When does too much Racing influence hurt the Value of a Car

[clill]

Both of you are giving me a headache...

[Van B]

Originally Posted by Stuart Adams

The blue 69 I had was set up just like that car, except for the motor right out of the catalog.

The blue 69 you had? Is it gone already?

[Steve Chryssos]

HE started!

[James OLC]

Originally Posted by streetfytr68

I think you are hyper-analyzing the subject, Ty. You can't do that with a hot rod. One might be inclined to combine 1 and 2.
In most cases, classification is a pendulum. Car A might lean towards the race side of the equation while car B might lean towards the street side of the equation.

Agreed

[10Seconds]

Originally Posted by tyoneal

To All:

I'll try to firm this up a bit. Based on your input. (Pre 1976 Car allow a lot of leeway with the engines used on the cars)

There are "2 Types of Pro Touring Cars"

1) Racing Styles of Pro Touring Cars

An older (car prior to 1976) custom race car built to be run on the street, "Legally", but can also drive safely on multiple racetracks. Specific racing classes are not part of a Pro-touring cars, however some are designed to emulate specific Road Racing classes of the past, that help improve the overall theme and feel of the cars.

2) Street Styles of Pro Touring Cars

Cars (Originally built prior to 1976) that have conveniences normally associated with street only driven cars (a/c, P/S, P/B, Tilt Wheel, Carpet, comfortable seats etc.) However, these cars will also have successfully implemented many facets of racing technology. (Race inspired suspensions, brakes, engines etc.) The two technologies are balanced in an effort to create a comfortable fast and well handling sports car.

....

Let me know where I'm wrong.

Thanks,

Ty

You analysis is inherently flawed. You state there are only two type of PT cars. Yet, according to you, both type exclude makes build after 1976.

Where did you come up with pre-1976? That's B.S. IMO. So my 1978 Trans Am can't be a PT car?

[tyoneal]

Originally Posted by streetfytr68

I think you are hyper-analyzing the subject, Ty. You can't do that with a hot rod. One might be inclined to combine 1 and 2.
In most cases, classification is a pendulum. Car A might lean towards the race side of the equation while car B might lean towards the street side of the equation.

=================================
Steve the reason I chose to look at the Pro Touring cars this way is because it seams that Ford (Cobra vs. LV? Model) Both could get many of the same major options.

GM Camaro Z/28 all the way down to the straight six. (Also for a while a Berliinetta)

GM Firebird: Trans AM, Formula, Firebird, Skybird

Corvette: Std vs. Z06 )I would believe different demographics as well.

Most of the Cars are grouped into at least 2 Segaments. The first segment is a more Racing Oriented model. Much more wild graphics, different exhaust note, wider wheels etc.

The second segment is toned down a fair amount visually, and in most cases some of the performance is toned down as well. That said it is also possible in many instances that the same engine and drive train can be had in the more subdued second style.

You can follow this same thing down many car lines all the way down to the economy version of the same body style.

There is enough data just on this website dealing with the 1st Generation Camaro's to to start seeing trends between the build I listed above, and, all of these are Hot Rods of one kind of another.

I will admit there is some gray involved.

From my perspective it appears that all the "Top" cars are slowly moving toward the "Race Car", side of the equation anyway, due to the fact of the technology being available to the aftermarket. Electronics, both in gauge technology, Track and car monitoring options. (Data Accumulation that would normally be found on a race car only a few years ago). Carbon Fiber used in Body Panels, engine parts, structural parts etc. Multiple 3 piece wheel options, Suspension offerings of all types that would normally be associated with Road Racing Applications.

The big difference between them is the presentation of the car.

Does this make sense?

Now would it be safe to say as long as the car has a good fit and finish and good parts, that it should bring a comparable valuation?

Ty

[tyoneal]

Originally Posted by 10Seconds

You analysis is inherently flawed. You state there are only two type of PT cars. Yet, according to you, both type exclude makes build after 1976.

Where did you come up with pre-1976? That's B.S. IMO. So my 1978 Trans Am can't be a PT car?

==================================
That is a good question, but one I did on purpose. Much of what makes these cars special is the ability to put any engine with any modification into it and still pass emissions for being, "Street Legal". That is the ONLY reason I did this because a PT car Has to be Street Legal, and having a PT car where you were unable to do anything substantial to the engine would put it at a substantial disadvantage. It wasn't meant as a personal thing, only a way of pairing down the types of cars that would be unlimited vs the ones that are not. Believe me, had I had a good example of a 1977-78 Trans Am 4sp. available and a few sheckles in my pocket, I would buy that puppy in a minute. One of my favorite cars of all time.

Please don't take offense, I promise none was intended. It was put in because of the Feds and no other reason.

I hope this helps, until they feds make it legal for pre 1980 cars to be unlimited, unfortunately I don't think it is a fair comparison for you at the time.

Ty

[tyoneal]

Originally Posted by streetfytr68

I think you are hyper-analyzing the subject, Ty. You can't do that with a hot rod. One might be inclined to combine 1 and 2.
In most cases, classification is a pendulum. Car A might lean towards the race side of the equation while car B might lean towards the street side of the equation.

============================
Steve:

Lets work with your statement, and put both cars into one category. Which car and why would bring the most money given each of them have a similar amount of money well spent on each of them?

Would a "Racing Style" 100k Pro touring Car bring more money than a 100k "Street Style" Pro Touring Car? and if so why?

My gut would tell me that they should be the same, however, I tend to like the Racing Style cars, so I would probably lean in that direction over the other one all things being considered.

Would this line of thinking fall in line with your thinking? If so, what % of People would you guess that would prefer one or the other? (I've seen a couple of the Trans AM style Penske 69 Camaro's. I think they are really striking and cool) Others might see them as to flashy.

I always dreamed (Since I was a little kid) of driving a race car on the street. ;-)

What can I say, "Boys and their Toys."

Ty

[Cread01]

Originally Posted by tyoneal

==================================

Please don't take offense, I promise none was intended. It was put in because of the Feds and no other reason.

I hope this helps, until they feds make it legal for pre 1980 cars to be unlimited, unfortunately I don't think it is a fair comparison for you at the time.

Ty

when you say fed's you must mean the state where you live and not the federal government. In my state there aren't emissions laws to that extent so my 78 is street legal where in cali it wouldn't be.

no offense taken.... just stating

[clill]

Race cars are usually worth a fraction of what it costs to build them so if you build a race car, barely make it street legal and call it Pro-Touring I don't think you will get near as much as a street built Pro-Touring car that can also hold it's own at the track.