Camaro LT5

[Ketzer]

Originally Posted by clill

Apparently


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This is very awesomesauce....

[JD67SS]

Originally Posted by Ketzer

This is very awesomesauce....

Awesome as it stands right now... please don’t paint it white

[thedugan]

Mark, a lot of people with supercharged motors run hydro boost setups or now the huge electric masters. You look to be using the DSE booster and master setup. How do you make that work with all of the track driving you do and having vacuum for the brakes? The reason I ask is I don't want to use a hydro boost or an electric master on my future procharger setup. Want to stick with my DSE setup.

[Stielow]

Originally Posted by thedugan

Mark, a lot of people with supercharged motors run hydro boost setups or now the huge electric masters. You look to be using the DSE booster and master setup. How do you make that work with all of the track driving you do and having vacuum for the brakes? The reason I ask is I don't want to use a hydro boost or an electric master on my future procharger setup. Want to stick with my DSE setup.

I have run normal brake boosters on all my projects. I have never had an issue, but I’m not a left foot braker. If you like to drive 2 footed, one foot on the gas and one foot on the brake pedal I could see a use case where you could deplete the vacuum in the booster.

I have driven turbo cars and have left foot braked. You can deplete the vacuum in the booster very easily.

I have never used or driven a vehicle with a ProCharger. My applications have been positive displacement blowers. When you drop throttle they immediately build vacuum. I also have not run wild camshafts that do build vacuum at idle.

Also it depends on if you are DI or PFI.

Sorry for the long reply. So the short answer is it depends on your set up.

On a side note I have driven hydraulic brake boosters on police cars on track. The brake feel was poor but that was 10 years ago.

Mark


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[srode1]

You brought up the PCV topic in the Hobbs camaro build but I didn't want to ask the question about your system on the LT5 there and corrupt that build conversation, so I'll ask it here. Other than the vent on your oil tank on that build, what did you do if anything to modify the stock PCV system on this engine? And for the oil tank, did you use the air inlet tube as a source of clean air for that side?

[Cramer4918]

Just power read through the entire thread over two days!

Mark - such an awesome build with tremendous attention to detail! You and Matt at Sled Alley have skills and knowledge I can only dream to achieve.

I appreciate the fact that you share so many details and information regarding your builds. I have taken many ideas from this thread alone and hope to apply them to my build. Thank you for sharing it with us.

How many miles have you been able to log on it? Any track time to test all the cooling improvements?

[Stielow]

Originally Posted by srode1

You brought up the PCV topic in the Hobbs camaro build but I didn't want to ask the question about your system on the LT5 there and corrupt that build conversation, so I'll ask it here. Other than the vent on your oil tank on that build, what did you do if anything to modify the stock PCV system on this engine? And for the oil tank, did you use the air inlet tube as a source of clean air for that side?

Sorry for the delayed reply. I will say "This is what has worked for me". Not saying it is the only way to go but so far it has worked well.

After a few iterations on dry sump tanks we landed on the system that is on Apex.

A modified Peterson tank that tucks into the cowl of the car, it hold about 10 quarts of oil. I vent out of the valve covers with 2 -8AN lines that tee together to a -10 AN line. That vent line goes to the top of the dry sump tank. There is a little effort inside of the tank to get most of the oil out of the air.

A -10 AN vent line then leaves the dry sump tank to a air oil separator. I like the Mann and Hummel ones. The Mann and Hummel air oil separator has a nice filter in it.

https://crossfilters.com/products/ma...40192589627582

I connect a drain line from the bottom of the air oil separator to return and oil back to the dry sump tank. The drain line has a very low pressure check valve in it. The line need to return to the dry sump tank below the running oil level. The "Clean Air" vent line then connects to the inlet air tub where it is vented to atmosphere, but can suck in clean filtered air. The vent line should go in the air tube after the MAF sensor.

I have done this set up on 3 cars now. If you can keep the oil temp down to about 270F while running on track I have had no issue. Engine bay is clean and dry.

I know it is a bit of messing around, but so far it has worked great with zero oil pressure drop outs and no oil going into the engine.

[Blown353]

Originally Posted by thedugan

Mark, a lot of people with supercharged motors run hydro boost setups or now the huge electric masters. You look to be using the DSE booster and master setup. How do you make that work with all of the track driving you do and having vacuum for the brakes? The reason I ask is I don't want to use a hydro boost or an electric master on my future procharger setup. Want to stick with my DSE setup.

While I'm not Mark, GM does use an auxiliary electric vacuum pump on the ATS-V to supplement vacuum for the brake booster when the engine is under boost... it works great. There's a vacuum sensor right at the inlet of the brake booster and the ECM will cycle the auxiliary electric pump as needed if the brake booster vacuum drops while the engine is under boost, something which can happen if you're a heavy left foot braker.

The factory electric vacuum pump on the ATS-V is made by Hella, and they're obviously OEM quality and reliable. Hella makes several vacuum pumps with different volumes and duty cycles; many hybrid cars use them as well as the sole source of brake booster vacuum when the car is running in straight EV mode.

The ones I've had very good luck with is Hella # 8TG-012-377-701, it's one of the heavier duty, higher volume, higher duty cycle pumps for hybrids and the like. The one GM used on the ATS-V is a much lower volume, lower duty cycle unit only meant to supplant engine vacuum very occasionally, and the OEM ECM has some logic to limit the vacuum pump duty cycle to prevent overheating it. I've used the larger, higher duty cycle 8TG-012-377-701 on both turbo cars and cars with big cams and poor idle vacuum and also on a couple of rock crawlers where guys didn't want to use a hydroboost but also where losing vacuum to their power brakes would be a real problem if the engine died while all crossed up on some rocks. They pull vacuum very quickly, are quiet while doing so, and are very reliable.

[thedugan]

Originally Posted by Blown353

While I'm not Mark, GM does use an auxiliary electric vacuum pump on the ATS-V to supplement vacuum for the brake booster when the engine is under boost... it works great. There's a vacuum sensor right at the inlet of the brake booster and the ECM will cycle the auxiliary electric pump as needed if the brake booster vacuum drops while the engine is under boost, something which can happen if you're a heavy left foot braker.

The factory electric vacuum pump on the ATS-V is made by Hella, and they're obviously OEM quality and reliable. Hella makes several vacuum pumps with different volumes and duty cycles; many hybrid cars use them as well as the sole source of brake booster vacuum when the car is running in straight EV mode.

The ones I've had very good luck with is Hella # 8TG-012-377-701, it's one of the heavier duty, higher volume, higher duty cycle pumps for hybrids and the like. The one GM used on the ATS-V is a much lower volume, lower duty cycle unit only meant to supplant engine vacuum very occasionally, and the OEM ECM has some logic to limit the vacuum pump duty cycle to prevent overheating it. I've used the larger, higher duty cycle 8TG-012-377-701 on both turbo cars and cars with big cams and poor idle vacuum and also on a couple of rock crawlers where guys didn't want to use a hydroboost but also where losing vacuum to their power brakes would be a real problem if the engine died while all crossed up on some rocks. They pull vacuum very quickly, are quiet while doing so, and are very reliable.

Great info. I don't want to hijack Mark's LT5 thread which I kinda did. It might be worth its own thread under brakes on how it works, wired, what to use, etc. Sounds like an excellent option for us boosted guys.