Thoughts on the FAST Ez-EFI system?? - Page 16 - Lateral-g Forums

**GregWeld** · #**151** 03-23-2011, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camcojb

I think what Eddie was referring to was how much time it can take to tune the transient areas of an EFI system that's not a self-tuning one. I know there's several tables involved on many of these systems, and adjusting one will affect others. There's been many times when I chase my tail for a while before I finally get rid of a small area that's been giving me fits.

You are correct Greg, it is a tuning issue, but one that can be quite tricky with certain combos and systems.

Jody

I think it's a LOFT issue....

On another note -- you going to Del Mar?

**GregWeld** · #**152** 03-23-2011, 08:23 PM

Just a quicky story about EFI installation and the "troubles with EFI" that people rag about all the time...

I dropped off a 383 stroker I'm having built for my brother in laws blown pro street Camaro at a shop that are all friends of mine. They have two EFI jobs - one a buddy/customers 8 stack EFI with EZ EFI - the other a 306 Ford in the owners Ranchero with the complete EZ EFI throttle body etc.

They're having "issues" with both cars... the 8 stack will fire and run - pig fat - and then dies when the plugs finally foul out. Blowing black smoke -- etc.

The Ford won't idle worth a dang - surging - dies when put in gear - and is just generally unhappy.

The installer is telling me that the IAC is 'bad' and this and that and the other thing -- it was all the "EFI wasn't worth a dang..."

On the 8 stack - Brian Macey (FAST EFI University) finds they have the "default" 74 # injectors selected -- when the car runs 36 #'s.... AND there is no vacuum to the vacuum referenced pressure regulator. DOH! Fix those two issues -- fires right up - idles fine. It's an INSTALL problem - NOT the EZ EFI.

I'm looking at the FORD -- and again - they have chosen poorly on the set up screen.... when they should have just selected the "FAST EZ EFI" - they choose custom set up and put in the wrong injector size. Had they chosen the right EFI system.... it would have known what injectors they are using etc. I input the correct information in the set up after choosing "new base tune"....

I also found that they were trying to do a "work around" in setting the TPS. Since they couldn't get WOT physically - they were setting the TPS throttle closed position - and when the ECU asked for WOT position - they were disconnecting the throttle linkage and opening this by hand. Thus "cheating" the linear setting the ECU was looking for. Then they'd reconnect the linkage... which would pull on the Throttle body at a different rate than the ECU was seeing. I told them - You can't CHEAT.

So when we got those couple of things handled --- I asked about the timing... as it was still surging and died with put in gear (automatic). A timing light showed me 33* at idle with the vacuum hooked as they had installed. Without vacuum - it was at 10*....

A quick check shows me they have the vacuum t'd into the MAP sensor line. DOH! I reconnect this to the PORTED vacuum port.... which drops the timing at idle to the 10* (which I then bumped up to 14*). Motor smoothes right out - and no longer dies when put in gear... and off we drive to do the EZ tune... the owner is THRILLED by the end of the 25 minute drive. The motor purrs... has great throttle response and runs like it should.

The moral of this rant ---- It was all LOFT! And lots of it! It was never the EFI...

eddiep · #**153** 03-23-2011, 11:23 PM

Greg,

Thanks for the explanations. You definitely won't catch me claiming to be the best tuner out there. I enjoy the hell out of the hobby and take pride in doing the work myself, "LOFT" issue or not. At the very least, I can say I treat my fellow enthusiasts with respect (when it's due).

I can also say I've never had to tow my car to someone else for them to tune it for me. Lot of people can't claim that, right?

https://lateral-g.net/forums/show...14&postcount=3

https://lateral-g.net/forums/show...24&postcount=2

I'm glad Bob was able to get you fixed up ... Looks like he saved you a lot of frustration there.

Eddie

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld

I think it's a LOFT issue....

**GregWeld** · #**154** 03-24-2011, 08:55 AM

Eddie -- Good job. And I too am a DIY guy... for most all things. I've been messing with EFI for 12+ years now... and have had more tunes and dyno sessions than I care to remember. I also tune myself.

I was teasing you... don't take it too personally... mostly for the statement about the EFI being the cause of the lean spots.

Here's the problem with a public forum like this. Someone makes a statement like that -- other people read it (so it's not just you and I having a discussion about it) -- and then they take that as "the gospel" and start making the wrong assumptions. This doesn't have to be about EFI - it can be about ride height and coil overs - or some blanket statement about carburetors. The point is - that they read some "problem" and then that becomes the truth about that product. My point was that the problems are generally (almost 100% of the time) NOT the EFI - but the tune or the way it was installed - or something OTHER THAN the actual system they purchased.

I personally can't imagine owning a car without EFI... in whatever form.... and I have heard, and witnessed, all the 'issues' out there. It's these 'issues' that people read or talk about that hold people back from 'seeing the light' and stepping up to EFI...

**GregWeld** · #**155** 03-24-2011, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eddiep

Greg,

Thanks for the explanations. You definitely won't catch me claiming to be the best tuner out there. I enjoy the hell out of the hobby and take pride in doing the work myself, "LOFT" issue or not. At the very least, I can say I treat my fellow enthusiasts with respect (when it's due).

I can also say I've never had to tow my car to someone else for them to tune it for me. Lot of people can't claim that, right?

https://lateral-g.net/forums/show...14&postcount=3

https://lateral-g.net/forums/show...24&postcount=2

I'm glad Bob was able to get you fixed up ... Looks like he saved you a lot of frustration there.

Eddie

Eddie --- Have you had the car on the rollers during a "tune"? Or are you trying to do this all seat of the pants?

**Sieg** · #**156** 03-24-2011, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eddiep

I can also say I've never had to tow my car to someone else for them to tune it for me. Lot of people can't claim that, right?
Eddie

Yeah, but have you ever had to tow it to a gas station?

eddiep · #**157** 03-24-2011, 08:10 PM

Greg,

I hear ya - no worries buddy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld

Eddie -- Good job. And I too am a DIY guy... for most all things. I've been messing with EFI for 12+ years now... and have had more tunes and dyno sessions than I care to remember. I also tune myself.

I was teasing you... don't take it too personally... mostly for the statement about the EFI being the cause of the lean spots.

Here's the problem with a public forum like this. Someone makes a statement like that -- other people read it (so it's not just you and I having a discussion about it) -- and then they take that as "the gospel" and start making the wrong assumptions. This doesn't have to be about EFI - it can be about ride height and coil overs - or some blanket statement about carburetors. The point is - that they read some "problem" and then that becomes the truth about that product. My point was that the problems are generally (almost 100% of the time) NOT the EFI - but the tune or the way it was installed - or something OTHER THAN the actual system they purchased.

I personally can't imagine owning a car without EFI... in whatever form.... and I have heard, and witnessed, all the 'issues' out there. It's these 'issues' that people read or talk about that hold people back from 'seeing the light' and stepping up to EFI...

eddiep · #**158** 03-24-2011, 08:48 PM

Greg,

I've been to the dyno a few times over the years, but 99.9% is done on the street or at the track, laptop on the passenger seat. Best case scenario is a buddy manning the laptop so I don't pass as a drunk driver.

My last car had the original Fast "classic" ECU, which was actually sold by Speed Pro at the time, and my current car is an older Accel Gen 7 that’s upgraded to the 5.5 firmware (sounds like you are familiar with the system). Both systems have widebands and you can get the car driving really well in no time. Maybe I'm a perfectionist, but I've found you can get 95% of the way there in the first hour or so [with the wideband system] where there is no discernable driveability issues ... That last 5% of tweaking takes quite a bit of time, at least for me.

First aftermarket ECU I retrofitted was a Haltech F3 into an early 3rd gen Camaro, back when it was far more popular to take off FI for a carb than vice versa!

Quote:

Originally Posted by GregWeld

Eddie --- Have you had the car on the rollers during a "tune"? Or are you trying to do this all seat of the pants?