Stuart Adams]

Yeah more power, wider tires, better suspension pieces precisely tuned for that car.