Popular Hot Rodding ...

[Hdesign]

PHR is the only mag that I continually renew. The features cars, tech articles and vendors that advertise in there are great. I catch a lot less typos too.

Now, as long as it avoids becoming another 69 Camaro flooded magazine I'll keep reading. That's the primary reason I'm dumping Super [Camaro]...errr Chevy. There are so many awesome cars that get totally ignored. Granted, there was the feature on "unsung heroes" last year in PHR. I want to see more Buicks, Olds and Mercurys!

[Steve1968LS2]

Originally Posted by Hdesign

Now, as long as it avoids becoming another 69 Camaro flooded magazine I'll keep reading. That's the primary reason I'm dumping Super [Camaro]...errr Chevy. There are so many awesome cars that get totally ignored. Granted, there was the feature on "unsung heroes" last year in PHR. I want to see more Buicks, Olds and Mercurys!

You can really only blame the guys that build the cars.. We constantly beg for different cars and when we find them we run them..

Alcinos Mustang II
The orange Torino
The '73 Chevelle
67? Barracuda
and that Cougar we did

Actually, compared to finding a '69 Camaro, it's even hard to find a '67 or '68.. I think there's a Cutlass comming up in one on the newer issues. It's also hard to find a Ford that isn't a Mustang.. lol

[Hdesign]

I know what you mean Steve. Maybe I should just crank out a bunch more "alternative car" renderings to generate some excitement...oh yeah, Kris already did that 6 months ago. I guess I'm SOL for now!

It's not that I don't love 69 Camaros or 70 Chevelles, it's just that absolutely everyone has them or wants to build them....I blame Chevy for building them so damn well and so freakin good looking!

You can cover my 70 Nova whenever my wife shortens my "honey-do" list and lets me get in the garage and finish the damn thing!

[Stuart Adams]

Kris, so your saying the GM rendering your doing is your copyright?

[Kris Horton]

You're splitting hairs Stuart. I'd say I'm copyrighting the image, not the car. Why didn't you address the other artists? Why'd you single me out? I'm not the only artist to ever copyright work, I'm just protecting myself. I could have called foul on several occasions, but I don't. The only time I REALLY have a reason to bring up the copyright is when my work is used without permission (like that polish box that Bill found at Kragen.) Nothing ever came of that case, in fact the lawyer ended up screwing me out of about $1000, but what I learned from that experience was to place a copyright on my work so that I can protect myself when my work is being stolen.

[Stuart Adams]

So let see if I understand. I must be from the good old boy school. When I send you pictures of my car and you do a rendring of what I want, then now that is your copyright and you can sell or give those images to someone for your profit or for your own good. For an old fart like me, it doesn't sit well when the words like copyright, mine, my advertsising, etc are used around doing renderings of our cars. Now if you create something that is your idea from scratch, then I can see your point. Maybe I'm way off base, if so fill me in.

[Hdesign]

Artwork of cars is a complicated thing considering you're basically interpreting a copyrighted design of a car designed by a manufacturer. If you throw a Chevy bowtie on the rendering or use a copyrighted name to make money, you're actually asking for a legal battle if someone wants to be a real jerk. I suppose most of the people at GM for or DaimlerChrysler that see our work are saying, "cool rendering, that really sheds a positive light on our product". They [probably] don't care to get a lawyer involved to squeeze money out of the people who help to generate excitement about their heritage or current product line.

As far as our artwork being copyrighted, yeah, it should be. As I said, it is an artistic interpretation of a product. Whether it's cars, toasters, lampshades or fine china. We design the composition, the perspective and lighting so that image becomes OUR work. It's no different than photography. You wouldn't copyright your face if a newspaper photographer took a picture of you and published it in the newspaper. You just sign a release waiver for your name, wait for the paper to come out and brag to all your friends and family [if it's a flattering picture of course].

I didn't hear about Kris' battle with the polish company, but they should have, at the very least, asked his permission. People call me all the time to display my renderings on their websites. I never turn them down and always thank them for asking first. I'm not stupid, I want my stuff everywhere as long as my signature stays on it.

Steve probably knows a hell of a lot more about copyrighting images than I ever will. Maybe he could clear this up. I try to stay as far away from the petty and complicated legal crap as possible.

Stuart: I've asked several of my past clients if I can post their renderings on my site or to make extra prints of it to sell. Granted, I usually change a couple details so it's not exactly their car.

[Stuart Adams]

Ben thanks for the reply. What about this scenario. Client has a rendering done of his car the way the client wants it to look, then the artist sells the rendering for profit without contacting the client?

[Hdesign]

Some people do that, I don't think it's a huge problem but I simply can't afford to get sued by someone who feels slighted. That's why I, personally, think it's best to ask permission; or get written permission to really cover your butt. Whenever I show something on my website that was commissioned by a builder or owner, I note it. Most of the stuff on there now [that's getting kinda old], I did for fun.

Hope I didn't step on any toes here. If I did, Sorry!

[Kris Horton]

No toes stepped on here Ben, your input is greatly appreciated. It's such a damned touchy subject and there are so many factors. It's just as easy for a customer to turn around and sell your artwork if they have a hard copy file for posters. I don't print any of my stuff in-house yet, so all of the posters I render for people I let them go ahead and have someone of their choosing print for them. That takes a lot of the control out of my hands, but so far most everyone I've worked with have been pretty stand-up guys, so I haven't had much cause to worry. I'd worry more so that the value of the work is dilluted if too many prints are made, but that's not that big of an issue. Spread the wealth I guess. Anyway, I think we should get back on topic... which was "PHR = "