Somebody FREAKIN shoot me!!!!

[Sieg]

Originally Posted by bdahlg68

While very indicative of the feelings of lots of people on this board.... not something from Honest Abe's mouth...

http://www.snopes.com/quotes/lincoln/prosperity.asp

Oops! The theory still has merit going forward.

[GregWeld]

Lincoln didn't say it -- but I was thinking it!!!

[Bucketlist2012]

Originally Posted by Sieg

Thought this was worth sharing........

This is what I am talking about....Abe, Thomas Jefferson, and many others knew what not to do and what to do..

Simple principles that if followed, lead to success. If abandoned, they lead to ruin.

[GregWeld]

Found this article by accident ---- and thought it really kind of read along the lines we've been discussing here.... that it's really the REPUBLICAN party that doesn't even understand what it's own people are saying/feeling. Note the IMMIGRATION issue!


Republicans got crushed on the issues, too
By NBC's Mark Murray
Follow @mmurraypolitics

For all the talk about how Mitt Romney and the Republicans lost when it came to demographics, the turnout, and the tactics, the exit polls also show that they lost when it came to the issues.
For years, the GOP has branded itself as the party that supports low taxes (especially for the wealthy) and opposes abortion and gay marriage.
But according to the exit polls from last week’s presidential election, a combined 60% said that tax rates should increase either for everyone or for those making more than $250,000. Just 35% said the tax rates shouldn’t increase for anyone.
What’s more, 59% said that abortion should be legal in all or most cases.
And by a 49%-to-46% margin, voters said that their states should legally recognize same-sex marriage.
Even on comprehensive immigration reform -- a subject that some Republicans (like George W. Bush) once supported, but most no longer do -- 65% said most illegal immigrants should be offered a chance to apply for legal status. (And since the election, GOP senators like Lindsey Graham and John McCain are now signaling renewed support for comprehensive immigration reform.)
The one bright spot for Republicans on the issues: A majority of voters -- 51% -- indicated that the government is doing too many things better left to businesses and the individuals. By comparison, 43% said government should do more to solve problems.
That’s a reversal from 2008, when 51% said the government should do more and 43% said it is doing too much.

[camcojb]

yeah, leave it to the Pubs to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by camcojb

yeah, leave it to the Pubs to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

Well... you're absolutely right!

I know that my 22 year old daughter voted for Obama as did my 24 year old niece -- both of which voted "single issue" items such as abortion. I argued like crazy to get them to approach voting with a "larger view"... but they couldn't get past that single issue. They both felt that the Republican party disrespected woman and thereby also disrespected the Supreme Court.
Both these young ladies were raised in Catholic schools! Which - in their view - was also losing them because of the failure to be drug into the 21st century. LOL


So -- their vote countered Gwen's and my vote... thus the almost 50/50 split of the popular vote.

The Republican party has lost the woman's vote/the latino vote/the african-american vote/the labor vote... What's left? Us old lilly white guys!

[Vegas69]

My 64 year old assistant felt Romney was similar to a cave man in his values and Kelli didn't like his major flip flopping on the issues.

[preston]

Its hard for me to understand someone voting against Romney because of abortion. Do they really think he will somehow get Roe vs. Wade changed ? Is it just the tone ? Is Federal funding a litmus test for them ? I get that on many social issues from local liberals, and its always tough for me to reconcile because electing Pubs won't have any discernable effect on these things. I laughed out loud when the Dems declared "war on women" because it was such a blatant demagogic lie, but they pushed it all the way. Just like they also pushed the theme that Tea Parties were racist and violent, and despite zero evidence, that meme lived on and on. Even my mom (who is 80 and a doctinaire conventional wisdom liberal through and through) had a "no hate for me !" anti-tea party sticker on her car. Mom, I support the tea party 100% !

It just seems like regardless of the issues, the conservatives are fighting a constantly losing battle agains the media machine propaganda. Here we have been talking about the demise of the MM for almost 10 years and it seems like with the declining circulation and profts their voice is more influential than ever. Almost more important than what they talk about is what they don't want us to talk about. They still seem to set the tone of the day, and they are so lopsided. For exapmle, did you see any MM outlet discuss the complete lack of restrictions on the Obama credit card donation website ? Or about the web sites hosting companies connectinos to China ? It jsut seems like if that story came out about a PUb, it would be huge. Same with Benghazi (regardless of your current take). A week before the 2004 election NY Times pushed the Al Qaaqua (whatever) ammo dump story every day for a week, and after wards it completely died. Do you think if Bush was president that they would have had the same page 2 non-stories on Benghazi ?

I had hoped Romney would paint a little bigger picture of conservative vs liberal viewpoint. Sometimes when I talk to lib friends I feel like they have never even really heard the conservative argument except as caricature from the media.

Anyway, we can argue this much govt or that much govt until we're blue in the face, and it is totally irrelevant because the money has run out - argument will be over soon (although these things always take longer than you think, there being "a lot of ruin in a nation" and all that).

WE ARE $16T away from BEING BROKE !


Sorry, I started out (Ithought ) responding to a poitn but just ended up rambling instead.

[realcoray]

Originally Posted by preston

Its hard for me to understand someone voting against Romney because of abortion. Do they really think he will somehow get Roe vs. Wade changed ? Is it just the tone ?

The fact is, presidents themselves have the most capability to get something like RvW changed because they appoint the justices. Not to mention the fact that in numerous republican states, republicans are going out of their way to press the issue with things like forced ultrasounds (and not the abdomen kind) and what not.

It's not a huge leap to think that one of these laws would be challenged and it would end up in the courts lap and they have the capability to shift things.

Republicans come across as terrible stupid as it relates to women. Abortion is a small part of it. You have them hemming and hawing over equal pay for equal work, voting against it, or being completely non committal. You have them being completely stupid about rape, even after like 4 people were destroyed by it, they kept saying the same stupid stuff. It's one thing to believe that being raped and getting pregnant is a gift from god, it's another to say it.

Combine all of that together and it would sure seem like republicans want women to stay at home, barefoot and pregnant, and welp, that's not how most women under 50 see things.

[ironworks]

I really thought this was an interesting article and the comments at the bottom made it the more interesting. The comments at the bottom where made by voters.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/49765349/comid/1#comments_top

Apparently having money and doing whatever you please now days is frowned upon.

Think of all the people employed to build and maintain a 90,000 sq ft house. All the labor and all the material suppliers. So what if you think it's too big and not what you want. I personally like my 1800sq ft house, and could not imagine walking around in a house that big.