Radiant heat garage floor - retrofit??

[Sparks67]

Originally Posted by DBasher

Radiant wall heaters would be a good option for someone with a completed garage. I'm at a building now with the old wall radiators. Boiler tripped and shut off 3 days ago, now that it's fixed it's bringing everything back up to temperature pretty quick...I'll go lay on the floor and see how it feels.

Dan

So after 4hrs it went from 41 to 56 degrees. Not bad for an old set up that once burned coal than oil and now gas...

Actually, they are not good option. I spoke with my plumbing contractor which is a friend of mine and he has installed them, and the radiant wall heaters are better if you are building a new garage with insulation. The infrared radiant tube heaters can be installed in any building/garage. A friend has them installed in his shop that was built in late 1890's.

[GregWeld]

The problem with infrared heaters that glo red hot is that they also heat you... and I don't know about how you guys feel but when I'm working on stuff I don't like to be heated... I want to work in a warm vs cold environment. So placement of this type of heating is really important. Think sitting in a restaurant with a infrared heater too close to you...

When my shed gets past 70* I open a door if I'm doing anything 'active'. It's just too warm to work. I also think below 60* is just as uncomfortable.

I wanted to use heated floors in the shed but it got too complicated with the city codes. Weird codes which had NOTHING to do with a closed hot water heating system... but that's a whole different discussion.

If I wasn't going to heat the shed 24/7 I'd use Natural gas style heat - they heat air quickly and can bring the space up to temp pretty quickly... They're compact and don't require ducting etc. They also recover quickly if you open the garage doors etc to do something.

Electric is just too expensive and too slow unless you heat 24/7 so they're ineffective.

The other thing a guy could do himself is to plumb copper or wirsbo to some water radiator style heaters (around the floor level) and use a hot water tank for the heat source.

just an example of the "tube style" -- there's all kinds of them out there.
http://www.aimradiantheating.com/sto...ment_Only.html

Of course you'd have to have a circulating pump but they're not very expensive and not very big either...

But regardless of what your heat source is -- it's about INSULATION.... and then all heat is BTU's -- and you have to calculate what the building space is going to take.

[DBasher]

The infared gas heaters kick ass for sure and that's one way to go. The radiant heaters are another option for a fully finished and insulated garage like the one being discussed.

As smart as some plumbers are, talking to them about heating is like talking to your electrian about circuit boards and controls. Installing and fully understanding systems are two seperate deals. I'm not a sparky or a turd hurder although I do and have done both more than I've wanted

If it were me, and I had this guys set up, I'd intall two of the radiant tubes and be done with it. Gas already on site and building already insulated, bing, bang, boom.


Dan

[Fluid Power]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

The problem with infrared heaters that glo red hot is that they also heat you... and I don't know about how you guys feel but when I'm working on stuff I don't like to be heated... I want to work in a warm vs cold environment. So placement of this type of heating is really important. Think sitting in a restaurant with a infrared heater too close to you...

When my shed gets past 70* I open a door if I'm doing anything 'active'. It's just too warm to work. I also think below 60* is just as uncomfortable.

I wanted to use heated floors in the shed but it got too complicated with the city codes. Weird codes which had NOTHING to do with a closed hot water heating system... but that's a whole different discussion.

If I wasn't going to heat the shed 24/7 I'd use Natural gas style heat - they heat air quickly and can bring the space up to temp pretty quickly... They're compact and don't require ducting etc. They also recover quickly if you open the garage doors etc to do something.

Electric is just too expensive and too slow unless you heat 24/7 so they're ineffective.

The other thing a guy could do himself is to plumb copper or wirsbo to some water radiator style heaters (around the floor level) and use a hot water tank for the heat source.

just an example of the "tube style" -- there's all kinds of them out there.
http://www.aimradiantheating.com/sto...ment_Only.html

Of course you'd have to have a circulating pump but they're not very expensive and not very big either...

But regardless of what your heat source is -- it's about INSULATION.... and then all heat is BTU's -- and you have to calculate what the building space is going to take.

Greg, the tube style radiant heaters we installed do not glow. Other then the fact that it is warm in the warehouse, you do not even know they are on. You can feel them if you stand directly under them, but they are not like the red hot ones at restaurants that you see or the old style ones that turned bright red when they are on.

Darren

[DBasher]

Greg that's kinda what I'm talking about. Im sure you remember the old cast iron radiators that were used with a hot water loop.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/B-12-32-ECO-...769#vi-content

Good excuse to bring hot water to the shop, next you'll be washing the car with warm water, wet sanding, making your own espresso....

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Fluid Power

Greg, the tube style radiant heaters we installed do not glow. Other then the fact that it is warm in the warehouse, you do not even know they are on. You can feel them if you stand directly under them, but they are not like the red hot ones at restaurants that you see or the old style ones that turned bright red when they are on.

Darren

Good to know.... 'cause I've been under some that would just flat be uncomfortable to work around. And they seem to be an ON or OFF kind of heat.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by DBasher

Greg that's kinda what I'm talking about. Im sure you remember the old cast iron radiators that were used with a hot water loop.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/B-12-32-ECO-...769#vi-content

Good excuse to bring hot water to the shop, next you'll be washing the car with warm water, wet sanding, making your own espresso....

EXACTLY.... Get yourself a 200 gallon Nat Gas hot water tank -- and plumb it up!

[Fluid Power]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

Good to know.... 'cause I've been under some that would just flat be uncomfortable to work around. And they seem to be an ON or OFF kind of heat.

The ones we installed are incredibly efficient. They draw cold outside air and vent out the roof. No exposed flame. They are on a programmable thermostat. We let the warehouse cool off to 55 over night and then heat the warehouse to 65 during the day. Once it is at 65* The first stage burner is the only burner that comes on to keep it warm. If we crank it up to 75* both burners kick in and warm the space up quickly. If the over head door is open for delivery's, (twice a day at least) the warehouse does not cool off since everything in the space is 65*! Nothing worse than working in my shop at home and have the heater running and it is nice and toasty and then grab a wrench (or get on the floor) and have the tools feel like it is 25*!

Darren

[Garage Dog 65]

Originally Posted by Fluid Power

The ones we installed are incredibly efficient.

Darren

Hey Darren, can ya hit us with a link to those please. Thx !



Jim

[Sparks67]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

The problem with infrared heaters that glo red hot is that they also heat you... and I don't know about how you guys feel but when I'm working on stuff I don't like to be heated... I want to work in a warm vs cold environment. So placement of this type of heating is really important. Think sitting in a restaurant with a infrared heater too close to you...

When my shed gets past 70* I open a door if I'm doing anything 'active'. It's just too warm to work. I also think below 60* is just as uncomfortable.

There is different brands, but Modine and Detroit Radiant tube heaters don't glow red. They are low intensity infrared heaters. Which are sealed units. They are vented to the outside. Which make it perfect for garages, body shops, and most buildings. My friend's dad has been using them since 1990. Typically, he runs his around 55* to 60*, but he has heated it up past that temperature during painting. (The above companies are commercial products, so they go by distributor. Which means they don't have installers. Your local plumbing/heating contractor will be your installer. )

There is another type called High Intensity infrared, which is open flame, and usually a box type unit. So, this is the type that you might be thinking about. Also, Mr. Heater has one for the home garage. The biggest problem with them, is that unit is not vented. So, you will about pass out on the floor.

Jeff

Garage Dog 65 here is the links, but your local plumbing/heating contractor will do the installing, and he can get the units at a discount.

http://www.ultimategarageheater.com/

http://www.modinehvac.com/v2portal/p...ntent2_013.htm

http://reverberray.com/


Steam heat can be done, but realize that you are heating a 200 gallon water tank. I recently went to tankless water heater for hot water, but not sure it be efficient for the garage. Perhaps Solar instead of natural gas. Just not an option in ohio, because it is overcast. Anyway, Modine has that option too.
(Typically, I see the infrared radiant heaters in body shops. Steam heat might cause rusting of the bare metal parts on the car.)