1968 Camaro "Badmotorfinger" v2.2

[projectile]

I'm with Todd, a melonized gear is best for the street. If you have time it would be a good idea to sacrifice a bronze gear first. No doubt the cam gear has some scuffing and galling. Running the bronze gear first will help to smooth and "polish" the cam gear before you install that expensive poly gear.I have done it once with success. I am running a bronze gear in my engine. I check it every 2000 miles when i check valve lash. I consider it regular maintenance. I just remove the cap and check the backlash at the distributor rotor. Only works if you dont have the advance mechanism cause of the play it has to the shaft-if that makes sense. Faster than removing the distributor...

[Flash68]

Originally Posted by projectile

I'm with Todd, a melonized gear is best for the street. If you have time it would be a good idea to sacrifice a bronze gear first. No doubt the cam gear has some scuffing and galling. Running the bronze gear first will help to smooth and "polish" the cam gear before you install that expensive poly gear.I have done it once with success. I am running a bronze gear in my engine. I check it every 2000 miles when i check valve lash. I consider it regular maintenance. I just remove the cap and check the backlash at the distributor rotor. Only works if you dont have the advance mechanism cause of the play it has to the shaft-if that makes sense. Faster than removing the distributor...

Thanks Ray -- I do have a little time -- how many miles would you suggest running the bronze gear? (we have the bronze MSD 8471 gear in it right now). There's probably 30 pretty hard miles on it so far with the bronze gear since the switch.

And we also have no advance on it and the dizzy is locked out.

[projectile]

Can't remember, it was 5 years ago. I would guess about 200 miles. Not sure it helped,but the bronze gear had some deep grooves worn in it when i removed it. Gear on billet cam is pretty hard(heat treated i'm sure). I am still running that cam. Let the bronze gear take the abuse for as long as you can without it completely failing of course.
When i install a new gear i check the backlash with a dial indicator and write it down. That way you will have a measurement to compare to as it starts wearing. Save time, i hate pulling the distributor, especially mine with the intake in the way.

[Flash68]

Originally Posted by projectile

Can't remember, it was 5 years ago. I would guess about 200 miles. Not sure it helped,but the bronze gear had some deep grooves worn in it when i removed it. Gear on billet cam is pretty hard(heat treated i'm sure). I am still running that cam. Let the bronze gear take the abuse for as long as you can without it completely failing of course.
When i install a new gear i check the backlash with a dial indicator and write it down. That way you will have a measurement to compare to as it starts wearing. Save time, i hate pulling the distributor, especially mine with the intake in the way.

Cool Ray.. we might just run with this bronze gear then for a bit in the next 2 weeks before we head down south for RTTC... or we may make the trip with it and check it when we get down there. Depending on how it looks, maybe just leave it in. I guess the "safe" and proven route is to run the trip and event with the bronze gear... that's been happening for decades with success right?

Thanks for the tip on the checking the backlash.

P.S. I still really wanna check out your car in person one of these days! You weren't interested in taking it to RTTC? I'm not sure how far you are from Bakersfield, but it'd be cool if you came to meet us and have BBQ on Thurs afternoon before the weekend racing. 3 - 5 pm at the Ironworks shop. Should be a lot of fun.

[GregWeld]

Guys giving advice is all "guessing"....

Listen to Comp Cams not guesses.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Flash68

Thanks -- can you smell that BBQ? Rodger is probably fabbing some crazy custom gusseted BBQ with a blower on it for the meet up.

The boys from the North (EH?) are bringing pizza....

Have you ever been in Canada? I ordered a pepperoni pizza up there once while on the boat... I'm pretty sure it was bologna not pepperoni. The slices were like 4" in diameter... and I've never seen pepperoni that large have you?

PS -- Nothing wrong with a bronze gear. The "wrong gear" would be not checking it for wear on a regular basis. The poly carb gear is just "new tech" and has lots of testing behind it to show that it wears better than bronze... but doesn't mean that it's an install and forget piece either. To me - this is an issue like running a solid lifter motor... every once in awhile you have to run the rack. No biggie it's just maintenance.

I'd be checking the distributor after EVERY track day. That's when oiling is an issue... and it's when you're putting the most stresses on stuff. Takes nothing to pop it out take a peek and stab it back in... and it beats sitting like a FORD on the way home.

I run Pure Power oil filters.... They filter 100% of the oil. They have magnets installed (doesn't help for bronze) and they're cleanable and let me see what's up with every change. In my book $200 is CHEAP for a filter when it's on a motor with a $1000 crank in a $2500 block... Or in Todds case - a $5000 block.

[Flash68]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

Guys giving advice is all "guessing"....

Listen to Comp Cams not guesses.

Originally Posted by GregWeld

The boys from the North (EH?) are bringing pizza....

Have you ever been in Canada? I ordered a pepperoni pizza up there once while on the boat... I'm pretty sure it was bologna not pepperoni. The slices were like 4" in diameter... and I've never seen pepperoni that large have you?

PS -- Nothing wrong with a bronze gear. The "wrong gear" would be not checking it for wear on a regular basis. The poly carb gear is just "new tech" and has lots of testing behind it to show that it wears better than bronze... but doesn't mean that it's an install and forget piece either. To me - this is an issue like running a solid lifter motor... every once in awhile you have to run the rack. No biggie it's just maintenance.

I'd be checking the distributor after EVERY track day. That's when oiling is an issue... and it's when you're putting the most stresses on stuff. Takes nothing to pop it out take a peek and stab it back in... and it beats sitting like a FORD on the way home.

I run Pure Power oil filters.... They filter 100% of the oil. They have magnets installed (doesn't help for bronze) and they're cleanable and let me see what's up with every change. In my book $200 is CHEAP for a filter when it's on a motor with a $1000 crank in a $2500 block... Or in Todds case - a $5000 block.

Rich talked to Comp Cams while I called Lunati... the Comp tech seemed much more on the ball than the Lunati guy I talked to, plus there is much more detail on that Comp poly gear -- as well as lots of opinions out there -- like anything!

No Canada for me yet... curious about this pizza though. No more BBQ?

You're right on the maintenance -- I can't expect a hydraulic roller LSx type experience with a big solid roller high revving gen 1 sbc... gotta be committed to checking things often, esp after hard days on a track. No doubt.

Sounds like a badass filter. Your filter may be worth more than my block.

Hey Todd -- why the deleted post this morning? Were you being mean to Greg again? LOL Spill it!!

[Vegas69]

I was being mean to Greg and figured my advice would fall on deaf ears anway.

[Flash68]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

I was being mean to Greg and figured my advice would fall on deaf ears anway.

Touche..

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

I was being mean to Greg and figured my advice would fall on deaf ears anway.

I didn't get the mean part. Everybody has an opinion and worthy discussion points. It's how someone makes an "informed" decision.

In the end -- none of us really give a crap what he decides to do as long as he's making a best effort, informed choice.

I see three choices:

Melonized

Bronze

Poly Carb

He's doing the right thing by studying the issue - calling manufacturers for their advice - and getting opinions here and anywhere else he can. However, I personally take the advice from the factory boys even if it take a couple calls a couple days apart or I have to "elevate" the discussion. I'd also call an engine builder or two to see if they have any valid thoughts.

This is straight off COMP CAMS website regarding this subject:

What Distributor Gear Should I Use With My Camshaft?


Matching camshaft and distributor gears is one of the most critical, yet often overlooked step in engine assembly. The proper distributor gear for your camshaft differs by both the material and the kind of lifter for which your camshaft was designed. Using the wrong material can lead to premature gear wear, possible camshaft wear and ultimately engine failure.

First off, no steel distributor gear is compatible with both flat tappet and hydraulic roller cams. This is because hydraulic rollers can be made from two possible materials and either of those materials requires a different gear than the flat tappet cam. Regardless, a steel gear is not compatible with a cast iron flat tappet cam.

Distributor Gear Materials:

1. Cast Iron

2. Composite (offers great life, conforms well to the mating cam gear, and is compatible with ANY camshaft gear material)

3. Melonized or hardened steel (material that OEMs use with factory roller cams; many aftermarket distributor manufacturers use these as the default gears for their distributors)

4. Bronze (conforms well to the mating camshaft gear and will not damage the camshaft gear, but it is a self sacrificing gear intended to be used in race applications only and should be replaced about once a year)


If you have a cast iron hydraulic or solid flat tappet cam, your distributor gear options are:

1. Cast iron distributor gear

2. Composite distributor gear


If you have an austempered ductile iron hydraulic or solid roller cam, your two options are:

1. Melonized or hardened steel distributor gear

2. Composite distributor gear


If you have a billet steel hydraulic or solid roller cam, your two options are:

1. Bronze distributor gear

2. Composite distributor gear


COMP Cams® recommends the composite gear because it is compatible with all camshaft gears – flat tappet, austempered cast iron cores, and billet cores. If the steel gear is not hardened, it is not compatible with either of the roller cam types.

Note: If you have an austempered core hydraulic roller cam and a .500” shaft distributor with a steel gear, verify with the manufacturer of the distributor that the steel gear they use is a melonized or hardened steel material and it will work fine.