69 Camaro Project - Dead Pool

[Matt@BOS]

Originally Posted by Ron in SoCal

Same as you Matt, 7/8" fr and rr. I followed Cris' reccomendation on this - and I'm pretty sure this is the correct starting point - but this triple stuff is new to me...

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I think you should drive my car. Come to cars and coffee tomorrow morning. I'm serious.

Dual 7/8" master cylinders feel completely different than a tandem bore 7/8" master cylinder. It makes the latter setup feel like spongy power brakes. The Pozzis thought my brakes just flat out didn't work when they drove my car at Del Mar. Fran at RCR specs out 3/4" fr and 7/8" rr for his GT40s. Campell Auto Restoration prefers the same for most of their builds, which is what Kevin spent a while chatting with me about at last years Grand National Roadster Show.

If you think about it, the 3/4" will have a longer stroke with less resistance, whereas the 7/8" will will be firmer and move the same amount of fluid with less stroke. On these setups you'll be able to use the balance bar to adjust bias. I'm guessing you'll want to roll the bar fairly heavily towards the front... Damn this is to hard for me to explain right now. I need to just show you some time lol.

Matt

[Ron in SoCal]

Matt you're probably right...but I have a few thoughts on this. First is master bore size is one of those dial in things. If the first one doesn't give me the pedal feel I'll up or downsize. Secondly, master sizing is a function of fluid requirements for pistion bore size (sq area). On the Baer's a 15/16 or 1" is reccomended. C6Z's reqiuire 7/8" according to Tobin; I'm not sure what the prefect size is for your Wilwoods. Smaller bore moves more fluid and has more pedal travel in theory. Either way, balance bar goes way up front as you said.

So the goal is not to have a spongy pedal. I'm also going to call Baer on Monday and seek Rick's input.

I'd love to hear other's thoughts on this as well

[214Chevy]

Geesh Ron, I'm glad I got a street car only so I don't have to figure out all that crap out. You racer/track guys are on another level.

[Jr]

[QUOTE=Gonzo;382696]Marty- We tore it apart & sold it for parts! Got a LS7 for sale!






Do you have any pictures that show the distance between the side of the ls head and the frame rail? I'm curious about the how little room there is for exhaust clearance.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by 509Chevelle

Geesh Ron, I'm glad I got street car only so I don't have to figure out all that crap out. You racer/track guys are on another level.

He's really just making it more complicated than it really truly is...

Bigger bore - less pressure - more pedal and more effort is required for the same stopping power...

Smaller bore - more pressure per effort - more pedal modulation.

More SMALL pistons in these "multi piston brakes" do not always equal more MC because - like motors - 5 liters is still 5 liters - 12 cylinders or 6...

Pedal RATIO is important - for brake pedal TRAVEL -- and the multiplier of effort. 7:1 ratio will travel MORE and produce more pressure per effort than will a 6:1 pedal.

It ain't rocket science. The other #2 thing people forget about or make poor choices about is what pad they choose --- because a super hard race/autocross pad will feel crappy on the street regardless of all of the above.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Ron in SoCal

Same as you Matt, 7/8" fr and rr. I followed Cris' reccomendation on this - and I'm pretty sure this is the correct starting point - but this triple stuff is new to me...

You'd better hope that one of the masters hanging there is for your CLUTCH numb nuts.....

[syborg tt]

Just ask Kenny. He has trying to make the better softer in the 57 for about 8 weeks. He gone up, down andeven changed the pedal ratio in both directions. He thinks he finally has it figured out. So no clue how it ended up but we think it done.

[Cris@JCG]

Thank you Greg! you are good for something on this forum

Another thing that needs to be taken into consideration is mounting of pedals & calipers.. The stronger the mount.. The less defelection you will get & the firmer your pedal will feel..

Ron will get me the bore diameter on the calipers & we will do a calculation of what will get us in the ball park.. It is always different from our calculation due to how you want pedal feel..

Originally Posted by GregWeld

He's really just making it more complicated than it really truly is...

Bigger bore - less pressure - more pedal and more effort is required for the same stopping power...

Smaller bore - more pressure per effort - more pedal modulation.

More SMALL pistons in these "multi piston brakes" do not always equal more MC because - like motors - 5 liters is still 5 liters - 12 cylinders or 6...

Pedal RATIO is important - for brake pedal TRAVEL -- and the multiplier of effort. 7:1 ratio will travel MORE and produce more pressure per effort than will a 6:1 pedal.

It ain't rocket science. The other #2 thing people forget about or make poor choices about is what pad they choose --- because a super hard race/autocross pad will feel crappy on the street regardless of all of the above.

[Cris@JCG]

We will have that when we tack the headers up...

[QUOTE=DJW32;383310]

Originally Posted by Gonzo

Marty- We tore it apart & sold it for parts! Got a LS7 for sale!






Do you have any pictures that show the distance between the side of the ls head and the frame rail? I'm curious about the how little room there is for exhaust clearance.

[Cris@JCG]

Lately we have been having a few LS7 with the dry sump systems on them.. One thing that was a pain on the oil pan plumbing was fittings that were big & the angles were taking it into the header.. I think this will help out with that.. Made our own oil pan block that sits it on top with a 30 degree angle.. Ordering fittings on Monday so the we can make a -12 fitting extender to take the hoses on a 90 degree..