Nissan GTR vs LS7/LS9 1st Gen

[clill]

I own two Stielow built Camaro's. Jackass has a LS9 tweaked and Mayhem has a 427 LS9 on Steroids. I also own a 2011 Porsche Turbo S. Neither of those cars will beat the Turbo S and both cost more than the Turbo S. The Turbo S will run 10.70's all day long with my Mom driving it if she were still alive. A million factors, weight, aero, traction control etc make it very hard for one of our old cars to all around compete with the top modern stuff.

[James OLC]

Originally Posted by 57hemicuda

In the end, you can't beat modern technology, and aerodynamics. I remember talking to Mark before Optima, when the Red car and Danny Popp in the white C6 were going to throw down. Remember saying physics are a bitch, can't throw a ball as easy or acurate as you can a dart. Still nothing cooler then old iron that performs almost as well, and takes the win from time to time. Much rather watch a vintage car run a road course then any new car.

That's really the point of all of this. Last year at OLOA there were six of us in Vintage American plus a Factory 5 Daytona coupe and they ran us as on run group whenever they could. I don't know how many people were on the fence cheering for the GTRs but I do know that when Vintage was running everyone who wasn't racing was there, cheering us on. It was really cool and most folks remarked that it was something that you just never see and may never see again. That's the reward at the end of the day.

[Vegas69]

Good discussion.... They are completely different trips no matter how you slice it. If you want easy, comfortable, and reliable, go buy a car that everybody and his Mom can own. If you want something unique, raw, and cool, build a PT car. Just don't expect anywhere close to the refinement that millions of dollars of engineering nets you in a factory piece. It's really all subjective. What you think is suitable is ridiculous to the next guy. It plays out on this board constantly. You see Darrel and his other brother Darrel building race cars. (Dave & Rob) Then you see guys like Stielow and Jay in New Hampshire building super nice and refined PT cars. If I was to have another PT car, I'd choose the latter. Otherwise, I'd just build a race car.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by clill

I own two Stielow built Camaro's. Jackass has a LS9 tweaked and Mayhem has a 427 LS9 on Steroids. I also own a 2011 Porsche Turbo S. Neither of those cars will beat the Turbo S and both cost more than the Turbo S. The Turbo S will run 10.70's all day long with my Mom driving it if she were still alive. A million factors, weight, aero, traction control etc make it very hard for one of our old cars to all around compete with the top modern stuff.

Good points Charley.....


I've said it before on here - I've tracked the R8 and the Mustang.... I'll take the Mustang all day every day. The R8 was boring. Lovely... and all that... but boring.

[Flash68]

Originally Posted by ill steez

A Camaro like Big Red would probably "beat" a GT-R in a question of pure performance, but it's really not "beating" the GT-R with all things considered.

Big Red is THE Camaro but it would win 1 out of 20 individual events/competitions against a bone stock GTR, unfortunately.

Originally Posted by Vegas69

It's really all subjective. What you think is suitable is ridiculous to the next guy.

THIS the pure beauty of it all.

Queue the ironic contradiction and the foreshadowing.

Originally Posted by Vegas69

It's really all subjective. What you think is suitable is ridiculous to the next guy. It plays out on this board constantly. You see Darrel and his other brother Darrel building race cars. (Dave & Rob) Then you see guys like Stielow and Jay in New Hampshire building super nice and refined PT cars. If I was to have another PT car, I'd choose the latter. Otherwise, I'd just build a race car.

Many people are still really enjoying (and ) trying to build something that is a balance of both and that really only makes sense in their eyes. Or not.

Todd, you built a slow PT car once already. Do something different would ya?

Agreed - good discussion for the most part.

[Flash68]

Originally Posted by 57hemicuda

Much rather watch a vintage car run a road course then any new car.

Originally Posted by GregWeld

I've said it before on here - I've tracked the R8 and the Mustang.... I'll take the Mustang all day every day. The R8 was boring. Lovely... and all that... but boring.

You guys are pretty smart.

[fleetus macmullitz]

I hope PT cars and some of those ponycar race cars out there start incorporating easy to use in car 'voice to text' systems.

[Sieg]

Originally Posted by clill

I own two Stielow built Camaro's. Jackass has a LS9 tweaked and Mayhem has a 427 LS9 on Steroids. I also own a 2011 Porsche Turbo S. Neither of those cars will beat the Turbo S and both cost more than the Turbo S. The Turbo S will run 10.70's all day long with my Mom driving it if she were still alive. A million factors, weight, aero, traction control etc make it very hard for one of our old cars to all around compete with the top modern stuff.

Over the course of a year when you're in the mood to go on a spirited drive which car gets driven the most?

[mikespeed95]

FWIW

Every geek with money has a GT-R. They're boring, senseless, have no character, and are cookie-cutter cutting edge engineering.

Imagine you are 9 years old at cars and coffee. Do you like the awesome Camaro with all the custom stuff, or the GT-R that looks like the 30 other black-editions with a bunch of nerds with square rim glasses and Tony&Guy haircuts?

We have a lot of clients at my work that have GT-R's and it's the same thing, they're bored with driving a computer.

[ArisESQ]

Originally Posted by James OLC

If you know anything about me you know that Big Red is one of my favourite cars and a strong influence on my build back in the day. Big Red could beat a GTR in top speed (the fastest GTR that I personally know of maxed out at 203 in the mile whereas Big Red has gone 234 in the mile and a half) but that would have to be your only metric. Unless you want to suggest Big Red could beat the GTR in top speed with it's current gearing and setup, could beat the GTR in acceleration with a change in rear end and suspension, could beat the GTR with an engine and transmission and rear end change on the road course, and could be the GTR on the autocross with a slightly newer version of the car provided that the GTR was stock and couldn't change anything but tire pressure.

Right - but I'm not specifically using Big Red as THE one and only car, I'm suggesting it as an example of what is possible.

My point is that you can take literally ANY car, and through money, time, and a whole lot of work, build it to do X better than a new performance car - but that in the big picture, it isn't really comparable.

If I had the money and knowledge, I'd be willing to bet that I could build up 96' Caprice to spank a stock 911 Turbo around Laguna Seca. It wouldn't even be remotely streetable, and would probably resemble a NASCAR with doors, but my point is that I could do it at a very significant compromise and cost. Lose almost all drivability and comfort in exchange for track performance.

Which again comes back around to my conclusion - they aren't reasonably comparable overall, and the "winner" is based purely on what combination of metrics you choose to look at.